No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Vapor, Liquid or Cooling Management. Flutes, plates, etc.

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Heavy
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Post by Heavy »

Twisted Brick wrote: Sat Dec 24, 2022 7:06 pm StillerBoy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 8:44 pm

As to scorching that is not due to the element, but due to not taking the time to clear a wash/mash properly.. never had to reduce power on any of my wash/mash.. why.. cause the time was taken to clear them properly..

Ditto. A slow warm up on properly cleared washes breaks any residual proteins and builds congeners, reducing not only a scorch but a puke.
I'll look into clearing the wash, is it like wine making where the particulates precipitate to the bottom when it runs to dry? Or is there a commonly used clearing agent? I never used one but they have them for wine/mead. I think I've read the sugar wash I'll start with should be low on particulate relative to grain and more complex flavor recipes. Currently I am planning to do Wineos Plain Ol' Sugar Wash: viewtopic.php?t=6782
StillerBoy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 8:44 pm

This hobby is not about speed.. for those who are new or have forgotten.. it about making a fine quality product.. and that is not done by speeding/rushing the process
Twisted Brick wrote: Sat Dec 24, 2022 7:06 pm True words. Like Deplorable says, taking time now translates to a noticeably elevated product later...
I'll aim for the middle temperature bowl of porridge for sure. Ok I was reading Wikipedia trying to make my three bears reference better and I found this:

"Goldilocks and the Three Bears" (originally titled "The Story of the Three Bears") is a 19th-century English fairy tale of which three versions exist. The original version of the tale tells of an obscene old woman who enters the forest home of three bachelor bears while they are away. She eats some of their porridge, sits down on one of their chairs and breaks it, and sleeps in one of their beds. When the bears return and discover her, she wakes up, jumps out of the window, and is never seen again.

"Obscene Old Woman" ...lol! The original version is usually the best.

I agree @StillerBoy, I like extra good stuff generally, and I'm looking for to figure out the acceptable range of speeds for what I'm working with. A little bit of experience will go a long way to helping me understand everything.
Last edited by Heavy on Sun Dec 25, 2022 1:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Salt Must Flow wrote: Sat Dec 24, 2022 7:10 pm If you want to keep it simple, one of these basic SSVR (solid state variable relay) controllers are hard to beat. You could even upgrade the enclosure and/or add a digital Volt, Amp, Watt meter.

The Auber DSPR400 with a 40A SSR, an RTD Sensor and panel mount connector is Auber's deluxe controller that does everything and more. There are a few other cheap bells & whistles that can be easily added for convenience. This is by far the best controller I've ever used. So much so that I made a 2nd one.
That's a pretty good sales pitch there! AuberIns sales page make the DSPR400 sound fancy as well. I saw a thread on another forum where it was also recommended by experienced members, and mods. Price isn't bad either. That'll be the power controller plan.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Heavy wrote: Sat Dec 24, 2022 10:21 pm
Salt Must Flow wrote: Sat Dec 24, 2022 7:10 pm If you want to keep it simple, one of these basic SSVR (solid state variable relay) controllers are hard to beat. You could even upgrade the enclosure and/or add a digital Volt, Amp, Watt meter.

The Auber DSPR400 with a 40A SSR, an RTD Sensor and panel mount connector is Auber's deluxe controller that does everything and more. There are a few other cheap bells & whistles that can be easily added for convenience. This is by far the best controller I've ever used. So much so that I made a 2nd one.
That's a pretty good sales pitch there! AuberIns sales page make the DSPR400 sound fancy as well. I saw a thread on another forum where it was also recommended by experienced members, and mods. Price isn't bad either. That'll be the power controller plan.
In all honesty the individual parts don't seem to be all that expensive at first, but once you make a complete list, the costs add up quick, but I think it's well worth every penny. The controller, an enclosure, 40A SSR, heatsink, wire, RTD sensor, RTD panel connector, switches, fan & power supply, 240V power cable, 240V plugs, etc... I like to use a power indicator light so it illuminates when power is sent to the element. One of those flashing alarm/buzzers are a nice addition along with an alarm kill switch. It adds up, but makes for a deluxe controller. It functions as a variable power controller as well as a PID controller. It has multiple alarm functions, smart functions and others that I many never use. When I made my most recent controller I tried purchasing one of their less expensive units, tried it and had to return it. It just didn't function at all like the DSPR400.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Post by Ben »

