How About These Pot Still Options for Brandy?

[MotoJB]

Ok, newb alert on my first forum post here...please go easy on me. Looking to pick up my first still and want to get some input before I pull the trigger on anything. The idea is to buy once, cry once. Get something will be big enough for my needs out of the gate and likely won't want to upgrade shortly later. I was thinking a 50 Liter still would be good enough for me. These 50L stills range from about $1500 - $3000 on the high end (depending upon features/materials).

I'm mostly a brandy lover...so going for the all copper pot still route. I have to admit, I like the looks of some of the stuff I see coming out of China -- and from what I read, the quality also seems to be there for some of these.

If you don't mind:

Can I PLEASE get your candid/honest input on these three stills? Would all of these work well for Brandy? Any design that is more preferred?
Any input you can share about any of these designs and considerations I am missing would be appreciated.

Additional questions:

• For whiskeys and Brandy'sm does it make a difference, having the boiler also in copper? Or can I go stainless with the boiler and copper everywhere else?

• All of these come with 110v heating element. Will a single 110v 60hz electric heating element be sufficient for 50L stills like these?

STILL #1 With or Without Gin/Fruit Basket? $1400-1600

STILL #1 IDEA: Larger diameter onion head of 8" and shorter length 4" Arm (down to 2" condenser)

STILL 1.jpg

Still 2.jpg

Still 1 c.jpg

STILL #2: $1600

STILL #2 IDEA: smaller diameter 4" onion head connections

STILL 3.jpeg

STILL #3 $3000 (expensive)

STILL #3 IDEA:

STILL 4.jpg

Following is the dimensions FYI (unit: mm):

• Copper head: Ф51-102*500 mm

• Copper condenser: Ф51*500 mm

Still 4 d3.jpg

OR GO MORE TRADITIONAL!

Or if I should scrap these and go for a more traditional all copper still (with thumper perhaps)? Something like this? (I have limited room so this one looks even harder to deal with)
https://www.copperstillco.com/shop/p/15-gallon


Thanks for your input. Much appreciated!!!

[NZChris]

A Charentaise still is more energy and time efficient than any of those.

Size?

How much do you think you will be putting through it?

How often?

[MotoJB]

A Charentaise still is more energy and time efficient than any of those.

Size?

How much do you think you will be putting through it?

How often?

The Alembic stills, yes, have seen those. THe 50l equivalents look to take up a lot of space...

Sorry, thought I included that. They are all 50 Liter stills. Thus the question about whether a single 110v element would work for 50L.

I'd likely be doing 10 gal wash runs maybe once every month or so. Maybe more as I get the hang of it. I don't drink much tho.

[Saltbush Bill]

Damn that's a lot of money for a 50L pot still.
Get a 50 L beer keg, some copper pipe and learn to solder.
A gas burner under it for heating.
Should cost no more that about $500

[Bolverk]

They are all 50 Liter stills. Thus the question about whether a single 110v element would work for 50L.

I'd likely be doing 10 gal wash runs maybe once every month or so. Maybe more as I get the hang of it. I don't drink much tho.

Running 1650w to heat up 10 gals is going to take about 1.5 hours to first drips... it'll work, but things will be painfully slow and you'll wish you went bigger.

Sorry no feedback on the still, just depends on what you like and your budget. If you don't plan on making gin don't get the basket. I would recommend making sure whatever you get has triclamp fittings so you can be modular and change things up as you grow in the hobby.

[Salt Must Flow]

They sure are pretty, but all that 'pretty' does absolutely nothing for you in comparison to a basic keg pot still. Anyone can add a gin basket to most any still too. With a keg you can operate over flame or electricity. Each of those stills appear to be just basic pot stills that do the exact same thing as a keg, a riser, a bottom drain and a product condenser. Basic pot stills perform the same whether they are 2" or 4". Now if you're running plates, that's a different story.

[zach]

All of these come with 110v heating element. Will a single 110v 60hz electric heating element be sufficient for 50L stills like these?[

You will be limited to 1800 watts per element, with 110V, not enough power. You might settle for two 110 elements and plug into separate circuits from the breaker panel. I'd suggest spending money on a 240 V control panel which will provide 5,500 watts if going electric.

It's possible to use a propane burner, which is less expensive than electric, both up front and to operate (in CA). Just need to keep the condenser collection point well away from the flame.

