My modular flute build

Vapor, Liquid or Cooling Management. Flutes, plates, etc.

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Re: My modular flute build

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Just_Doug wrote: Wed Dec 07, 2022 1:22 pm
Yummyrum wrote: Wed Dec 07, 2022 12:27 pm Nice work prattman .
The different diameter tubes in the Deflag have got me thinking .
Theoretically , the vapour speed will be higher in the smaller tubes than the larger ones . It could be that vapour passes through these tubes before the larger ones . Not sure what or if anything that will have to do with how it runs . But it just got the cogs turning .
I do believe the vapor speed will be the same through all the tubes. Speed would be determined by the total volume of vapor and the total cross section of area that it had to pass through.

Think of it this way if you had vapor traveling at speed x through a 2" pipe, then changed that out to 6 pipes of different sizes with the same cross section as the 2" pipe the overall area and speed should be the same. I now this doesn't take things like surface tension into account.

D.
Doh , you’re right Doug . Silly me not had enough coffee .

Sorry for OT , as you were prattman .
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Re: My modular flute build

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:clap:
Thanks again guys
Honestly all your interest has given me a bug. I’m soldering my 4” ferrules on now! My wife is a bit upset, but aren’t they all :mrgreen:
My peach panty dropper is almost ready, so that should loosen her mood :wink:
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Re: My modular flute build

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4 4” sections done. Wow… that was a lot of soldering
Aaaaaaand I still need to put some sight glasses on! Just waiting for some boxes in the mail. Should be toward the end of the month
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Re: My modular flute build

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Your soldering skills have improved somewhat :lol:
A great example of what can be achieved if you just get off your arse and have a go......there is no still design you can't build now. :thumbup:
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Re: My modular flute build

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Prattman, I'm jealous of your build skills given that this is your first effort. I'm looking forward to seeing the finished product.

One question ... on what size boiler are you planning to mount this column ? A 4" is going to want to fed a lot of alcohol to run well.
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Re: My modular flute build

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greggn wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 6:02 am Prattman, I'm jealous of your build skills given that this is your first effort. I'm looking forward to seeing the finished product.

One question ... on what size boiler are you planning to mount this column ? A 4" is going to want to fed a lot of alcohol to run well.

Thank you! I’ve done lots of reading and videos and I am lucky enough to be a commercial electrician who works with plumbers and they’ve given me great advice on the large pipes and other soldering tips. I’ve actually gotten 100% of the copper for this build for free :shh:

I laid my hands on a 15 gallon beer keg a few months ago from a retired bar owner. I have never welded anything before so I am taking a class on welding so I can modify the keg to have a 6” opening and a ferrule for an element. Maybe a sight glass/fill port, a drain and some legs to make it sturdy. I know I could source the welding work. But it just gives me an excuse to learn something new
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Re: My modular flute build

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Been thinking about my sight glass placement in the sections. Is there any reason I shouldn’t be center? Or should I shoot for maybe the lower 1/3 ?
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Re: My modular flute build

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That will depend on where your plates are sitting imo.
Ive always placed them 1/8-1/4 inch above the plate level.......you want to be able to see easily what is happening on the plate, size of bubbles, depth of liquid on plate, fogging of glass..... all will tell you things.....no good putting the window where you cant see whats going on.
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Re: My modular flute build

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Agree with you salty for perf plates but more like 1/2" to 3/4" for caps. Don't want the bubbles out of site.
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Re: My modular flute build

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Hmm. So I’ll have to put them pretty low. I’ll temp it in before I drill my holes for my sight glass and see.
I plan to have the kind of plate that sits inside my ptfe gasket in between the ferrules.
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Re: My modular flute build

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If it helps , my 4” modules are 4” high .
I stuck my 2” sight glasses smack bang in the middle .
I have perforated plates and my weir height is 3/4” .

So the bottom of my sightglass is 1/4” above weir height.
I can see everything I need to see . Plates loading , normal plate behaviour . Onset of flooding when pushed .

