Home Distiller

Found it!

PART III

PROHIBITIONS, PENALTIES AND
PROCEDURE IN PROSECUTIONS AND ON APPEAL

Unlawful sale of liquor
78 (1) Except as provided by this Act or by the regulations, no person shall, within the Province by himself, his clerk, servant or agent, directly or indirectly, upon any pretence or upon any device expose or keep for sale, sell or barter, or offer to sell liquor or in consideration of the purchase or transfer of any property, or for any other consideration, or at the time of the transfer of any property, give liquor to any other person.

(2) Except as authorized by this Act or the regulations, no liquor shall be manufactured, transported, kept or had by any person.

(3) Except as authorized by this Act or the regulations, no liquor shall be given or consumed by any person.

(4) Every person who violates this Section is guilty of an offence and liable upon summary conviction to a fine or not less than three hundred dollars and not more than one thousand dollars or, in default, to imprisonment for not less than one nor more than two months for a first offence, and to a fine of not less than seven hundred and fifty dollars and not more than fifteen hundred dollars or, in default, to imprisonment for not less than one and not more than four months for a second or subsequent offence. R.S., c. 260, s. 78.

So if I get caught, I'll get a $300-1,000 fine and after that get $750-1500 for the second and subsequent fines.
Bad part is, rcmp can come in at anytime without a warrant and search anywhere they want!
Blanket search warrant

109 (1) Any Provincial Police constable or other officer, who is authorized in writing for the purpose by the Minister, if he believes or suspects that liquor is unlawfully kept or had, or kept or had for unlawful purposes, in any residence, building or premises, may, without warrant, whether alone or accompanied by other officers, at any time in the day or night, enter and search the residence, building or premises, and every part thereof, and for that purpose may break open any door, lock, or fastening of the residence, building or premises or any part thereof, or any closet, cupboard, box or other receptacle therein which might contain liquor and seize such liquor if found, and such authority shall be a general one and shall be effective until revoked, and such authority in writing shall be prima facie proof before any court.

goinbroke2 wrote:Found it!
Bad part is, rcmp can come in at anytime without a warrant and search anywhere they want!
Blanket search warrant

So the point is don't do anything that's going to bring them to you. Don't sell it, don't brag about it, don't distill where or when somebody's gonna catch you and don't make more than you need to supply yourself. They're not really interested in you but you can't be thumbing you nose at them either. Being a member of this board won't get them a warrant but it'll support a case already made.

That law was written before we had our own constitution and Charter of Rights--they still have to have a search warrant to enter your home.
Trouble is--reasonable grounds and probable cause that a crime has been committed ain't that hard to get. The various police agencies (RCMP--OPP--city police ect.) are gettin real good at crossing thier Tee's and dottin the I's. They ain't blowing many cases nowdays on illegal search and siezure. You can thank the grow-ops and meth labs for that.
I get along pretty well with the local police--both APA and OPP--I curl and play baseball and fish with a bunch of them but I really don't want them knowing what I'm up to. My problem is game wardens--I'm fightin with them guys constant--and they might lead to my undoing.
I have never sold a single drop and no one has ever tasted any that wasn't sittin at my kitchen table--but people talk. You can't beat the moccasin telegraph.

smokerscully1 wrote:My problem is game wardens--I'm fightin with them guys constant--and they might lead to my undoing.

If they are anythin' like the game wardens here in New Mexico, yer a braver man than I. Everyone I know that hunts, and I, tip-toe around them.

A link to the Canadian Excise Act(2001)
Far more substantial penalties than you indicate above!

http://lois.justice.gc.ca/en/ShowTdm/cs/E-14.1///en" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

This is not exactly related but on a recent trip coming back from the USA, I unintentionally lied to Canada Customs about the number of bottles of wine I was bringing back. The customs officer asked me how much likker did I buy in the USA and I told her 1 bottle. We were selected for a random search as I waiting in the holding pen, I realized some clarification was needed so I walked up to the counter and told the man who was going to actually do the search that there are three bottles of wine, two of which we brought from canada. He lectured me for a good couple of minutes, and I argued back, trying to explain that the two bottles of wine really were from canada and that we never got around to drinking it because we wanted to try the stuff where we were at. Finally, he said with some frustration, "excuse me sir, but do you know what my job is here, it's to look for weapons, drugs and large sums of cash. Do you think I care if you have 2, 3 or 4 bottles of wine." So the point I got is just shut up because they're really not looking for the little law breakers. Don't throw it in their faces; they're not really looking for the little guy with a hobby. Hope I'm right.