There are less expensive ways to get a 50 liter boiler with no construction skills. Like this keg with a 4 inch tri clamp for a boiler. Tri clamps make it easy to take apart to store and clean.

https://www.gwkent.com/15-gallon-semi-keg.html

You can get a copper onion, condenser, and tri clamp fittings to complete your build some place like ebay or oakstills.

Do you already make wine? If you're using grapes, there is destemming, crushing, and pressing. I would try save some money on the still and purchase a crusher/destemmer and the press. Your local homebrew store may have these for rent, but it's possible to find this equipment used.

[shadylane]

The idea is to buy once, cry once.....I was thinking a 50 Liter still would be good enough for me. These 50L stills range from about $1500 - $3000....Will a single 110v 60hz electric heating element be sufficient for 50L stills like these?[/list]

First things first.
If you're going to spend lots of money, upgrade to 240v
Also, the stills pictured would be better for a sugar wash or distilling wine.
Scorching is going to be a problem on anything the thick and chunky.

For electric heat, I'd recommend a double wall boiler.
For fire heat take a look at how brandy is made in these videos.

viewtopic.php?t=76359

[Bolverk]

That's not fair shady, all those stills pictured will work perfectly fine for anything without chunks, albeit the the ones with the bigger helmets are definitely geared more for brandy they will all make a good brandy, rum, whiskey, or whatever else is pot stilled.

I agree on the double wall, but the average guy doesn't have that kinda money to throw around... that's why a lot of us start with kegs and go to direct steam injection.

[MotoJB]

Damn that's a lot of money for a 50L pot still.
Get a 50 L beer keg, some copper pipe and learn to solder.
A gas burner under it for heating.
Should cost no more that about $500

Thanks for your input and yes, I get it.

I should have mentioned I don't want a beer keg still. Yes, I am handy and I can easily solder something like this. The fact is, I want a nice, prebuilt still that works well for my needs...and is also pretty to look at.

If I am going to pay 3x the price to get that, so be it.

[MotoJB]

They are all 50 Liter stills. Thus the question about whether a single 110v element would work for 50L.

I'd likely be doing 10 gal wash runs maybe once every month or so. Maybe more as I get the hang of it. I don't drink much tho.

Running 1650w to heat up 10 gals is going to take about 1.5 hours to first drips... it'll work, but things will be painfully slow and you'll wish you went bigger.

Sorry no feedback on the still, just depends on what you like and your budget. If you don't plan on making gin don't get the basket. I would recommend making sure whatever you get has triclamp fittings so you can be modular and change things up as you grow in the hobby.

Thanks Bolverk, duly noted.

They sure are pretty, but all that 'pretty' does absolutely nothing for you in comparison to a basic keg pot still. Anyone can add a gin basket to most any still too. With a keg you can operate over flame or electricity. Each of those stills appear to be just basic pot stills that do the exact same thing as a keg, a riser, a bottom drain and a product condenser. Basic pot stills perform the same whether they are 2" or 4". Now if you're running plates, that's a different story.

Thank you Salt Must Flow.

All of these come with 110v heating element. Will a single 110v 60hz electric heating element be sufficient for 50L stills like these?[

You will be limited to 1800 watts per element, with 110V, not enough power. You might settle for two 110 elements and plug into separate circuits from the breaker panel. I'd suggest spending money on a 240 V control panel which will provide 5,500 watts if going electric.

It's possible to use a propane burner, which is less expensive than electric, both up front and to operate (in CA). Just need to keep the condenser collection point well away from the flame.

There are less expensive ways to get a 50 liter boiler with no construction skills. Like this keg with a 4 inch tri clamp for a boiler. Tri clamps make it easy to take apart to store and clean.

https://www.gwkent.com/15-gallon-semi-keg.html

You can get a copper onion, condenser, and tri clamp fittings to complete your build some place like ebay or oakstills.

Do you already make wine? If you're using grapes, there is destemming, crushing, and pressing. I would try save some money on the still and purchase a crusher/destemmer and the press. Your local homebrew store may have these for rent, but it's possible to find this equipment used.

Great input, thank you. No, haven't made any wine yet either. Some mountain brandy by pure natural fermentation and time but that's it. Duly noted and will definitely look into this as well.