With 2” windows in a 4” plated column , I don’t think you could go too far wrong where you put it .
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Re: My modular flute build

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For what its worth, just to add to the confusion.
Yummy got me thinking and wondering , been to the shed to try to take photos.
For various reasons that didn't work out, but I did double check how I did the windows on the 6 incher.
The bottom of the window sits at approximately half of the height of the downcommer, this means that when in operation the level of the liquid on the plate is above the bottom of the window. This in turn allows you to see what is happening below the surface of the liquid / spirit as well as whats doing above.
I'm not about to go dragging my 4 incher out of its hiding place at the moment to check, but I believe I set it up in a similar fashion.
Is it the end of the world if the windows are higher or lower ?.........Im not sure ........all that I know is that I like mine the way that they are.
Windows on bubblers are a bit like fish bowls .....you can waste an awful lot of time staring at them.
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Re: My modular flute build

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4 day holiday weekend and I got my sight glasses and my 2-4” reducer in the mail today! Hope to get some work done on this project
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Re: My modular flute build

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Nice prattman .

Copper beats tinsel any day :ebiggrin:
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Re: My modular flute build

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Working on sight glass #1
Thank you for the suggestions to trim it down.
Not a perfect fit, but I still think I may try to put it on the surface and drill a hole after it’s soldered on
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Re: My modular flute build

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I don't think the different tube sizes in the long run are going to make a scrap of difference.
I do think that your idea of chasing tempratures is gonna cause you grief trying to run that thing.......what people said ten years ago and what's been learned since are two different stories .....the hobby evolves.
In saying that ,I have the utmost respect for old dogs findings and his builds......he was the father of the hobby scale plated column.
What I've found from experience and that of others, is to start in full reflux....give things a miniute or two for all the plates to get fully loaded.
Now is the time to adjust heat input....decide if you have to much or not enough....look at the plates ....are they happily bubbling?......flooding?...or maybe one is still dry....you might need more heat.
Once you are happy with that it's much easier to just fiddle with the needle valve which controls water flow to the defleg until you have product dripping slowly from the business end of the still......take off fores.....go a fast drip/ broken stream for heads.
Once that's done adjust water flow so that product is leaving the still somewhere between 2 and 2.5 LPH........that equates to 400ml every 12 minutes..........with 4 plates it should be producing somewhere between 92% -88% depending how late in the run.
You can stare at thermometers till ya blue in the face but it's easier to go by product flow ,taste and smell imo.
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Re: My modular flute build

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Saltbush Bill wrote: Fri Dec 23, 2022 11:32 pm I don't think the different tube sizes in the long run are going to make a scrap of difference.
I do think that your idea of chasing tempratures is gonna cause you grief trying to run that thing.......what people said ten years ago and what's been learned since are two different stories .....the hobby evolves.
In saying that ,I have the utmost respect for old dogs findings and his builds......he was the father of hobby scale plated column.
What I've found from experience and that of others, is to start in full reflux....give things a miniute or two for all the plates to get fully load.
Now is the time to adjust heat input....decide if you have to much or not enough....look at the plate.....are they happily bubbling?......flooding?...or maybe one is still dry....you might need more heat.
Once you are happy with that it's much easier to just fiddle with the needle valve which controls water flow to the defleg until you have product dripping slowly from the business end of the still......take off fores.....go a fast drip/ broken stream for heads.
Once that's done adjust water flow so that product is leaving the still somewhere between 2 and 2.5 LPH........that equates to 400ml every 12 minutes..........with 4 plates it should be producing somewhere between 92% -88% depending how late in the run.
You can stare at thermometers till ya blue in the face but easier to go by product flow imo.


