What did I do wrong??

ginzo · Post by **ginzo** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 11:51 am

Well, I filled the boiler with whatever was fermenting (or not) in my mollasses/sugar wash. I turned the sucker on and it slowly heated until it got up near 100 and then it got to 172 and up to 188 were it held. Stuff started coming out at that temperature, but it wasn't fit to feed the mother in law. It lit up nice, though.

So what did I do wrong? ideally, doesn't the mash need to be around 172? From what I understand the still should stay at that temperature and hold, right?

I had water rnning pretty well through the condenser and adjusting the flow didn't seem to affect the temperature of the head or what came out.

Please forgive my ignorant, stupidity and inexperience and give me some ideas for the next wash.

Thanks, kindly

pangea · Post by **pangea** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 12:33 pm

Where were you taking your tempreature readings from? That could be your problem.

ginzo · Post by **ginzo** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 12:42 pm

pangea wrote:Where were you taking your tempreature readings from? That could be your problem.

I had the probe right at the spot where the vapour crosses over to the condenser. But, in any case, what came out was not drinkable. It smelled of acetone and nothing like rum or vodka even after filtering. It still smelled bad.

rectifier · Post by **rectifier** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 2:43 pm

Did you clean it thoroughly first? With vinegar? Run a few batches of water through?

It could be residual manufacturing oils. Yuck.

You talk about 'stuff started coming out'... some of the first stuff that comes out IS acetone. And methanol and other things like that. It's called "heads". You do know to toss that stuff away, right?

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 2:53 pm

Please forgive my ignorant, stupidity and inexperience and give me some ideas for the next wash.

A good ol dose a reading the books will sort ya out.

ginzo · Post by **ginzo** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:27 pm

rectifier wrote:Did you clean it thoroughly first? With vinegar? Run a few batches of water through?

It could be residual manufacturing oils. Yuck.

You talk about 'stuff started coming out'... some of the first stuff that comes out IS acetone. And methanol and other things like that. It's called "heads". You do know to toss that stuff away, right?

I know about heads, tails and hearts. I am not that basic. I havent cleaned the machine, but I will tommorrow. I just cant imagine that that's the problem.

It managed to stay at 188 degrees, but that isn't the temp I want. At 173 nothing came out. Icollected what came out at about 500ml at a time in several jars. After about 8 jars of ecetone-smelling stuff I turned the works off.

Is the still supposed to drop in temp at some point? I still had quite a bit of wort in the pot.

Also, I may not have fermented correctly ewither. I have a sugar wash going now that should be ready tommorrow. This one was done right so I may try again tommorrow.

What surprised me was that out of a mollasses/sugar wash the distillate was almost clear. I expected it to be darker in color.

Will keep you posted.

Post by **Tater** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:35 pm

if it aint clear you for shore got a problem.

DBM · Post by **DBM** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 5:25 pm

ginzo;
Is there any reason why you can't turn the heat down untill you reach the desired temp?
I run my heat (propane) on high untill the temp starts to rise, then I turn it down and try to hold at about 170* to 173*, at this temp the forshots will be driping out and the temp will be trying to go up. After a few min I let the temp drift on up by it's self. It will usually stop at about 178 or 179* and the whiskey will be coming out in a small stream(bout the size of a toothpick). My heat source is set on it's lowest setting (any lower and the burner will go out). I just leave it at that setting and the temp will creep up little by little for the next nine hours, when it passes 200* I shut it off. Hope this helps.

ginzo · Post by **ginzo** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 6:24 pm

DBM wrote:ginzo;
Is there any reason why you can't turn the heat down untill you reach the desired temp?
I run my heat (propane) on high untill the temp starts to rise, then I turn it down and try to hold at about 170* to 173*, at this temp the forshots will be driping out and the temp will be trying to go up. After a few min I let the temp drift on up by it's self. It will usually stop at about 178 or 179* and the whiskey will be coming out in a small stream(bout the size of a toothpick). My heat source is set on it's lowest setting (any lower and the burner will go out). I just leave it at that setting and the temp will creep up little by little for the next nine hours, when it passes 200* I shut it off. Hope this helps.

My still has a single-power electric element iside. The only way I can hold the heat down at this point is by unplugging the thing. Now, I had an idea to attach a device that would automatically shut off the still at a certain temperature and turn it back on when the temperature dropped below that set temperature. However, I have been told not to do that so I didn't.
The temperature when you first turn the thing on does go up faurly slowly. Then it reaches about 150-160 and starts to climb rapidly then passes 172 and then goes to about 180 or so before it starts to dribble then it runs in a stream at about 188.

Are you suggesting that I unplug and plug the thing in to hold it at 172? maybe with a cutoff switch? Or should I attach the thermostat device to electronically hold it at 172?

Thanks.

