Jimbo's Electric Conversion

[Jimbo]

Here's a handy power chart for the Camco 5500W element on 240V.

[Jimbo]

This ones maybe more handy...

[Jimbo]

Bought a couple of these to mount in the box. With the cheat sheet taped next to it.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/370412360384" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

$6.99 and free shipping from China.

[Halfbaked]

Are you going to use a 12 volt power supply off a computer?

[Jimbo]

I already have a 12V wall wart supply in there powering the fan. Its zip tied inside the box bottom right in the 2nd picture.

[humbledore]

Would love to understand which wires go to those measuring terminals... Do you seriously put up to 240v through the display?

[Jimbo]

sure its just monitoring leads they don't carry any current so they can be very thin

[marshrunner757]

How long did it take the SCR to come in?

[S-Cackalacky]

Bellybuster has a nice write up on soldering a half coupling into a keg. There's also a Youtube link down near the end of the 1st page of posts. Here tis - http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... =2&t=36347 .

S-C

[corene1]

Thanks for the chart I already saved and copied it. I was thinking today at work about putting a voltmeter and amp meter with the control box and I come home and there it is. You are doing all the footwork for us.
I also went down to the specialty metal supply that we get our material from and talked to him about the availability of 1 inch NPS stainless 1/2 collars . they are available but the demand is so small that they are too expensive so the easiest way will be to buy standard 1/2 collars and run a NPS tap through them. I did that to mine today and it fit perfect. If you ever need some let me know I will make some and send them out. A good 1 inch NPS tap is about $45 dollars at our supplier so it would be too much for a one time use for most but I already have one and the facility to do the work and would be glad to help out.
The BEST PART is they have remodeled and are now carrying a full line of Stainless tri clamp and ferrule assemblies and the gaskets also. I was in heaven when a saw whole shelf dedicated to them, and they are cheap to boot. A 4 inch stainless tri clamp for $11.99 , 2 inch version $9.99 I am getting goose bumps thinking about all the modular sections I can build.

[Jimbo]

How long did it take the SCR to come in?

Pretty quick. Maybe 2 weeks or less

[F6Hawk]

This might help others with different size elements...

For your power input decision, it depends on whether you incorporate a volt meter as Jumbo has, or an ammeter as others have done. You also have to know the resistance of the element, R, which is given by R = V^2 / P (watts). So a 5500 watt element at 240v has resistance of R= 10.473 ohms. A 4000w element at 240v has an R of 14.4 ohms. You have to know this resistance to calculate both amps and watts as voltage changes, or watts and voltage as amperage changes (depending on which meter you buy). Of course, it all becomes moxnix because you don't really care that a voltage setting of 148v equals XXX watts, you only care that 148v on your meter gives you the stream you desire.

So given the 5500w element has a R of 10.437, you can calculate different amps, wattages, and voltages:

P = V^2 / R, so 220v gives us 4621 watts, and to get 4000 watts, we'd need to push 204.7v [V = sqrt(P X R)]


If you have a 4000w element, using 14.4 ohms as your "constant", you'd need 240v for 4000w (duh!), and 1697.v for 2000w.

This for those of you who don't have a chart for your element, and if you care. One reason I can see someone wanting to know is if they wanted to determine the cost of a run.

[F6Hawk]

I don't have my element and nipple handy, but is the NPT thing really an issue? I'd imagine that the short nipple combined with the shallow threads on the element would cause the element to bottom out against the gasket before the threads came close to locking up...

[Jimbo]

I went with the voltmeter because it just connects easily with 2 monitor lines. An ammeter needs a shunt or a current transformer. More crap to mount in the box.

[marshrunner757]

How long did it take the SCR to come in?

Pretty quick. Maybe 2 weeks or less

Cool. Just ordered one!

[corene1]

This might help others with different size elements...

For your power input decision, it depends on whether you incorporate a volt meter as Jumbo has, or an ammeter as others have done. You also have to know the resistance of the element, R, which is given by R = V^2 / P (watts). So a 5500 watt element at 240v has resistance of R= 10.473 ohms. A 4000w element at 240v has an R of 14.4 ohms. You have to know this resistance to calculate both amps and watts as voltage changes, or watts and voltage as amperage changes (depending on which meter you buy). Of course, it all becomes moxnix because you don't really care that a voltage setting of 148v equals XXX watts, you only care that 148v on your meter gives you the stream you desire.