I think you’re totally right, since I quoted that the other day, I’ve been looking at other threads and quite a few other peoples way of running a plated column, and flute temp gauges are a thing of the past. I’ll just have to learn to drive this thing a different way!
If I had another 90, I’d throw that one in instead
Thank you for your advice. It’s more than welcome, I don’t know what I don’t know
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Re: My modular flute build

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Made all the sight glasses! Pretty good fit on them all, and I think I’ve got them as close to the column as I can, just need to try and solder them up. Hopefully next weekend bc I’m going to the coast for my birthday with my wife and kids tomorrow
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Re: My modular flute build

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For Christmas, someone stalked my browser history and got me these caps. Very thoughtful, although I still will probably make my own perf plates bc I think that’s what I’d prefer and also making all of my own part seems like the right thing for this build eventually anyway.
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Re: My modular flute build

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Coming along nicely, :clap: well done mate.
You might love those bubble plates after you drill a thousand holes for your perf plates
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Re: My modular flute build

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Sporacle wrote: Fri Dec 30, 2022 1:15 am Coming along nicely, :clap: well done mate.
You might love those bubble plates after you drill a thousand holes for your perf plates
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Re: My modular flute build

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Sporacle wrote: Fri Dec 30, 2022 1:15 am You might love those bubble plates after you drill a thousand holes for your perf plates
I’ve often wondered why I don’t see people using perforated stainless sheet for their perf plates. It seems like it would be a lot less work.

FengYoo Perforated Metal Sheets-Expanded & Perforated Sheets-Perforated Stainless Steel Sheet-20GA 0.06 Inch Hole (About 1.5mm)11.8 Inch X5.9 Inch-Metal Mesh Sheet for Ventilation and Fume Filtration https://a.co/d/dfmH6J9
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Re: My modular flute build

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Steve , the open area of that mesh is too much . If you filled in maybe 5 out of 6 holes , it might work . ….. but that seems like mire work
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Re: My modular flute build

Post by Saltbush Bill »

I see other problems beside the hole spacing and sizes.
My guess is that it would be a pain to drill down comer holes in.
And as above you'd need to fill other areas.......just easier to start from scratch.
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Re: My modular flute build

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Steve Broady wrote: Sat Dec 31, 2022 9:37 am I’ve often wondered why I don’t see people using perforated stainless sheet for their perf plates. It seems like it would be a lot less work.
Don't mean to derail your thread Prattman, but we are on a plate discussion.
Steve, I would have used those plates if the two guys above had used them.
Given the length of time it takes to build a Flute everything I've done or used has been tried before, in terms of dimensions, spacings and materials.
I'm not going to experiment with the core base of what makes the still work.
I am going to do a few things with the cups on my downcomers and will do something different with the head of my build.
Those plates may work and that would be cool, if they didn't work it's a lot of work the way my still is being built to replace them

Plus drilling holes is like penance to the brewing gods
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Re: My modular flute build

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Derail away haha

“Penance to the brewing gods” love that

Cutting perfect circles with pre perforated sheets seems like a hassle, plus it’s not copper :twisted:
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Re: My modular flute build

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:thumbup: +1 it's not copper
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Re: My modular flute build

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Sporacle wrote: Sat Dec 31, 2022 9:40 pm :thumbup: +1 it's not copper
I’d rather drill 200 holes in copper rather than Stainless any day .Good thing Copper’s a better material for plates .
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Re: My modular flute build

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Yummyrum wrote: Sat Dec 31, 2022 11:50 pm
Sporacle wrote: Sat Dec 31, 2022 9:40 pm :thumbup: +1 it's not copper
I’d rather drill 200 holes in copper rather than Stainless any day .Good thing Copper’s a better material for plates .
That is true. Another is that Old Dog's original had far less holes, but much bigger. I understand that smaller holes have more even vapour penetration in the liquid but when I did my perfs, I just could not see that my tools would do1mm holes and went with 2mm holes but less.
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Re: My modular flute build

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Doing well mate, can see the excitment in your words. youve got the build bug! nice to see someone having ago. good luck.
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