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So im going to run my first batch of UJSM through my still today. I was wondering what i can do with the spirits I get from the first run. Should I collect everything after I dump the first 150ml until it starts to come out at about 20%abv and then run it all again through the still a second time?

grab the amount you posted (all but the very first, and down to 20% or so). This is your 'sweet run' (not sour yet). Keep the results of this sweet run.

When you distill your 2nd fermentation run (which will be a sour distillation, due to you putting the backset in, as per the recipe), you will dump the results of this sweet run, and the ferment into the boiler. The output of this can be used as whiskey (UJSM single run).

What I do when I do UJSM is simply collect all of the runs like you just did (cut a little from the first drips), and then distill down to 10% or 20%. I keep ALL of these runs (stripping runs). When I have done enough ferments and stripping runs, to where the stripped output will fill my boiler, I then run ALL of them combined. This is a spirit run. Usually, I put a little wash in with the stripped 'low wines'. I try to get these low wines to 35% ABV or so (using wash). This is so that the boiler ABV is lower (safety), along with it produces a final spirit right at about 65% ABV (all of the spirit combined), and this is right at the ABV I want it to be, to age on charred oak. Note, my method, is not a 'single-run' method, but a 2 run (strip followed by a spirit run). NOTE if you simply strip, then re-run what just came out, the end result will not be very good, or very much volume. When I re-run, I have the total of 4 to 6 ferments in the boiler, not just the last one. There is not enough volume to simply re-run the stripped low wines from one wash.

H.

Ok so I have been running my still on a hotplate with about 5 gal of wash inside it for about an hour now, I have the hot plate on the highest setting, I can hear the wash inside boiling rather rapidly but the temperature at the top of column is still at 20 degrees Celsius. My question is whether or not I should lower the temp on the hot plate and whether or not its bad for the wash to be boiling so rapidly?

I take it your running a reflux? if so let it go, the temp. will/should "jump" quickly . then you can turn it down if your doing a spirit run.
if doing a stripping run ,,run as fast as you can and still knock down the vapors.

Im running a regular pot still, but that helps anyways, its boiling slower now and the temp is around 50c with some spirits starting to come out

Keep in mind, that with a hot plate, you are lucky to get 1/2 the wattage into the boiler (possibly less if a stainless steel bottom, and not copper).

Thus, if you have a 1500W hot plate, you are only getting 650 to 850W actually input into the boiler. It may take a while for the still to come up to temp.

H.

Ive gotten it up to temp and am now collecting spirits. Ive been having a hard time keeping the temp at the column steady, it fluctuates between about 75c to 85c. Its starting to level out and fluctuate less now, Ive been running it for about 4 hours now and have only collected about 500ml. I have a 23l or 5gal wash, about how long can I expect to be running my still.

Id say its your hot plate. need steady heat. and probably more.

Also the first 180 ml i collected after dumping the initial 150ml came out at 70% ABV, I noticed that UJSM calls for it to be 80 to 70 %, is this normal

This is the hot plate and still Im using by the way, it is a 1500 watt hot plate with a stainless steel bottom on the still

http://www.brewhaus.com/1500W_Hotplate_p/80004005.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

http://www.brewhaus.com/Essential_Extra ... 001200.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

how much heat you put in makes a difference what you git out (with a pot still)

Stevewhiskey. your hot plate is cycling, even on high, which means that it doesn't have a full-on cycling bypass setting... If you're going to use it for future runs you might consider opening it up and integrating your own bypass so you can run it with full line power... Either that or start looking for an alternate heat source before your next run... The power cycling is causing your ABV to fluctuate right along with the temperature...

Sounds like everything else is inline with expected results, taking the power cycling into account...

Are you addicted yet...???

So is it safe to assume that the thermostat in the hotplate is constantly cycling and causing the temp in the column to fluctuate, is there any way to remedy this, I know gas burners are easier to control but is there any safer alternative.

Ok so can you explain how exactly I would perform this full on bypass procedure? Or would it be easier for me to get a gas burner?

Thanks for all the help so far on this guys, much appreciated

Could sit a piece of steel plate between still and hotplate .Would make for more even heat .

Stevewhiskey wrote:Ok so can you explain how exactly I would perform this full on bypass procedure? Or would it be easier for me to get a gas burner?

If you aren't comfortable modifying the hot plate then using another source would be your best bet... If you want to give it a go then it would depend on the inner workings of the unit... There is usually a way to add a switch that will allow you to either run through the temperature control or send power directly to the element... A DPDT switch of proper rating plus some wire is all that would be required - plus a few hand tools and such...

All that said, 1500W is kinda low for a boiler that can hold a 5 gallon charge - at least for bringing up to temperature... Once it's up to temperature the 1500W will chug along without much trouble but you'll still have relatively slow striping runs... The only benefit of that is that you will be attaining higher ABV... Comes down to a coin flip but I'd rather strip as fast as possible and then only have to do one long and slow spirit run at high ABV...

Or, as tater mentioned while I was typing, you could try a piece of 3/8" or 1/2" steel plate between the hot plate and the boiler... I use one on my small scale stove top unit and it seems to help... I only run about 2/3 power setting after initial warm up...