dspr400 also makes a good hot liquor tank controller (you use your pot from the still for the HLT) when you are ready to pursue all grain. Makes hitting strike temps a breeze.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Double post
Last edited by Heavy on Mon Dec 26, 2022 8:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Salt Must Flow wrote: Sun Dec 25, 2022 8:26 am In all honesty the individual parts don't seem to be all that expensive at first, but once you make a complete list, the costs add up quick, but I think it's well worth every penny. The controller, an enclosure, 40A SSR, heatsink, wire, RTD sensor, RTD panel connector, switches, fan & power supply, 240V power cable, 240V plugs, etc... I like to use a power indicator light so it illuminates when power is sent to the element. One of those flashing alarm/buzzers are a nice addition along with an alarm kill switch. It adds up, but makes for a deluxe controller. It functions as a variable power controller as well as a PID controller. It has multiple alarm functions, smart functions and others that I many never use. When I made my most recent controller I tried purchasing one of their less expensive units, tried it and had to return it. It just didn't function at all like the DSPR400.
I'll steal that shopping list! Thanks! That all sounds good. The dspr400 seems like it has enough bells and whistles to keep me busy for a bit!
Ben wrote: Sun Dec 25, 2022 9:16 am dspr400 also makes a good hot liquor tank controller (you use your pot from the still for the HLT) when you are ready to pursue all grain. Makes hitting strike temps a breeze.
That sounds efficient, I like that! I have a 50lb bag of corn my buddy gave me when he brought over the still parts he had. After a couple sugar wash runs I'll aim to figure that out.

Here's this wattage song that's been stuck in my head. I remembered it as 10,000 watts but it's actually only "1000 watts pure power":
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Post by Salt Must Flow »

I also get 1' of this RTD sensor wire to solder to the panel connector and attach to the Auber unit. I've been told that's the correct wire to use, but I've also been told that you don't need that special type of wire. I don't know which is true, but I always use that wire, it's only $1 and it works. I also add a tube of this thermal grease/paste to apply between the SSR and the heatsink. I can't think of any more little tid bits right now.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Salt Must Flow wrote: Sun Dec 25, 2022 11:18 am I also get 1' of this RTD sensor wire to solder to the panel connector and attach to the Auber unit. I've been told that's the correct wire to use, but I've also been told that you don't need that special type of wire. I don't know which is true, but I always use that wire, it's only $1 and it works. I also add a tube of this thermal grease/paste to apply between the SSR and the heatsink. I can't think of any more little tid bits right now.
Awesome, thank you for the additional tips! Happy holidays!

Tough to argue with the one dollar price tag. And thermal grease is cheap and useful too, more fun with thermodynamics!

I appreciate all the advice you are giving me, thank you!

Same to everybody else that has posted, thank you all!
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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I keep getting pulled to other things but I think I'm going to do my vinegar run later today. I wanted to write out my plan for that and make sure I'm doing a reasonable job of getting the keg clean before I put in wash. I'm not really sure exactly how much cleaning I need. Overall plan is to do vinegar run, water/steam run, sacrificial run with a sugar wash. Is that enough, too much, or not enough cleaning? (I want to be the metaphorical obscene old lady mentioned earlier)

Vinegar run I am planning to fill the 15.5 gallon keg with 10 gallons of 50/50, White vinegar/tap water. Run 5-7 gallons of that through the condenser. Let it cool and empty everything to get ready for the water run.

