Homemade YLAY

[Pure Old Possum Piss]

Here's another way of getting YLAY.
And a lot of you guys probably already do this...
Make it yourself. It's easy.
You can go to just about any Asian market store and buy Koji Kin. That's the name of Aspergillus Oryzae in their language. Or you can buy a packet online. Here's a link.
amazon.com/Hishiroku-Starter-Yummy-Yamaguchi-Improved-Chohaku/dp/B0D164PLHC
Just Google how to make koji kin for details but basically you cook about 1 or 5 or However many lbs of YLAY you want to make.
Let it cool to 85° and sprinkle about a spoon/5g of koji powder on the rice and mix it in. You want to use a plastic container with a snap on lid. Put rice/koji mix in container and cover. Keep in a warm dark area of the house. Stir twice a day. By day 3 you'll see white fuzz all over the rice. That's the koji that multiplied. Over 85 may only take 2 days. About 70 may take 3 or 4 days.
You can use this koji fresh or dry it out on sheet pans to use later.
Only difference is this homemade YLAY doesn't have yeast.
So you'll need to pitch your favorite yeast at the beginning of your ferment.
Something else, that one little packet of koji can inoculate over 50lbs of rice. So if you have a way to dry it you can make as many lbs as you want, then dry it. And when you want more koji, just repeat the process with the dry koji you made earlier. All it takes is a spoonful.
I thought about making new koji from YLAY but I don't care for the flavor of it's yeasts. I didn't want to have their yeast reproduce and taint my homemade YLAY. And I can put my favorite Kveik yeast in it.
Good luck.

PS Drying it is easy too. Just spread thin on a baking sheet and let it air dry or you can use a dehydrator. Once good and dry just crumble it up into power and store in a sealed jar or zip lock in your fridge.
Once you start getting low on koji just make another batch with the little bit of koji you have left.
You'll never need to buy expensive YLAY again... but you might have to buy some more of your favorite yeast.

Here's a video shoeing how easy it is.

[bluc]

Very cool, tune the mix to your fave strain of yeast, I have been wondering how to do this since I discovered the stuff, thanks. bookmarked.

[Pure Old Possum Piss]

Here is a more detailed source on his to do it.

https://sakestreet.com/en/media/what-is-koji-mold

The koji kin not only contains alpha and gluco amylases but pectinase and a few other enzymes so that buying extra enzymes isn't really needed. It'll eat up corn rice barley and even rye.
Thanks bluc! I used to be a DADY man but these Kveik yeasts have changed my mind. I can't wait to try some Hornindal Kveik with this koji.

[MooseMan]

Thanks for the info POPP.

I've been holding off on doing this for quite a while, since I did some research and pretty much found what you did.

I've been using YLAY as the lazy choice as I don't want to go back to full mashing, so at the moment I am happy to buy it couple of times a year.
If/when I have more time on my hands I'll definitely be giving this a try as I have a couple of yeasts in mind to pair it with.

[Salt Must Flow]

You would think that there would be companies that supply dried, Koji colonized rice just as there are plenty of companies that supply malted grain. If not, well there appears to be a market for it. There are plenty of people that are not DIY inclined and would prefer to 'click to buy'.

[Saltbush Bill]

I'm yet to be convinced that it's that simple.......sounds to good to be true.........and you know what they say about that!

[Pure Old Possum Piss]

You would think that there would be companies that supply dried, Koji colonized rice just as there are plenty of companies that supply malted grain. If not, well there appears to be a market for it. There are plenty of people that are not DIY inclined and would prefer to 'click to buy'.

They do make what you're talking about... but it can be expensive. Dry koji rice, Koji powder and also just the concentrated powdered Koji spores (aspergillus oryzae).

www.amazon.com/Dried-Rice-Koji-Gluten-F ... B0CC8KD5J8

There's a little more to propagating it for larger batches, it's sorta like how we talk about mashing. "Heat & hold grain at 150° for an hour. Then pitch yeast at 90°. A week later, run it. " We all know its a little more involved but it doesn't take a rocket scientist. It's certainly easier than making wine, but you need to be very sanitary in the process.

[jonnys_spirit]

This bread proofer works well for cultivating koji spores on different substrates depending on what you're making. It holds a standard sized bain marie serving pan. I use one with holes in the bottom resting in a solid pan with some water. The rice/spores are wrapped in a clean flour-sack towel. Lots of ways to skin that cat and the koji can be used for many different recipes including making soy sauce and other fermented foods like miso, sake, gochujang, garums, and similar. Great for yoghurt too.

The kojified rice can be frozen for long term storage and used as needed.