I dug into the actual stats (for Ontario) as deep as I could 18 months ago and basically all I came up with was primarily about the Indians in Akwesasne switching over to smuggling US booze instead of cigarettes when the government clamped down on the tobacco companies. Basically they liked smuggling the tobacco better because they were getting higher dollar per pound.
The only busts in Southern Ontario I could find are were those phoned in when the local fire department called in the cops after putting out a fire caused by a still.
I wouldn’t suggest for a second that this was comprehensive but the results did suggest that around here the cops were either not looking or they had higher priorities than illegal hobbyists. I’d bet that it would be a different story if they thought you were selling.
Hey Scully, what’s up with the woodpecker cops?
…Have you been fishing with dynamite? <KIDDING!>

My lil lady is an accountant with a designation. When we started digging into this for fuel and fun, we received the same defacto answers everywhere. No one is interested in doing the paperwork if you're not selling (fuel or hootch). CRA might be interested in the excise tax for fuel if you're going to try and claim fuel as part of your fleet expense (that would be double dipping, not paying excise yet filing for the costs of it etc..). Basically, it's like so many other issues here in Canuckistan, if you're not selling no one really gives a fart and they're just waiting for the laws to catch up.

Different provinces also have different ways of enforcing their respective liquor control acts so your mileage may vary. I know several of the local constabulary have reviewed both my hootch and fuel stills with no comment other than interest. I'm also quite sure if I were running a sales operation it would be quite different.

Ugly wrote:Basically, it's like so many other issues here in Canuckistan, if you're not selling no one really gives a fart and they're just waiting for the laws to catch up.

While that may very well be true if you look at the excise act you'll notice that if you are hauled into court and convicted the judge has absolute minimum sentencing guides that he cannot ignore. They are very punitive and each offense is a required minimum. The point is each stilling device, and every variety of alcohol would constitute a separate offense.
http://lois.justice.gc.ca/en/ShowTdm/cs/E-14.1///en" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

minime wrote:

Ugly wrote:Basically, it's like so many other issues here in Canuckistan, if you're not selling no one really gives a fart and they're just waiting for the laws to catch up.

While that may very well be true if you look at the excise act you'll notice that if you are hauled into court and convicted the judge has absolute minimum sentencing guides that he cannot ignore. They are very punitive and each offense is a required minimum. The point is each stilling device, and every variety of alcohol would a separate offense.
http://lois.justice.gc.ca/en/ShowTdm/cs/E-14.1///en" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

I have reviewed the excise act. I'm sure there are laws on the books regarding not wearing a hat at the dinner tables as well. No, I'm not running around having articles published on my ability to produce, but neither will I pretend I'm engaged in something deep and evil. I'm too old to give a crap and too nasty not to fight it in a big way were it to come around that I was being charged.

I do agree with you, as it's spelled out under Canadian law, it's a clearly illegal activity. Definitely a risk/reward scenario. I encourage those engaging in personal production to understand their not inconsiderable liabilities in this matter. I further encourage those producing to engage in such in an area not attached to a habitable space, as were there an accident resulting in injury or property damage, the legal ramifications would be very serious.

In any case, I'm going to keep going.

Ugly wrote:Definitely a risk/reward scenario. I encourage those engaging in personal production to understand their not inconsiderable liabilities in this matter. I further encourage those producing to engage in such in an area not attached to a habitable space, as were there an accident resulting in injury or property damage, the legal ramifications would be very serious.

Good advice! as long as folks are aware of the risks involved they can make an informed decision. I'm appalled at the wide net cast by our government all in the name of protecting the tax base. They made our little hobby far more serious an offense than trafficking in illicit drugs! Judges do not have their hands tied with sentencing guidelines nearly as stringent for those offenses. Shame on Canada.

Just for the record guys--I don't fish with dynamite--I tried it and it don't work too good.
I fish with a gill net like all good Indians do.

Ugly wrote: I'm too old to give a crap and too nasty not to fight.

Are you my dad?

violentblue wrote:

Ugly wrote: I'm too old to give a crap and too nasty not to fight.

Are you my dad?

That would only be possible if you were from a state or province containing one of the letters A, E, I, O or U.

A lot depends on your past criminal record also. You may not have a record of alcohol, but if you have a substantial past record, they will be more likely to pursue a warrant or charges there after. Silence is golden. If you do not show/tell anyone what you are doing, how can you get arrested?