Screwing the ferrule to the pot lid?

[October]

I bought already a 20 litre stainless still pot, I want to weld the lid. For the triclamp method, instead of buying the whole set with two 2" ferrules, is it a good idea to just buy a single 5" ferrule and screw it to the lid? This way you can unscrew it open it for cleaning, and you can also use the gasket between the pot lid and the ferrule, and you just skip the clamping. What do you think?

[Steve Broady]

I learned a long time ago that if there’s a common, standardized, supported way to do a job, it’s usually not a good idea to try to save a little money and try to find a cheaper, homemade way to do it instead. It usually ends up costing twice as much to fix, and taking twice as long as just buying the damn part in the first place.

I keep on having to learn this lesson, for some reason…

It might work. But if the only goal is to save a buck, I’d suggest just spending the money and saving yourself a lot of hassle. Your time is worth more than the money, usually.

[Salt Must Flow]

I don't recall ever seeing a 5" ferrule that screws to a lid. Can you post a link to what you're referring to?

[Yummyrum]

I’m not sure what you mean about a 5” screw on ferrule either .
But I know 5” isn’t a common size . 4” or 6” would be better options IMO . …. Much more easily obtainable

You might find it a better option to solder a 6” ferrule to the lid .You could also then solder the lid to the pot avoiding the need for gaskets and the clamps fir the lid , but still allowing easy access for cleaning if needed.

[October]

I don't recall ever seeing a 5" ferrule that screws to a lid. Can you post a link to what you're referring to?

It's something that I want to do, and I have never seen it so far. I hope you guys understand what I mean. Imagine the pot I bought, it's a normal cooking pot, to use as a boiler, it will come with a big lid, and I will weld it to the pot. Now to make a connection to the condender, normally people buy a tri clamp set, so they make a 2" hole on the pot lid (or keg) for the tri clamp set (first ferrule on the lid, gasket, second ferrule and the clamp). In this case if you plan to clean the boiler, you need to make a bigger hole and buy a new triclamp set. In my case I want to make just one single hole, 5" diameter, buy one 5 " ferrule, screw it to the pot lid (thankfully there is space for that), put the gasket on it, and finally weld the 2" copper pipe that will go to the condender. This way I am using one hole for both things: cleaning inside (unscrewing it) and connect to the condender. The screws will be as tight as you want, using washers and nuts under the lid.

[October]

I’m not sure what you mean about a 5” screw on ferrule either .
But I know 5” isn’t a common size . 4” or 6” would be better options IMO . …. Much more easily obtainable

You might find it a better option to solder a 6” ferrule to the lid .You could also then solder the lid to the pot avoiding the need for gaskets and the clamps fir the lid , but still allowing easy access for cleaning if needed.

On ebay I have found all measures for single ferrules, so yes, I can get 6", or 5" I think is enough for cleaning. But if I weld it to the lid like you say, I will have to buy another ferrule and a clamp. If I screw it I would buy just one ferrule and no clamp. I wouldn't mind to unscrew it sometimes when I need to clean it.

[October]

Sorry, I forgot to mention that I will put the ferrule upside down.

[Chauncey]

Huh? That makes less sense.

[Sporacle]

How are you joining or reducing from a 5 inch ferrule to your riser?
Does the ferrule have a thread?

[elbono]

I think you're talking about what I would call a flange to triclamp adapter.

tri-clamp-flange-adapter.jpg (10.67 KiB) Viewed 3121 times

You'll need a seal between the flange and pot lid if so. I would go with flour paste or Teflon plumbers tape wrapped on cardboard.

I have a 4" triclamp fill port on my keg and it's big enough to clean inside but I have small elbows. 5 or 6 inches would be nice.

[Chauncey]

That makes more sense.

