Firewood

hornedrhodent · Post by **hornedrhodent** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:15 am

Does anyone have any experience using firewood to heat a reflux still?
Is it possible to keep the heat input constant enough?
I'm planning to use a water jacket between the fire and the boiler.

FAROM · Post by **FAROM** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:39 am

Hi, and' the worse solution, not and' possible to regulate the power, it excuses my bad English

, ciao.

Rocky_Creek · Post by **Rocky_Creek** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:15 am

I used a water jacket on a pot still years ago, you have to keep replacing the water that boild off and thus change the termp at intervals. You might have another pot of hot water to fill from. Would it work? IO don't know, but I bet it would be a hell of a lot of work for what you would get.

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:22 am

there has recently been a topic about this subject
see also this

hornedrhodent · Post by **hornedrhodent** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 9:05 pm

Thanks for the info and links.
I guess my first run will have to be with a wash as I doubt I'll get much water evaporating using a water jacket. This should not be a problem as I didn't use any flux except for the boiler. I'll pre clean the copper scrubbers before loading the column.

If I cant control the temperature with the water jacket I'll make a steam generator and use steam to heat it.

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:51 am

peter uses glycerine, so not much of it will evaporate

hornedrhodent · Post by **hornedrhodent** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 5:43 am

Great idea - I'd be able to do a water run too - I'm assuming it would increase the boiling point of the water in the jacket.

I'm going around in circles here - I decided to build a still to get the raw material to make 100% ethanol so I could have a go at making biodiesel.
Now I need to make biodiesel to get the glycerine to run my still.

Brett · Post by **Brett** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 5:48 am

* 1 litre of new vegetable oil,
* 200 ml of methanol, 99+% pure
* lye catalyst -- either potassium hydroxide (KOH) or sodium hydroxide (NaOH)

im guessing ur ethonal replaces the methanol, myself id drink the alcohol and keep the heads (meths) for making the bio, that or use the main body for running the petrol genny

possum · Post by **possum** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 5:48 am

No personal experience on wood fired collumn.
Maybe just having lot of heavy steel (like the stuff woodstoves are fabricated from)around your boiler would help keep the temp more constant.

I'm sure you could do a stripping run on woodfire.
I bet propane and propane accesories would get'er done easier.

edit: Now I see...You desire a way out of the fossel fuel loop.

Post by **Tater** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 6:23 am

If I was to try it Id only use coals.Id also have a small shovel to add or remove a few either way.Id build furnace to let heat be applide to as much of the boiler as possable with a pice of cast or plate steel to set boiler on thicker the better And make sure to stay outta the wind.

hornedrhodent · Post by **hornedrhodent** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 6:30 am

Brett wrote: im guessing ur ethonal replaces the methanol, myself id drink the alcohol and keep the heads (meths) for making the bio, that or use the main body for running the petrol genny

I cant get methanol locally and I heard the Govt here is taxing it at the same rate as fuel. I was going to build a still from steel tailshafts and Al flyscreen etc but decided I'd better build a copper one in case the product is not suitable for fuel and I have to drink it.

Aidas · Post by **Aidas** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 7:20 am

in case the product is not suitable for fuel and I have to drink it.

Damn. I always thought that it should be the other way around.

In all seriousness though, does it really make sense to try to use the distillation process to make biodiesel or even biogas (biopetrol)? I mean, it's got to be more expensive both financialy and in energy terms, doesn't it? Also, why not use used frying oil (I've read a bit about its conversion into biodiesel)?

Aidas

Brett · Post by **Brett** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 7:43 am

aidas the process of converting oil into biodiesel needs the methanol/ethanol,
straight oil will mess the engine up pretty quickly.

currently biogas may work out around the same price as the pump gas even a little cheaper depending on the mash ingredients and not counting personal time put into it, but with bio diesel when the oil is free

i dont think it will work out to much more expensive than the stupid pump prices were gettin up to.

possum · Post by **possum** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 7:50 am

I belive the alcohol is just a component used in the production of the bio-desil, no distillation required to make the actual fuel. I belive a base works on the veg oil under a layer of methanol or ethanol. As a byproduct glycerin is formed or liberated from the oil, and floats in a layer of it's own.

maybe the alcohol stops the production of soap

Rocky_Creek · Post by **Rocky_Creek** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 7:51 am

On the other hand I keep my pit (barbeque) at a very consistant temperature with baffels between the firebox and oven, also controling the amount of air going in. Also you have to build up a bed of coals and feed wood periodically.

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 7:56 am

you could make an oven with bricks to keep the temperature constant
like an old bread oven

Brett · Post by **Brett** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 9:00 am

heat control isnt going to be as instantanious as using gas or electricity but i think it should be possible, iv been looking into a design using a Rocket elbow stove design in a old steel oil drum with perlite insulation and control (heat routing) flaps, rather than an open wood fire its more of a ultra efficient multi fuel stove design

junkyard dawg · Post by **junkyard dawg** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:22 pm

I like the idea of a wood fired steam generator. The steam can be easier to meter and control and provides less chance for burning grain/wash. Otherwise like Tater said, have a seperate fire and use the coals to heat the boiler. Much like a dutch oven cooker would do...

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:57 am

watch out with steam, it can be nasty (temperature, pressure,..)

hornedrhodent · Post by **hornedrhodent** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 1:56 am

possum wrote:

edit: Now I see...You desire a way out of the fossel fuel loop.

I like the idea of converting renewable solid fuel (wood) into a more useful (liquid) form.

Making a reflux still for potable product and learning to drive it should give me some experience for making a larger one for fuel.

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 10:34 am

I have a question. does anyone ever had constant-heat-problems with a gas element?
when the wind blows, the heat becomes a bit less intensive and I can hear that the boiling stops.

Brett · Post by **Brett** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 11:18 am

i put shielding (baking foil) around the bottom with a few air holes

my new boiler will incorporate this into the boiler complete with a flue pipe out the back at the top

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Sun Apr 16, 2006 4:07 am

do you mean aluminium sheets? and it works?

and can you pleace explain the second sentence? I don't get it, sorry
thank you

Brett · Post by **Brett** » Sun Apr 16, 2006 11:03 am

yep its aluminium baking foil, the shiny stuff in a roll you use around the kitchen

my new boiler is a 33ltr stainless stockpot and im planning to weld a skirt around the pot, about 1 inch bigger in diameter, sealed at the top and extending down to reach the ground while the pot is sat on top of the burner, at the top of the skirt i will place a large pipe to take the gasses out the brewing shed

meaning indoor distilation

.... this should also make the whole thing a little more economic on the gas use (less wasted heat)

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Sun Apr 16, 2006 11:24 am

ok
now i get it
can't you put your whole set up in an oil drum?

furball · Post by **furball** » Mon Apr 17, 2006 2:33 am

I noticed that as I was distilling in cold weather the take off rate would drop, especially when the wind blew. To aid in keeping the heat where it was needed I made a skirt for my still. The way I did it was to take some rubberized fiberglass welding blanket and screw it to a plywood disk that I cut. The disk was made about 6" larger in diamter then my still, so that when it was on there would be a 3" annulus around the body. I did this so that it would allow even heating all around the body, and as mentioned earlier to save on the amount of gas used for the run. It works very well and you can maintain even temperatures in the annulus even when the wind is blowing.
If I can remember I will try and get some pictures in the next day or two.

Furball