Best Stripping run so far

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sadie33
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Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

I did my 3rd stripping run of my sweet feed mash. It was the best! It's amazing how much better each run is. (imagine that, more knowledge and experience actually works :wink: )

My order came in today just in time! I got my PTFE expanded tape and put that on my lid, fit like a glove and no leaks! (not that my lid leaked before). I also got my alcohol refractometer which is an awesome tool! I LOVE that thing!

I moved around my condenser so the hoses were in a better position and it was easier to control the water in and out. (It didn't want to overflow as often). No vapors came out this time. My first 4 cups were crystal clear, then it got a little cloudy and the last 2 or 3 cups were crystal clear.

I took a reading of my first stripping run, which was 33% and my second stripping run was 47%. I collected today until it went down to 25% then shut it off. The average of my 3rd stripping run is 45%.

My problem is that from all 3 runs I have 2 cups shy of 2 gals. I'm not sure that's enough for a spirit run. (5 gal pot that can only hold 3.5 gal) I still have my backset in my boiler. I was thinking I could start it up again tomorrow and collect down to 10% maybe? That would give me about 2 gal. maybe a little more.

Is that a bad idea?
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

oh, and if I combine all 3 batches I think that adds up to 41% and I know I don't want to go over 40%. That was another reason I was thinking of running it again and go as low as 10%.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by jonnys_spirit »

You can strip lower. Until the average low wines abv is 25-30%. And on a spirit run you can fill the boiler more than a strip run because it’s not going to foam. Top the spirit run up with fresh sweet feed wash if you like and feints cut from last spirit run.

Cheers!
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by Steve Broady »

I strip until I’m reading between 0-5% at the spout, at least for anything flavored. I figure I might as well get all the alcohol and flavor I can, and I want the proof lower anyway.

Since your still is heated on the stove top, there’s almost no limit to how small a charge you can put in it. I have the 8 gallon version, and frequently run about 2 gallons of wash for a spirit run. Even if you get all the alcohol out of the wash, you’ll leave plenty of water behind so there’s no risk of running it dry. People who have internal heating elements have to make sure they keep enough in the pot to keep the elements submerged, but we don’t have that concern.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by Deplorable »

Good advice above. For flavored spirits, strip until the ABV coming off the spout is about 5%, and your collection pot should be at about 30% ABV.
If you charge that still with 4 gallons of low wines at 30%, you'll have 1.2 gallons of theoretical alcohol. Your keep of hearts should be around a gallon once you cut it back down to around 60% for aging. Less if you cut it tight for sipping white.
You should do well with 24 pint jars for your spirit run. Run slow on the spirit run and collect in 2 to 300 ml samples.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by elbono »

I strip until there's little alcohol left in the pot. If what is coming out is 10% the stuff in the boiler is less than 2%.

It won't hurt and may help to dilute your low wines for the spirit run.

I worried about boiling dry until it registered that I always had to empty the boiler. As long as what you collect is less than what you started with you're good.

If you haven't seen it yet here's some more science to digest:
download/file.php?id=78272&mode=view
Red line is vapor, blue line is liquid, that's where the 10% and 2% above come from.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

Top the spirit run up with fresh sweet feed wash if you like and feints cut from last spirit run.

Cheers!
-j
[/quote]

that would be nice, but I've never done a spirit run. These are my very first stripping runs. :esurprised:

I think I will squeeze a bit more out of this batch and do my first spirit run tomorrow. :clap: If we don't loose power. Me might get 10" of snow tonight. :roll:

It will be great when I do just have a bunch of feints "lying around".
I remember my first "scrap" quilt I made. I had no scraps so I had to buy a bunch of fabrics. :lol: Now I have enough scraps to make 100 quilts! (not really).
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

Steve Broady wrote: Wed Jan 25, 2023 5:17 pm I strip until I’m reading between 0-5% at the spout, at least for anything flavored. I figure I might as well get all the alcohol and flavor I can, and I want the proof lower anyway.