[Chucker]

October, I’m trying to get my head around what you’re proposing and I’m just not seeing the advantage. Almost sounds like a pinched or sandwich connection of some means but it sounds like it could get quite heavy.
I can see an advantage to avoiding welding through the cover, though, as the ss material used in cookware is quite thin and difficult to work with. Even welding the cover to the pot could present some problems and quickly turn into a pile of regret.
For the rest, I really think you’d be best off with standard triclamp parts in typical sizes. It’ll be interesting to see what you get sorted, though and I hope you’ll run some pictures of your build!

[October]

Ok, I'll try to draw a sketch later.

[Steve Broady]

I just did a quick search on Amazon, and found a 5” ferrule, cover, clamp, and gasket for $38.99 + $4 shipping. It seems that you can achieve what you want for less than $50, and do it with off the shelf components used as they are intended. You can also find plain 5” ferrules even cheaper, and cheaper still if you look at Aliexpress or similar. Just put a 2” hold in the cap and solder or weld in your 2” ferrule(s).

It’s entirely possible that I’m just not understanding the design you’re proposing, but these seem to me like they might be much better options in the long run.

[October]

Yes Steve I found something similar, but I was thinking about something like this, you see the bolts on the ferrule base?

[October]

How are you joining or reducing from a 5 inch ferrule to your riser?
Does the ferrule have a thread?

No thread. I will use a reducer, or maybe a stainless steel funnel ( ), and weld it to the smaller pipe.

[Steve Broady]

It’s certainly possible, but I’m not sure if it’s really worth saving.. what, $25-$30? This is just my opinion, and I recognize that we all have different financial situations and opinions about time and effort, but I think that in the long run you’ll be much better off using the ferrule as intended.

I think the reason you haven’t seen it done is that most people, once they get to the point of building a boiler that needs a cleaning access like this, decide that it’s worth spending just a little more money and doing it right the first time.

If money is really tight, I think I’d consider NOT permanently attaching the lid to the pot. Use spring clamps, flour paste, a water seal, etc… there are lots of ways to keep a large lid in place while making it removable if needed. However you do it, it eliminates the need for the larger hole and associated parts entirely

[Steve Broady]

Just a quick thought. The design you are proposing uses a ferrule as nothing more than a fancy flange, and it has nothing at all to do with tri-clamp components in the larger size. You could save a fair bit of money by just bolting on a sheet metal cover, using a circle of stainless bolts. I’ve seen automotive gas tanks which have the pickup tube, float, and/or pump assembly attached to a hole in the tank that way.

[October]

It’s certainly possible, but I’m not sure if it’s really worth saving.. what, $25-$30? This is just my opinion, and I recognize that we all have different financial situations and opinions about time and effort, but I think that in the long run you’ll be much better off using the ferrule as intended.

I think the reason you haven’t seen it done is that most people, once they get to the point of building a boiler that needs a cleaning access like this, decide that it’s worth spending just a little more money and doing it right the first time.

If money is really tight, I think I’d consider NOT permanently attaching the lid to the pot. Use spring clamps, flour paste, a water seal, etc… there are lots of ways to keep a large lid in place while making it removable if needed. However you do it, it eliminates the need for the larger hole and associated parts entirely

The money spent would almost the same, but I was just curious about the screwing system, because to me it sounds very safe and easy to check often. For the pot lid I will weld it, otherwise I would end up like in Vevor style

[October]

Just a quick thought. The design you are proposing uses a ferrule as nothing more than a fancy flange, and it has nothing at all to do with tri-clamp components in the larger size. You could save a fair bit of money by just bolting on a sheet metal cover, using a circle of stainless bolts. I’ve seen automotive gas tanks which have the pickup tube, float, and/or pump assembly attached to a hole in the tank that way.

6A2D9AFE-1BAF-491E-886F-26EEA668CE44.jpeg

Yes, that's another idea. The good thing about screwing a single ferrule is that I can sandwich easily the gasket between the pot lid and the ferrule.

[Steve Broady]

I was just curious about the screwing system, because to me it sounds very safe and easy to check often.