That all sounds reasonable?
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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You'll be fine to just rinse it really well, do your vinegar and water run, let the steam exit the condenser for a while before you turn on the cooling water.
After you've satisfied yourself it's run long enough to get vinegar into all the little nooks and crannies, shut it down, let it cool and dump it. Then do your sacrificial run for the stilling gods, and you'll be G2G
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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I re-soldered the ferrule for the heating element, that left a bit of a mess that I'll clean up later. Added some wire when I did, whole process went quick and easy.
IMG_20230101_132327(1).jpg
Doing the vinegar run. Got water setup and am using the 1650watt element. It's going slow.
IMG_20230101_132235 copy.jpg
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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You'll need to rotate that takeoff tube to the 'bottom' of the collector to minimize pooling (smearing). A concentric reducer is best.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Just started to trickle, what temperature does vinegar turn to vapor at. The temp gauge that came with the top elbow is reading 199-200f now that it's pushing vapor through to the condenser, that about right?

Twisted that take off tube around too! Thanks!
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Is it an optical illusion or is that riser listing to the right in the picture?
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Awfully lot of weight dangling off the side there whatever the case......hoses,water,shotgun.......I'd be putting some kind of brace or support on/under it.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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I can prod quite hard, it wants to stay where it is. It'd take an angry shove to topple it. I'll buy a new table soon though, you're correct, no optical illusion. It's only like 3-4 degrees off center, I think the phone makes it look worse. The condenser is angled a bit to at the top that adds to the look.

I've been meaning to look for advice on what to build as a stand for a keg with a bottom drain, top drain upside-down, any good ideas to look at?
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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My god Heavy , thats the most convoluted cooling hose setup I’ve ever seen . :shock:

LOL I can see what you were trying to do . Looks like what I’d end up with if I went to Bunnings looking for specific fittings.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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I went to Menards, bought two lengths of hose, ended up using neither. All that either came with it or was extra bits I already had. I need to get some 8x5mm air hose to match the fittings that came with it. The deflalligator (on phone) seems to be doing all the work, frosty except for the first two inches.

Dephlegmator!?!

I've got the boiler and column swaddled in towels now too
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Collected about one gallons of vinegar at this point, aiming to run about three or four more?
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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If youve collected a gallon, you're fine. By now its gotten into all the nooks and crannies.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Cool! Thanks!
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Post by Heavy »

Does the same apply for the sacrificial run? Does it work to partly charge the still with wash and condense a gallon then call it done?
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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I ran a 2/3 charge for sac run, collected two gallons. Got first run done as well after. It seems to work well, if a bit slow on 1650w. I need to get a refractometer or a hydrometer to know ABV. I'm thinking put off the nice controller for a bit but build a contactor box to have an easy on off for 240v, then try it with the 5500w.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Post by shadylane »

Insulate the boiler and it will run faster on 1650w
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Post by Heavy »

That's definitely a good tip, I've been wrapping it and the lower column in old towels to insulate it since the vinegar run. Those rolls of 1/8 inch thick silver insulation I've seen some people use might do a way better job though, not sure the rating on my towel pile but it at least traps some heat. What are good materials/products to use for insulation?
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Post by shadylane »

I use the "1/8 inch thick silver insulation" :lol:
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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shadylane wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 4:00 pm I use the "1/8 inch thick silver insulation" :lol:
For best results keep an air gap "non conducting" barrier between layers of wraps. It's reflective but is still conductive.
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

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Heavy wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 10:23 am I've been wrapping it and the lower column in old towels to insulate it since the vinegar run. …….What are good materials/products to use for insulation?
Hee hee , I’ve had mine wrapped in scanky old towels for over ten years now Heavy . Not seen any need to upgrade .
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Post by shadylane »

I've been known to take my coat off and put it on the still, it works pretty good for insulation.
It also gets the coat how enough to kill any ticks, fleas or other critters.

Probably wouldn't be a good idea with synthetic material. :lol:
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Re: No experience distilling, wanting to do first build

Post by Ben »

shadylane wrote: Sat Feb 04, 2023 12:52 am I've been known to take my coat off and put it on the still, it works pretty good for insulation.
It also gets the coat how enough to kill any ticks, fleas or other critters.

Probably wouldn't be a good idea with synthetic material. :lol:
I do the same thing, flannel shirt fits a keg pretty good!
:)
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