Since your still is heated on the stove top, there’s almost no limit to how small a charge you can put in it. I have the 8 gallon version, and frequently run about 2 gallons of wash for a spirit run. Even if you get all the alcohol out of the wash, you’ll leave plenty of water behind so there’s no risk of running it dry. People who have internal heating elements have to make sure they keep enough in the pot to keep the elements submerged, but we don’t have that concern.
I keep forgetting that I do have more wiggle room without the elements. I like that. I don't think I am going to do the internal elements when I build my 8 gal. (which won't be for a while, but I'm planning now.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

Deplorable wrote: Wed Jan 25, 2023 6:06 pm Good advice above. For flavored spirits, strip until the ABV coming off the spout is about 5%, and your collection pot should be at about 30% ABV.
If you charge that still with 4 gallons of low wines at 30%, you'll have 1.2 gallons of theoretical alcohol. Your keep of hearts should be around a gallon once you cut it back down to around 60% for aging. Less if you cut it tight for sipping white.
You should do well with 24 pint jars for your spirit run. Run slow on the spirit run and collect in 2 to 300 ml samples.
If I understand you correctly I should collect until they are 5%. Then when everything is added together I want that total to be 30% for the charge, right?

I was planning on 20 pint jars, but I was thinking of having 25 just in case. (better to have too many then running around looking for more).

I think I read somewhere that I need to toss the first 200 ml for fore shots on spirit run? Is that correct? I know for a 5 gal run it's like 50 ml on a stripping run, but I've been tossing 60 ml.

I'm so nervous and excited. After all this work I don't want to mess it.

thanks
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by NZChris »

sadie33 wrote: Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:47 pm If I understand you correctly I should collect until they are 5%. Then when everything is added together I want that total to be 30% for the charge, right?
Ignore ABV at the spout.

For many products I make, I decide what low Wines ABV to aim for, remove a foreshot of around 150ml per 6 gallon bucket of wash, then strip until until I have my target ABV in the receiver.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by bilgriss »

Either approach will work fine (stripping until you hit target like NZChris vs stripping until ABV at the spout is around 5%) and you'll end up in the same place, so it's a matter of your equipment and convenience. In the abstract, in a stripping run you are trying to capture everything you can, flavor-wise, while leaving water behind. The resulting low wines are stable and will wait for you to do a spirit run when you collect enough.

By stripping a 5 gallon batch down to a lower ABV target, you can eliminate the need to water down the low wines, which somewhat reduces flavor in the spirit run. I would typically get in the neighborhood of 1.5 gallons from a 5 gallon wash, and three stripping runs should then get you more than 4 gallons, which will fill your pot. You can do another batch still, or add some clean water and distill what you have. If your still has an electric element inside, you want to make sure it has enough fluid that it will stay submerged after the full volume is distilled. Assuming you remove half the volume, you'd need to make sure that 1 gallon left your element below the water. Otherwise you need more to be safe. If you are using propane, you can run it as is, if you wish, as it won't run dry, but dilute to under 40% for the sake of safety.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by Steve Broady »

Just a little reminder, you don’t HAVE to collect multiple strips for a spirit run. Again, because you have a stove top still, you’re free to run very low volumes. In my case, I found that a large spirit run would take me 10-12 hours that I simply don’t have more than a handful of times a year. I now process a single 5 gallon ferment from start to finish as one batch, from fermentation to strip to spirit run. It means the cuts are smaller and easier to miss, but it also means I can finish both a stripping run and a spirit run in about the same time, roughly 4 hours for each.

As with everything, find a way that works for you. If you end up with a product you like, then you’ve done well.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

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Steve Broady wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 5:08 am Just a little reminder, you don’t HAVE to collect multiple strips for a spirit run. Again, because you have a stove top still, you’re free to run very low volumes. In my case, I found that a large spirit run would take me 10-12 hours that I simply don’t have more than a handful of times a year. I now process a single 5 gallon ferment from start to finish as one batch, from fermentation to strip to spirit run. It means the cuts are smaller and easier to miss, but it also means I can finish both a stripping run and a spirit run in about the same time, roughly 4 hours for each.