Again, this is just one guy’s opinion, and likely worth half (or less) what you’re paying for it. I don’t think that what you’re proposing is wrong or unsafe, but I’ll point out that if you compare it to using the ferrule as intended, it’s a lot more cumbersome to disassemble. After all, ease of disassembly and reassembly is a major part of the point of the triclamp design in the first place. Why do a bunch of work to reengineer parts just to make them do what they’re already well designed to do right off the shelf?

Cost or availability seem to be the only logical reasons for doing so, but those don’t seem to be deciding factors in this case. The only other thing I can imagine is a desire to design and build something yourself. If that’s the case, my advice (see above for what that’s worth) is to save that creative energy for a condenser build. Use off the shelf parts whenever you can, and go nuts with the custom work where you need to.

For the record, this is coming from a guy who has heavily modified a Vevor still and built a Dimroth condenser out of a couple cocktail shakers. I’ve learned a lot from such tomfoolery (had some good fun, too!), and one of the lessons I learned was that I should have bought parts instead of trying to make my own parts with the exact same functionality, and devoted more time to the things that actually needed to be custom built. I don’t regret doing it, but I did learn to be more careful about doing it again.

[October]

I was just curious about the screwing system, because to me it sounds very safe and easy to check often.

Again, this is just one guy’s opinion, and likely worth half (or less) what you’re paying for it. I don’t think that what you’re proposing is wrong or unsafe, but I’ll point out that if you compare it to using the ferrule as intended, it’s a lot more cumbersome to disassemble. After all, ease of disassembly and reassembly is a major part of the point of the triclamp design in the first place. Why do a bunch of work to reengineer parts just to make them do what they’re already well designed to do right off the shelf?

Cost or availability seem to be the only logical reasons for doing so, but those don’t seem to be deciding factors in this case. The only other thing I can imagine is a desire to design and build something yourself. If that’s the case, my advice (see above for what that’s worth) is to save that creative energy for a condenser build. Use off the shelf parts whenever you can, and go nuts with the custom work where you need to.

For the record, this is coming from a guy who has heavily modified a Vevor still and built a Dimroth condenser out of a couple cocktail shakers. I’ve learned a lot from such tomfoolery (had some good fun, too!), and one of the lessons I learned was that I should have bought parts instead of trying to make my own parts with the exact same functionality, and devoted more time to the things that actually needed to be custom built. I don’t regret doing it, but I did learn to be more careful about doing it again.

Ok, I'll take time to think, I haven't done anything yet.

[ThomasBrewer]

Depending on how big your forearms are, 4" fittings are often big enough to get your arm in there to clean things out. I'd strongly suggest not going with an odd-ball size like 5" and trying to find reducers and fittings to match. As Yummy said, 4" or 6" are common sizes.

[shadylane]

Yes Steve I found something similar, but I was thinking about something like this, you see the bolts on the ferrule base?
Clipboard02.jpg

I'm confused about what you're trying to do.
I understand bolting it to the lid.
Is the 5" ferrule going to connect something to the lid?
Or will it be used as fill port, that's big enough to get your hand in for cleaning?

[shadylane]

Depending on how big your forearms are, 4" fittings are often big enough to get your arm in there to clean things out. I'd strongly suggest not going with an odd-ball size like 5" and trying to find reducers and fittings to match. As Yummy said, 4" or 6" are common sizes.

There're several reasons to use 5"
1. There ain't room for 6"
2. Ya got a 5" column.
3. Your arm won't fit in a 4"
4. Ya got lucky and found a good deal on 5" ferrules and clamps.

[Chauncey]

Just leave the lid removable.

[shadylane]

Just leave the lid removable.

Good advice.
Modifications involving 5" ferrules.
Are best done on something other than a stock pot and lid.

[Chauncey]

Rightttt?

[October]

I've found tri clamp set for any size, 5",6",even 8". I just choose 5" because it's the minimum for my hand, with 4" I would strruggle to clean inside.

[October]

I've found a pic from an old thread, the user was Jetzon, at the end of page 1, it looks like there are screws.
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