So given the 5500w element has a R of 10.437, you can calculate different amps, wattages, and voltages:

P = V^2 / R, so 220v gives us 4621 watts, and to get 4000 watts, we'd need to push 204.7v [V = sqrt(P X R)]


If you have a 4000w element, using 14.4 ohms as your "constant", you'd need 240v for 4000w (duh!), and 1697.v for 2000w.

This for those of you who don't have a chart for your element, and if you care. One reason I can see someone wanting to know is if they wanted to determine the cost of a run.

I took a foreign language class once, it looked about the same as the formulas you got there.
so R=V^2/P Meaning R is resistance V is voltage P is watts What does the symbol ^ mean in the equation. I am not a math person but am a good student.

[F6Hawk]

V^2 means voltage squared. (V^3 would mean voltage cubed) It's how you show exponents in web-speak, sorry if it was cornfusing.

P = power, measured in watts. I is used for current, measured in Amps.

[Jimbo]

Its simple 'Ohms Law' stuff Corene. Do a google on it and youll be an expert in 20 minutes. Once you know a couple basic equations you can make the others by substituion.

Or just use this chart...

If you know Excel you can plug these equations in to make tables, charts, graphs whatever you need. If you dont want to mess with it or dont have Excel and need something just let me know, always happy to help where I can.

[Jimbo]

OK folks, here's some stats on how this baby runs. Just finished the first stripper run.

I loaded in about 12 gallons of 8% ABV wheat AG and threw on the coals (the wash was about 66F). Measuring 240V at the element it was the full 5500W the element can produce. It took 36 minutes for the run to start and 44 minutes for a full heavy stream. Thats less than half the time it took me with my propane burner roaring.

As things settled in and stabilized I was pulling quarts at 5:10 minutes a piece yes thats too fast, even for a stripper. My 40" leibig knocked it down just fine, but did need a faster water rate than typical, definitely not a trickle. Here's some measurements -

12gal 8% wash
36 min to run start
5500W 5:10 per quart
4000W 8 min per quart
3000W 12:15 per quart

The entire run took me 2:15. Much faster than propane. About half the run was at 3000W and then I bumped it to 4000W and ran at 8 min/quart to finish up. The wash was somewhat cloudy, squeezed it off the grain only yesterday so it settled some but not completely. No signs of scorching whatsoever. For the spirit run I expect Ill be down around 2000W give or take.

All said, I couldnt be happier. No propane expense, fumes, door open when its 10F out, just the hum of the element doing its thing and the fan on the controller box keeping things cool. Also ran all the way down to 10%, ended up with 2.7g right at 30% avg.

Cheers.

[corene1]

OK folks, here's some stats on how this baby runs. Just finished the first stripper run.

I loaded in about 12 gallons of 8% ABV wheat AG and threw on the coals (the wash was about 66F). Measuring 240V at the element it was the full 5500W the element can produce. It took 36 minutes for the run to start and 44 minutes for a full heavy stream. Thats less than half the time it took me with my propane burner roaring.

As things settled in and stabilized I was pulling quarts at 5:10 minutes a piece yes thats too fast, even for a stripper. My 40" leibig knocked it down just fine, but did need a faster water rate than typical, definitely not a trickle. Here's some measurements -

12gal 8% wash
36 min to run start
5500W 5:10 per quart
4000W 8 min per quart
3000W 12:15 per quart

The entire run took me 2:15. Much faster than propane. About half the run was at 3000W and then I bumped it to 4000W and ran at 8 min/quart to finish up. The wash was somewhat cloudy, squeezed it off the grain only yesterday so it settled some but not completely. No signs of scorching whatsoever. For the spirit run I expect Ill be down around 2000W give or take.

All said, I couldnt be happier. No propane expense, fumes, door open when its 10F out, just the hum of the element doing its thing and the fan on the controller box keeping things cool. Also ran all the way down to 10%, ended up with 2.7g right at 30% avg.

Cheers.

Outstanding! . I did a 7 gallon stripper yesterday and it took about the same amount of time using my propane setup, and I have never been able to put out enough heat to get to a quart in 5 minuets. I am sold for sure.

[humbledore]

That is amazing Jimbo...can't wait to get my electric up and running. Even though I am starting small with 110v and a quarter barrel. Thanks for this thread.