The idea is to buy once, cry once.....I was thinking a 50 Liter still would be good enough for me. These 50L stills range from about $1500 - $3000....Will a single 110v 60hz electric heating element be sufficient for 50L stills like these?[/list]

First things first.
If you're going to spend lots of money, upgrade to 240v
Also, the stills pictured would be better for a sugar wash or distilling wine.
Scorching is going to be a problem on anything the thick and chunky.

For electric heat, I'd recommend a double wall boiler.
For fire heat take a look at how brandy is made in these videos.

viewtopic.php?t=76359

I understand -- was trying to use a side garage that I have a single 110v outlet in and was hoping to get by with that. I'll spend more time considering this and watching those videos as well.

[MotoJB]

That's not fair shady, all those stills pictured will work perfectly fine for anything without chunks, albeit the the ones with the bigger helmets are definitely geared more for brandy they will all make a good brandy, rum, whiskey, or whatever else is pot stilled.

I agree on the double wall, but the average guy doesn't have that kinda money to throw around... that's why a lot of us start with kegs and go to direct steam injection.

When you guys say "thick or chunky", are you saying even strained brandy wash will have a scorching risk on these single walled stills?

Thank you for the help.

[shadylane]

When you guys say "thick or chunky", are you saying even strained brandy wash will have a scorching risk on these single walled stills?

Thank you for the help.

Stained liquid isn't going to be a problem with the stills your looking at
When I think "thick or chunky" it's literally about stuff that sticks to and burns on electric heaters.

[Bolverk]

When you guys say "thick or chunky", are you saying even strained brandy wash will have a scorching risk on these single walled stills?

Yes if you're using an internal element you'll want to strain out any fruit, grain, or botanicals prior to distillation. There are some people that have had success distilling on solids but they generally have to bring the temp up very slowly and from my reading it's not always guaranteed that it won't scorch.

[MotoJB]

When you guys say "thick or chunky", are you saying even strained brandy wash will have a scorching risk on these single walled stills?

Yes if you're using an internal element you'll want to strain out any fruit, grain, or botanicals prior to distillation. There are some people that have had success distilling on solids but they generally have to bring the temp up very slowly and from my reading it's not always guaranteed that it won't scorch.

Thanks Bolverk.

[MotoJB]

Perhaps I'm better off going with something like this?

https://www.distilling.info/index.php?r ... duct_id=12

[Bolverk]

If I was going to throw that kind of money at a still id do one of these.

https://www.despotstills.eu/en/brandy-p ... with-mixer

Yes, it is only a single wall, but it has an agitator, so while you are coming up to temp, you can stir every few mins to prevent scorching.

[zach]

Perhaps I'm better off going with something like this?

https://www.distilling.info/index.php?r ... duct_id=12

I think this a good option for fruit and pomace brandy. The jacket will give you the option to distill pomace or lees without scorching.

The DES still also good with the agitator to prevent scorching of fruit pulp.

If you are going to distill wine that's clear you could use an electric heating element.

I use steam to strip fruit brandies mostly grape pomace left over from wine making. Also use steam to strip whiskey wash fermented on the grain.

[MotoJB]

If I was going to throw that kind of money at a still id do one of these.

https://www.despotstills.eu/en/brandy-p ... with-mixer

Yes, it is only a single wall, but it has an agitator, so while you are coming up to temp, you can stir every few mins to prevent scorching.

Wow, nice...thanks. That's a consideration as well.

[MotoJB]

Perhaps I'm better off going with something like this?

https://www.distilling.info/index.php?r ... duct_id=12

I think this a good option for fruit and pomace brandy. The jacket will give you the option to distill pomace or lees without scorching.

The DES still also good with the agitator to prevent scorching of fruit pulp.

If you are going to distill wine that's clear you could use an electric heating element.

I use steam to strip fruit brandies mostly grape pomace left over from wine making. Also use steam to strip whiskey wash fermented on the grain.

Great, thank you...I have so much to learn. Fun stuff.

[NZChris]

Do you know how to run a pot still?

If you are distilling 10 gallons, you only need a 20l boiler. Split the wine into three lots, strip each then combine the low wines for a spirit run.

If you don’t mind choking down low quality product, you can try doing ‘one run and done’ in a 50l boiler like you might have seen on YouTube or recommended by newbies who don’t know any better.

[MotoJB]

Do you know how to run a pot still?

If you are distilling 10 gallons, you only need a 20l boiler. Split the wine into three lots, strip each then combine the low wines for a spirit run.

If you don’t mind choking down low quality product, you can try doing ‘one run and done’ in a 50l boiler like you might have seen on YouTube or recommended by newbies who don’t know any better.