As with everything, find a way that works for you. If you end up with a product you like, then you’ve done well.
I also do the same technique. 5 gallon from start to finish. If I was to collect low wines from 3 different strip runs,then do a spirit run with all 3 (obviously the same recipe)would the taste be different or just make the cuts easier?
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

Steve Broady wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 5:08 am Just a little reminder, you don’t HAVE to collect multiple strips for a spirit run. Again, because you have a stove top still, you’re free to run very low volumes. In my case, I found that a large spirit run would take me 10-12 hours that I simply don’t have more than a handful of times a year. I now process a single 5 gallon ferment from start to finish as one batch, from fermentation to strip to spirit run. It means the cuts are smaller and easier to miss, but it also means I can finish both a stripping run and a spirit run in about the same time, roughly 4 hours for each.

As with everything, find a way that works for you. If you end up with a product you like, then you’ve done well.
hmmmm I hadn't thought about doing it that way. Maybe I will do that with the UJSSM I am fermenting now. It's my first batch. when thats done, I could strip it and run it while I am waiting for the 2nd generation to ferment. I like this idea. Will go much quicker.

I might NOT squeeze what I can out of my back set. Maybe just go with what I got. I'm not going to be able to start as early as I wanted. (we did get 8" of snow) we have a really long drive way that circles around in front of our house. Not to mention the path the barn. My husband uses the tractor and I use the skid steer, but it still takes us quite a while.

thanks
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by Deplorable »

NZChris wrote: Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:27 pm
sadie33 wrote: Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:47 pm If I understand you correctly I should collect until they are 5%. Then when everything is added together I want that total to be 30% for the charge, right?
Ignore ABV at the spout.

For many products I make, I decide what low Wines ABV to aim for, remove a foreshot of around 150ml per 6 gallon bucket of wash, then strip until until I have my target ABV in the receiver.
Either way you measure, you will end up at ~30%. If I float an alcometer in the collection vessel, and run down to a collected abv of 30%, what's coming out of the spout is 5% abv.
How your measure is irrelevant. She's making a flavored spirit and desires to double distill it. What she needs to know is to get all the flavor and not wast good alcohol by leaving in the boiler.
If she were making neutral, it'd be a different story.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

Deplorable wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:53 am
NZChris wrote: Wed Jan 25, 2023 10:27 pm
sadie33 wrote: Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:47 pm If I understand you correctly I should collect until they are 5%. Then when everything is added together I want that total to be 30% for the charge, right?
Ignore ABV at the spout.

For many products I make, I decide what low Wines ABV to aim for, remove a foreshot of around 150ml per 6 gallon bucket of wash, then strip until until I have my target ABV in the receiver.
Either way you measure, you will end up at ~30%. If I float an alcometer in the collection vessel, and run down to a collected abv of 30%, what's coming out of the spout is 5% abv.
How your measure is irrelevant. She's making a flavored spirit and desires to double distill it. What she needs to know is to get all the flavor and not wast good alcohol by leaving in the boiler.
If she were making neutral, it'd be a different story.
I had JUST gotten my alcohol refractometer and just wanted to "play" with it. I was curious what it came out at first. I wanted to know how quickly the % went down. I tested about every cup and made logs. It was fun and informative. For what I don't know yet... :lolno:
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by still_stirrin »

Sadie,

You’re listening and learning. There is a bunch of good advice in this thread. I understand your nervous apprehension as you venture down the “path of firsts”. But, as long as you’re attentive when running, you’ll be fine.

Note Chris’s comment above about measuring the “collection” (average) versus the “proof at the spout”. His advice will help you when you have many runs of experience because by then you’ll understand where the flavor is and how it affects the final product.