[bellybuster]

every time I run my electric setup I wonder why I ever even tried propane.
I am now in the process of converting my all grain brewery in to electric.
Congrats Jimbo, enjoy'er

[ezlle71]

I have a quick question, i got a copper i inch slip to 1inch npt adapter. i cut the slip part off so the wavy part of the element would fit thru it. Do you guys think a copper coupling like this would be strong enough to use for a element in a keg? I am planning on using sliver solder and a oxy acetylene torch. Having a hard time finding stainless couplings locally. On a high note i did get a ulwd 5500 watt camco wavy element from a local plumbing wholesale place for 22 bucks!!
ez

[Jimbo]

Several folks have PM'd me asking about how this is wired. I drew this up, hope it helps.

For the Keg side dont forget to ground the keg itself. I drilled a hole in the bottom skirt to attach ground. See below. Also dont forget to ground the control box also, its easily missed in the drawing above.

Cheers,

Jimbo

[Prairiepiss]

OK folks, here's some stats on how this baby runs. Just finished the first stripper run.

I loaded in about 12 gallons of 8% ABV wheat AG and threw on the coals (the wash was about 66F). Measuring 240V at the element it was the full 5500W the element can produce. It took 36 minutes for the run to start and 44 minutes for a full heavy stream. Thats less than half the time it took me with my propane burner roaring.

As things settled in and stabilized I was pulling quarts at 5:10 minutes a piece yes thats too fast, even for a stripper. My 40" leibig knocked it down just fine, but did need a faster water rate than typical, definitely not a trickle. Here's some measurements -

12gal 8% wash
36 min to run start
5500W 5:10 per quart
4000W 8 min per quart
3000W 12:15 per quart

The entire run took me 2:15. Much faster than propane. About half the run was at 3000W and then I bumped it to 4000W and ran at 8 min/quart to finish up. The wash was somewhat cloudy, squeezed it off the grain only yesterday so it settled some but not completely. No signs of scorching whatsoever. For the spirit run I expect Ill be down around 2000W give or take.

All said, I couldnt be happier. No propane expense, fumes, door open when its 10F out, just the hum of the element doing its thing and the fan on the controller box keeping things cool. Also ran all the way down to 10%, ended up with 2.7g right at 30% avg.

Cheers.

Congrats.

I think you will be closer to 1000w for your spirit run. Give or take.

[corene1]

Thanks for the wiring diagram. I am thinking of putting in an amp meter also. probably don't need to as I should be able to do the calculations with voltage draw,but I amstill a little hazy on electrics. Thanks again for all the help.

[Jimbo]

I made you a chart . Am meters are more of a pain cause there's a shunt to wire in. Not the end of the world tho.

[Halfbaked]

This is what mine looks like. The part I am not pleased with is it is 12 volt so I had to get a 110 to 12 volt converter. Can't tell you whether I like it or no cause I have not put it together yet. My thinking when I did it is I could put every number down on paper and it would be accurate where ever I was.

[Due51]

Thanks for the thread Jimbo. I've read as many threads on electric conversion as I could find and my head was spinning. I live in Michigan and didn't want to use a turkey fryer-type propane burner with my keg and Boka. I am somewhat clumsy and envision a disaster waiting to happen. Your thread has helped me immensely.

I ordered the SCR controller and will get the coupling and element next. I still have some questions:
1) do you have a picture of your coat hanger coil and rubber electrical tape enclosure for your element?
2) How did you ground out the box with the SCR?
3) I'm still unclear on how to wire in a fan.

Sorry if these are repetitive. I've literally spent this entire work day (plus with a few others) reading on this subject. I fear the unknown when it comes to something as critical as 220volt electricity.

Thanks again.
Due

[Jimbo]

Thanks Due, yes you need Due diligence when horsin with high voltage.

I dont understand your first question, rubber electrical tape enclosure for the element? wassat? There are pictures in the original post I made here. It shows the element and the box.

The box is grounded with a screw through thebox, ground lugs on all the neccesary wires and nuts to hold it all tight. See bottom left corner in the 2nd picture.

The fan is wired exactly as shown in the wiring diagram just below to a 12V power supply. The power supply is wired to Hot1 and Neutral (to make 120V), the output is 12V and powers the fan and voltmeters.