Post by **Grayson_Stewart** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:01 pm

If I read your earlier posts right, you are distilling a rum wash, so I'm assuming you are not using a reflux column. Unless you are using a reflux column you are not going to see 172 - 174 consistenly. Not trying to insult you, but you do know the difference between what to expect with a relux and a potstill right?

ginzo · Post by **ginzo** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:07 pm

Grayson_Stewart wrote:If I read your earlier posts right, you are distilling a rum wash, so I'm assuming you are not using a reflux column. Unless you are using a reflux column you are not going to see 172 - 174 consistenly. Not trying to insult you, but you do know the difference between what to expect with a relux and a potstill right?

Yep, I wanted to run it as a pot still (my still has both options). The main question I have is how do I get good stuff if it is stuck at 188 degrees? Could the mash itself be defective (not the right gravity, maybe?). I have to admity that the wash I used was not the best measured and I had to re-start it with new yeast like 3 times.

I have a sugar wash going now that is gkg sugar to 20L water with turbo yeast running smoothyly.

Post by **Grayson_Stewart** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:19 pm

If you are running a pot still you will not see 172-174...it ain't gonna happen unless you distill the same thing over and over in a pot still. If you are running a potstill, the best or "middle cut" is gonna come across around 192 or 193 to 202 or 203 F. Its not going to be as high proof at the distillate you would collect from a reflux column at 174 F.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:22 pm

I had to re-start it with new yeast like 3 times

Friend' go and read the the e-manuals 3 times and save yourself a lot of trouble; If you want good product its going to take a lot more care than that, at all stages.

good luck

ginzo · Post by **ginzo** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:22 pm

Grayson_Stewart wrote:If you are running a pot still you will not see 172-174...it ain't gonna happen unless you distill the same thing over and over in a pot still. If you are running a potstill, the best or "middle cut" is gonna come across around 192 or 193 to 202 or 203 F. Its not going to be as high proof at the distillate you would collect from a reflux column at 174 F.

Pkay, well my still was holding at 188 for a wehile before I turned it off. So should I let that go for a while until it gets to 192 level or higher? maybe I will try that.

Post by **Grayson_Stewart** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:27 pm

Your still went to 188 because that was the lower alcohols coming off first (the heads). The temps I listed are a ballpark number because the temperature of the vapor depends on the alcohol percentage in your wash. Sounds like you shut your still off before you ever even got to the good part.

Really, seriously....read the homedistiller.org section on using a pot still to get a semi solid grasp on how to use the tool you have. Then come and ask everyone to fill in the gaps. Knowing the alcohol percentage of your wash, the temperature of the vapor as it comes across, etc is not fill in the gap stuff if you read that a few times. No disrespect intended.

ginzo · Post by **ginzo** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:31 pm

Grayson_Stewart wrote:Your still went to 188 because that was the lower alcohols coming off first (the heads). The temps I listed are a ballpark number because the temperature of the vapor depends on the alcohol percentage in your wash. Sounds like you shut your still off before you ever even got to the good part.

Really, seriously....read the homedistiller.org section on using a pot still to get a semi solid grasp on how to use the tool you have. Then come and ask everyone to fill in the gaps. Knowing the alcohol percentage of your wash, the temperature of the vapor as it comes across, etc is not fill in the gap stuff if you read that a few times. No disrespect intended.

Thanks. I know I have a lot to read still, but I was hoping to get some idea of what i did wrong sothen I could know better where to research the information. I think that i might have shut it off too soon as there was a lot of was left in the boiler.

I will read some more.

linw · Post by **linw** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:35 pm

In a nutshell, the temp of your vapour basically depends on how much water is in it. Your pot still is probably producing something like 70% abv which means that the composite temp will be reflecting the higher boiling temp of the 30% water. So, your 188 deg is reflecting that. The output of my still is 95% abv so it has much less water in it and the vapour temp is consequently lower at 172 deg. So you can't strive for the temp of 95% etoh. Trying to do so will lead you completely astray into the realm of trying to redesign the laws of physics by trying to lower the temp of a watery vapour.

Hope this helps so you can forget temps and concentrate on going forward.

ginzo · Post by **ginzo** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 4:35 pm

linw wrote:In a nutshell, the temp of your vapour basically depends on how much water is in it. Your pot still is probably producing something like 70% abv which means that the composite temp will be reflecting the higher boiling temp of the 30% water. So, your 188 deg is reflecting that. The output of my still is 95% abv so it has much less water in it and the vapour temp is consequently lower at 172 deg. So you can't strive for the temp of 95% etoh. Trying to do so will lead you completely astray into the realm of trying to redesign the laws of physics by trying to lower the temp of a watery vapour.

Hope this helps so you can forget temps and concentrate on going forward.

Yeah. I think I amgetting this now. The vodka had a slight off flavor, but I filtered it and am going to flavor it anyway.

Is 3.5 liters out of a 5 gallom wash pretty normal, though?

linw · Post by **linw** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 8:48 pm

3.5 l is about right. These figs are best guesses.

12% in 20 ltr wash = 2.4 ltrs of 100%
At around 70% mult 2.4 by 10/7 = 24/7 = 3.42 ish

Home Distiller

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