I'm going to try out the steel plate idea now, assuming i can find one, ill most likely be looking into a gas heating source for my next run, i don't trust my ability's to modify my hotplate, can anyone recommend any good gas burners.

After running my 20 liter wash of UJSM for 7 hours i have collected the following distillate

150ml - 80% abv - discarded this

400ml - 69-70% ABV

250ml - 60% ABV

just to double check i should be keeping everything down to around 20% ABV to use again in my second run correct?

Correct, collect until the ABV drops pretty low, and then keep for your next run. A second way, is to simply keep this stripped output (low wines), and the low wines from your next X number of runs, until you have 5 gallons of low wines, and then run them all at one time (this is the method I use). It is the difference between single run, and double run. I double run, most of the time. The other way, is you take the feigns from each run (minus the foreshots), and dump them into the next ferment ONCE it is finished, and you are putting it in the still, and do a slower spirit run on that, keeping the body to age, and the foreshots removed, and the heads/tails to dump into the next distill run. If running this single run way, you are simply treating the entire product output (heads/body/tails, minus the fores), as the feigns of your 1st generation, dumping them into the finished 2nd generation.

The UJSM is simply the recipe / method you are using.

A little easier way to look at the single run vs double run, is to simply 'ignore' the first 2nd, and possibly 3rd generation, and just make an assumption that you have a good 'working' sour mash going. Then assume that you have a single 5000 gallon wash. For a single run, you dump this into your 6500 gallon still (along with the feigns from your last run), heat it, slowly cut out the fores, then the heads, then do a nice slow steady production run, and properly cut off for the tails, and end up with 500-600 gallons of 60-65% good juice when done. The double run, would take that same 5000 gallons, and simply run it off as fast as possible, collecting all down to 10% abv (or whatever). Then that 1100 gallons or so, would be put into a spirit still (along with feigns from your last run, and some finished wash, say 400 gallons of wash), and run a second time, slowly, and then proper cuts made from there. On double run, you remove fores from your first strip run (a smaller amount), and then remove fores from the spirit run (again a partial amount, but 'enough'). In the end, you will still end up with approx the same amount as before, (possibly a little less in volume, but likely close or the same, and probably a little higher in ABV.)

You may want to try both ways. I have found that building up a good amount of low wines, AND going VERY deep into the tails (until the ethanol is damn near gone) on my strip runs, then combining all into a single spirit run, allow me to make much better cuts. Doing 4 single runs, vs 1 2nd run of 4 strips allows a much bigger body, and the transition to body from heads, and to tails from body happen slower. On a single run, from a 10% wash, it simply happens over such a compressed time (and smaller amounts), that I find it harder to get proper cuts done. Certainly others mileage may vary in this issue, but doing 4 single runs, I never seem to get great cuts or consistent cuts. When I do a larger 2nd run from low wines, wash, feigns mix (at say 38% abv same boiler volume), the size of heads/tails and especially the body is about 4x as large, and the transition happens slow enough that even I can catch it much more consistently.

So, for me, it is a trade off between better cuts, but a little less flavor, vs a little more flavor, but difficult to get the end product the way I want it. Most of the time, I have chosen the 2-run method, and I simply take some steps to try to keep the flavor a full flavor, such as stripping DEEP into the tails, putting feigns in spirit runs, and putting some wash back into the spirit runs, etc. Most of my running is done using the double distill method. The exception (for me at least), is rum. I single distill my rum, unless I screw it up (then have to re-run it to clean it up). I find the full flavor of the rum to be better (IMHO) on a single run. Now keep in mind, this is just MY methods. I know there are many here who shudder at double distilling, for things like UJSM, real whiskeys, etc. They feel the same way about how I feel about my rum. That 2-running, is simply stripping everything out, and the only way to get good 'full bodied' flavor, is to single run, and properly cut.

There is no single or 'right' way to do it. Distillation is not rocket science (and in the words of UJ, it is not tiddlywinks either). There are several ways to do things, and one of the fun things about this being a DIY home hobby, is you can pick and choose what you want to do, and create something which no one else in the world (ok, I know a little over dramatic) is producing. It is your own 'signature' product. And while searching for that signature product, if you fuxor up a few times, no big deal, just dump'um back into the still, and run it again. If you fuxor up pretty bad, you can always dump it into a good column still, and make a neutral out of it. When you are sitting around the camp fire, with a dozen friends, polishing of 4 bottles of FINE strawberry panty dropper, or apple pie, NO ONE has to know it started out as a terrible botched whiskey, or rum, or schnapps run.

H.

Thanks Husker, your info is most helpful. I'm going to be experimenting with both of your methods. From reading all the forums Ive pretty much realized that distillation is all about trial and error and just figuring out what things work well and don't. Just a quick question, my spirits that came out at 60% abv and below smell like wet dog, is this normal?

Alright writing as a complete novice. Based on my research abilities on the operation of still excluding mash recipe. Distill the mash save approprate abv if desired for drinking run down to 20% abv save, run mash again with "backset" for sour mash save tails. Up to as "Popcorn" put it 2-4 time max? Run resulting tails with a mash additive to reduce some abv to 35% as mentioned by "forgot name" then run slow for spirit run? I know this post has not been active since Mar. I hope to at least get one more post besides mine.

Thanks in advance

Pogoss, (avid reader, information seeker)