YLAY uses a different primary culture (rhizopus) where koji is generally Aspergillus Oryzae. They both do similar things with the amylase enzymes so koji definitely works for converting starches into sugars and is multipurpose in a culinary sense.

https://brodandtaylor.com/products/fold ... low-cooker

Cheers,
jonny

[zach]

Here's a link for making Qu (YLAY). It looks like they use 4.5% to 8% by weight of 6 month old Qu with ground wheat and 40% water.

https://spiritsselection.com/en/qu-the- ... se-baijiu/

[Pure Old Possum Piss]

This bread proofer works well for cultivating koji spores on different substrates depending on what you're making. It holds a standard sized bain marie serving pan. I use one with holes in the bottom resting in a solid pan with some water. The rice/spores are wrapped in a clean flour-sack towel. Lots of ways to skin that cat and the koji can be used for many different recipes including making soy sauce and other fermented foods like miso, sake, gochujang, garums, and similar. Great for yoghurt too.

The kojified rice can be frozen for long term storage and used as needed.

YLAY uses a different primary culture (rhizopus) where koji is generally Aspergillus Oryzae. They both do similar things with the amylase enzymes so koji definitely works for converting starches into sugars and is multipurpose in a culinary sense.

https://brodandtaylor.com/products/fold ... low-cooker

Cheers,
jonny

I've had a steak that was marinated in it and it was super tender. Tasted mighty good too.

[john_bud]

I make koji for sake. A simple way to grow it is in the oven on cookie sheets. Innoculate the steamed rice, cover with paper towels, spritz them with water to wet the paper towels. Spritz every 6-12 hours depending on your humidity.
After 24 hours, turn over and mix the rice to ensure even coating.


Now...are you thinking "oven" ? Well yes. Just keep the heat off, but the oven light on. It stays around 85-90F and humid in there.

I get a nice batch in 2 or 3 days. I also mix the "koji kin" starter with flour. 1 koji : 5 flour. Shake in a container to mix. Spread on the steamed rice by spooning and shaking thru a sieve.

[LWTCS]

I've done my first (training wheels) batch of Makgeolli (Korean rice wine) using the Korean Nuruk starter.

Because I wanted to ensure a measure of added success I did cheat with a hybrid method to kick off my fermentation.
Evidently the problem with cheat techniques is that the more rapid fermentation process eliminates some of the more traditional flavors associated with the longer fermentation times. Though Makgeolli ferments are only supposed to be about 7 to 9 days.
Also, for reliability commercial producers of Makgeolli also use more modern fermentation techniques that perhaps someone's Korean grandfather might stare down their nose at.

Anyway, once I get a few reps under my belt with the fermentation bit, I'll work on putting together my own Nuruk.

This one here consists of steamed glutenous rice, shredded, raw sweet potato with skin on and a handfull of locally grown lightly crushed blueberries with a hardy, visible yeast bloom.

20250923_190349.jpg

[jonnys_spirit]

That sounds good Larry. I need to do a rice wine batch soon

Cheers,
jonny

[bluc]

Very interesting

[HeyBroChuckNorris]

Has anyone successfully used koji/qu/rhizopus and their own yeast to do a no-mash all grain? Do we know for sure whether YLAY uses koji, qu, or rhizopus?

[Alzahra888]

You can go to just about any Asian market store and buy Koji Kin. That's the name of Aspergillus Oryzae in their language. Or you can buy a packet online. Here's a link.
amazon.com/Hishiroku-Starter-Yummy-Yamaguchi-Improved-Chohaku/dp/B0D164PLHC

Seems HD has bought out their supplies, sold out

amazon.com/Hishiroku-Starter-Yummy-Yamaguchi-Improved-Chohaku/dp/B0D164PLHC

[SW_Shiner]

Has anyone successfully used koji/qu/rhizopus and their own yeast to do a no-mash all grain? Do we know for sure whether YLAY uses koji, qu, or rhizopus?

I think there is someone here that tried to make their own blend. The name escapes me atm.
We do know. It says on the ingredients list on packs of YLAY that it is rhizopus.

[N00b]

I’ve grown kohi successfully at home for cooking - I have a small fermentation chamber, but I’ve never tried to use them in a nocook mash.

I can give it a shot, but wonk be quick - too much going on in my life right now for another project.

[timoshishi]

The propagated Koji is unlikely to work on a no cook mash. Especially if you are using black/white Koji (aspergillus luchensis/kawachii) as their saccrification power is too low.

The no-cook enzymes available here in Korea are called improved nuruk and have a saccrification power of roughly 10x that or nuruk or yellow Koji.

They also usually specificy that you should use milled rice in place of whole rice as the enzymes won't be able to penetrate deeply in whole raw kernels

I believe it is the Rhizopus that can sacchrify ungelatinized starches and not the various strains of Koji

[bluc]

Cool info