However, with your alcohol refractometer you can measure the %ABV at any moment of the run, giving you an idea of the progress. This is beneficial for you as a new distiller, but after many runs you’ll likely not need to monitor progress as closely. Measuring the collection (with a hydrometer) will be adequate.

Also, with generational ferments like the UJSSM, stripping the beer and using a bit of the run’s backset to restart the next generation is a great way to keep the ferments rolling. However, pay attention to the pH of the subsequent generations as the acid level will tend to build up due to the addition of backset. Therefore, you’ll need to reduce the amount of backset added in subsequent generations.

Have you considered doing 1-1/2 runs, that is - when you add fresh (distiller’s) beer to the low wines for a spirit run? It makes a nice, full flavored product at a cask-entry %ABV (after cuts obviously). This method will put your product into your drinking liquor cabinet quicker.

Keep up the good work. Have fun and stay safe, responsible, and discrete.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

"Have you considered doing 1-1/2 runs, that is - when you add fresh (distiller’s) beer to the low wines for a spirit run? It makes a nice, full flavored product at a cask-entry %ABV (after cuts obviously). This method will put your product into your drinking liquor cabinet quicker."

I have read on those. I feel like where this is my first run ever, I wanted to try the 3 runs to a spirit (more practice running my still). Then I was thinking of trying the 1.5 run and see which I like better. Eventually I want to get into making rum and it seems a lot of people do that with their rum runs. wow, say that 5x fast. :crazy:

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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by NZChris »

Deplorable wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:53 am If she were making neutral, it'd be a different story.
I still only check ABV in the receiver, but I'm looking for a higher target, 40%, some aim for higher and add water.

Hint; After the first strip, you can use it's finishing spout ABV or a still temperature to stop the subsequent runs and the Low Wines ABVs will be so close to the first that it's hardly worthwhile checking the receiver ABV during the runs.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by shadylane »

When doing UJ or most sugar washes.
I end the stripping run when a film of oil begins to appear on top the low-wines.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

shadylane wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 1:50 pm When doing UJ or most sugar washes.
I end the stripping run when a film of oil begins to appear on top the low-wines.
Interesting...I have read about something like this, but still don't get it. Maybe because I have not stripped a UJSSM yet, only a sweet feed.
SO much to learn, it's all so EXCITING!
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by shadylane »

In my opinion.
Stripping UJ, Sweet feed and other sugar washes are the same.
When pot-stilling, don't get greedy, leave the majority of the tails in the boiler to be drained.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by Deplorable »

NZChris wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 12:31 pm
Deplorable wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:53 am If she were making neutral, it'd be a different story.
I still only check ABV in the receiver, but I'm looking for a higher target, 40%, some aim for higher and add water.

Hint; After the first strip, you can use it's finishing spout ABV or a still temperature to stop the subsequent runs and the Low Wines ABVs will be so close to the first that it's hardly worthwhile checking the receiver ABV during the runs.
For sure. :thumbup:
On stripping runs on my still, the way I run it, the head temp is always the same when I get to 5% at the spout and 30% in the collection pot. My finished ferments are always between 8.5 and 9.5% so stripping runs are always very predictable. each charge of the boiler yields 2.5 gallons of 30% low wines. I get two stripping runs form a ferment and a 4 to 6 quarts of fresh wash to add to low wines in the boiler for the spirit run.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

I started my spirit run at 6:00 PM. I turned the power up really slowly. It started dripping at 7:00. It took about half an hour to collect 300 ml. I shut the stove off at 10:30, but I'm not done.

tomorrow when I start it all up again, do I have to collect fores again? And if I do how much do i toss?

thanks
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by NZChris »

I don't, and I don't believe that there is a good reason to.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

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NZChris wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:11 pm I don't, and I don't believe that there is a good reason to.
thank you.