I am brand new to distilling, no, have never run a pot still. Yes, I am learning this...

The point is making a product I'd actually want to drink. Thanks for your help/input.

[shadylane]

I am brand new to distilling, no, have never run a pot still. Yes, I am learning this...

You came to the right place for gathering information. Everything here is well vetted.
Most likely after looking at all the options, your ideas will change.

[MotoJB]

I am brand new to distilling, no, have never run a pot still. Yes, I am learning this...

You came to the right place for gathering information. Everything here is well vetted.
Most likely after looking at all the options, your ideas will change.

Ha, yeah, they already have! Well, it wouldn't be the first time I was a serious newbie at something. I know to ask a lot of questions, before making stupid mistakes right out of the gate. I know it's likely tiresome for some of the experienced old timers but hopefully everyone remembers they were newbies once too.

Now when it comes to gunsmithing, runnin' n gunnin', building 911 Turbo's, motorcycles and setting up suspension...I have you covered.

[MotoJB]

I almost hate to ask, after all the input above...and it's single walled as well...but what are your guys thoughts about this one?

It's a 65L pot style that looks like a good config for whiskey and brandy...with onion head, 90 degree arm...110v 2600w, etc.

Could I possibly set this up on a 30A 110v circuit and run it at it's rated 2600w and it would possibly work well? They claim the heating is very uniform...

I am just exhausting the notion that I can get a somewhat more-simple, fully self-contained, smaller-footprint, easy to clean, electric heated still like this...that runs off of 110v and would work perfectly in my side garage. There are also a bunch of upgradable parts, columns, gin baskets, etc, that would allow me to configure it to run other spirits.

Again, my main purpose is brandy or whiskey. Thoughts?

If this is a fallacy or improper thinking, I will finally accept it (what you guys are telling me) and move on. Thanks.





AS AN ADDED BONUS, I CAN COOK CONGEE WITH IT, LOL.

[MotoJB]

Lastly, I also see this double walled pot still.... 1750W / 20A element.

https://www.northstills.com/product/3-i ... ss-boiler/
https://www.northstills.com/product/220 ... r-adapter/

[NZChris]

I would use that 65l pot if I was doing 50 gal ferments. I wouldn’t buy the parrot as it’s not necessary.

Unless you are putting solids in the boiler, the double skinned boiler isn’t necessary and it comes with it’s own set of problems for you to have to deal with.

[shadylane]

Not to sound mean, but none of the stills look like something I'd buy.
Keep searching and planning.

[Saltbush Bill]

Several other things to consider, are that 99 % of people who make gin also own a packed reflux column to make the base spirt for the gin.
The spirit is made before the botanicals are added, then rerun in the pot still.
The other thing is that a gin basket is unnecessary, you can just macerate the botanicals in the neutral spirit.....then dump the lot into the boiler.
If you can't make a nice gin that way it's unlikely that a gin basket or carter head will help you.
I mention this only because gin has been mentioned more than once in this thread.
More food for thought.

[MotoJB]

I would use that 65l pot if I was doing 50 gal ferments. I wouldn’t buy the parrot as it’s not necessary.

Unless you are putting solids in the boiler, the double skinned boiler isn’t necessary and it comes with it’s own set of problems for you to have to deal with.

Yeah, it comes with all of that standard...parrot included. Noted and thank you Chris.

Not to sound mean, but none of the stills look like something I'd buy.
Keep searching and planning.

Not at all shadylane, I apprecite the candid input. I will look back months from now and likely chuckle at this post. I have thick skin and am just starting out here. If you have any suggestions on what you think would be a better choice, given my situation and goals, I'm all ears!!

Several other things to consider, are that 99 % of people who make gin also own a packed reflux column to make the base spirt for the gin.
The spirit is made before the botanicals are added, then rerun in the pot still.
The other thing is that a gin basket is unnecessary, you can just macerate the botanicals in the neutral spirit.....then dump the lot into the boiler.
If you can't make a nice gin that way it's unlikely that a gin basket or carter head will help you.
I mention this only because gin has been mentioned more than once in this thread.
More food for thought.

Noted and thank you Bill. I saw a video of a guy using a gin basket to infuse a brandy spirit run with additional fruit, and got stuck on that idea.


Open to still suggestions from anyone. Thanks again fellas. Enjoy the day.