Does stopping and starting it mess with my heads/ hearts and tails? Just curious. I don't plan on doing this again, but I guess sometimes it happens.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by still_stirrin »

sadie33 wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 5:44 amDoes stopping and starting it mess with my heads/ hearts and tails? Just curious. I don't plan on doing this again, but I guess sometimes it happens.
Didn’t you pull the heads when you started the run? So, for the most part those fractions are gone, right? But, you haven’t gotten to the tails yet, have you? So those are still in your boiler. It’s really that simple.

If you read the forums a while, you’ll understand these issues making your questions redundant. I don’t mean to say, “don’t ask”. Rather, that many, if not all of your questions have already been asked and answered many times. If you spend time reading, you’ll learn a lot more and in a more timely manner than asking a bunch of questions.
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by jonnys_spirit »

As the fractions become reduced they tend to smear slightly across other fractions. I like to run low and slow at every heatup in an attempt to concentrate any fores that may have smeared either to me running too hard last heatup or any other reason. It won't hurt to capture a small bit of fractions but it would be minimal if you already removed most or all... It's going to be eithger concentrated heads or fores in any case so I don't want either of those anyway... Since I know I'll do it again for the spirit run I don't worry too much about it.

Rub those first drops in your hands and smell it from the get-go and as fores passes into early heads

Cheers,
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

still_stirrin wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 6:59 am
sadie33 wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 5:44 amDoes stopping and starting it mess with my heads/ hearts and tails? Just curious. I don't plan on doing this again, but I guess sometimes it happens.
Didn’t you pull the heads when you started the run? So, for the most part those fractions are gone, right? But, you haven’t gotten to the tails yet, have you? So those are still in your boiler. It’s really that simple.

If you read the forums a while, you’ll understand these issues making your questions redundant. I don’t mean to say, “don’t ask”. Rather, that many, if not all of your questions have already been asked and answered many times. If you spend time reading, you’ll learn a lot more and in a more timely manner than asking a bunch of questions.
ss
Thank you. When you ask if I pulled heads already, the answer is yes. I also tossed my fores from my stripping run, yet I have to toss them again in my spirit run (and at a higher quantity). I just wanted to make sure it wasn't something that had to be done EVERY time.(tossing fores). I looked up starting and stopping a run and couldn't find my answer.

I am reading and taking notes. I find the site hard to navigate. I am still learning that. I read something somewhere, then can't find it again. It is very frustrating. As I read, I take notes. BUT, you don't always know what is important when you FIRST read it so I don't write it down. THEN I read something else and I'm like....oh, that WAS important, but trying to find it again takes me a while.

I am also a little nervous doing my first stripping run and I guess sometimes I just like a little assurance, maybe I shouldn't do that. I know the site discourages spoon feeding.

I am learning with each run and my confidence is building. This site and all of you are amazing and I really do appreciate your time and advice. :thumbup:
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Re: Best Stripping run so far

Post by sadie33 »

jonnys_spirit wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 7:09 am As the fractions become reduced they tend to smear slightly across other fractions. I like to run low and slow at every heatup in an attempt to concentrate any fores that may have smeared either to me running too hard last heatup or any other reason. It won't hurt to capture a small bit of fractions but it would be minimal if you already removed most or all... It's going to be eithger concentrated heads or fores in any case so I don't want either of those anyway... Since I know I'll do it again for the spirit run I don't worry too much about it.

Rub those first drops in your hands and smell it from the get-go and as fores passes into early heads

Cheers,
jonny
Thanks. I read the Uncle Jesse thing where he's like rub it your hand and feel it, taste it, burn it...It was kinda funny. So I did all that, but I didn't burn it on a spoon. I wanted to take it outside and try it, but didn't want to leave my still.

I collected way too much in each jar last night. :roll: I don't know why 300 ml stuck in my head, but that's what I collected in EVERY jar. (I got 5 last night). This morning it's running perfect. dripping slowly (3 drops per second) and I am making much smaller collections!!
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