Hello

[Stillhead]

Hey,

I just joined the forum. I have been reading and getting into the hobby with the interest of neutral spirits. I have built my first still, which is kind of a mix of several designs. I hope the picture link that I am attaching will work:




I use SS scrubbers for column packing because I have not been able to find any decent copper yet.

When I distilled my first batch, I did not have reflux control, and I never liked the idea of having cooling pipes from the condenser running through the column.

So, as an afterthought, I bent up a double coil condenser out of 15ft of 1/4" copper tubing and ran it through a cap at the head of the still. The thermometer probe is kept cool this way, and provides more accurate readings, since it and the cooling coils run through the cap.

When I did this change, I was getting 92% ABV, and after 3 distillations and running the 40% diluted alcohol through a brita filter, I obtained a very nice vodka that was indistinguishable from storebought upon blind testing with friends and family.

You will also notice that I used several reducers and a 1.5" brass union to connect to the hot water tank. This was an upgrade from the galvanized that I used for the first batch.


The problem I am having now is that i cannot get a metallic taste out of the vodka. I cleaned everything with TSP and vinegar and have rinsed very well. I have been running multiple water batches through it trying to get rid of this bad smell, and have had no success since I changed to the copper/brass fittings at the pot/still connection.

I am disheartened and have been trying to find people with similar problems. Most people were using bad packing materials, so I have been running water without the packing hoping that that was what the problem was....It wasn't.

I hope you guys have some advice on what I am missing here. Thanks for reading...

Bryan.

[Stillhead]

Oh yeah,

and there used to be a link on the homedistiller.org page about treating brass to make it safe. I can't seem to find the information, but I wasn't quite sure if what I found was decent info or not.

Could someone please point me in the right direction for this info.

[Uncle Remus]

I seriously doubt that union is giving you a problem. Some guys soak brass fittings in peroxide. I got quite a few brass fittings on my reflux still, I've never got any metallic taste. I would say it's gotta be those scrubbers. Buy yourself some structured copper mesh. Brewhaus sells it.

[stoker]

what is the grey-metal piece made of (on the last picture)

[Stillhead]

Yes it is galvanized. I am trying to find a brass replacement, realizing that I am stupid for using galvanized at the top of the column. The thing is, is that the piece itself doesnt heat up since it is above the reflux condenser, and it doesn't smell like the inside of the still does. I also tried taking the reflux condenser out and capped the top with a piece of glass, but I am still getting bad tasting water.

Has anyone else distilled water and gotten this metallic taste consistantly?

I am wondering if that is just normal leaching of the copper and brass from the steam passing over so much copper.

If I pass this metallic tasting water through a brita filter, it removes the metallic taste.

I am also trying to find a store in Canada where I can find a good source of copper pads (Chore Boy seems to be a really good brand, but I am not sure if they are available province side.

Brewhaus canada is out of stock of copper mesh....Crap.

Thanks for the help guys. I am just puzzled, since the only change I made to the still was going from a galvanized fitting between the boiler and still, to copper and brass... It seems completely rediculous that the galvanized produced a decent neutral spirit and brass wouldn't.

I will not use the reflux condenser again until I have changed it out, and I am hoping that my still just needs a 'breaking in period'.

Thanks for reading. I apologize if I am missing something obvious here, but I am reading and researching alot and trying to learn this new hobby,

Bryan.

[stoker]

well, you found out galvaniced iron should not be used in a still
you tasted zink, mjam!

[Harry]

I'd like some more info on that hot water system you're using as a boiler.

1) What's the internal tank made from? Glass, steel, copper?

2) Did you buy it new, or is it a used unit?

3) If used, did you flush it out beforehand?

4) Did you remove the sacrificial anode?

All hot water systems contain an anode, a metal rod that dissolves. It's designed to reduce corrosion in water cylinders and pipework due to galvanic action or electrolysis. It is normally made from magnesium or aluminium and has a higher potential (positive) than the material it is protecting (negative) which is called a cathode eg. Vitreous enamel lined cylinder. An anode will "sacrifice" or "dissolve" in order to prevent corrosion of the material it is protecting. Its life span is limited and will decrease with the rise in temperature, worsening water quality and materials used in the system.

More info is required.

.

[birdwatcher]

I use two hot water heaters in my setup. One 113 liter for stripping and and a 20 liter for fractional distilling.

In both cases, the boilers are modified by removing the top and the fiberglass insulation from the top of the tank. This is where the magnesium anti corrosion device is installed. This is not needed and removed and you need the 3/4 inch conection for your steam condensing system.

The lower side connection is fitted with a ball valve faucet for draining and the upper side connection is seldom used other than an indicater that the boiler is full i.e when cleaning and is capped off.

The thermostat that controls the water temperature is not needed because we want the contents to boil, so it is removed.

Don't buy a heater with a top element because the boiler never will be full. The bottom heating element (3000 watt) should provide 6 liters of distillate per hour.

In the fractioning boiler the heating element(usually 1500 watts) is replaced by a 750 watt because we want a gentler boil in the fractioning process.

They work like a charm. They are neat and clean in your basement and with the distilling apparatus removed, look quite innocent to any observer.

G

[Stillhead]

Birdwatcher is right on the mark.

I removed the sacrificial anode and attached the brass and copper reducing couplings to fit the 2" column. The top hot water inlet I use to flush the tank since it has a 90 deg bend pointing to the top of the boiler. the bottom 'cold water intake' is used for draining when I clean out the boiler. The tank I bought new from canadian tire and is 43L capacity. It is made out of steel and then heated up to glass melting temp (~1300deg) and lined with glass. It seems to be an optimal boiler and I recomend anyone trying to make neutral spirit to utilize it. I learned of this from the late Dr. John Stone, and have modified the still from a couple of online directions. Namely the internal reflux still (which I very much disagree with running the condenser lines through the column) and a general reflux still design (I made up the reflux condenser as an afterthought since it saves headway in the basement).

I am still running water through, without the reflux condenser attached and I am still getting a metallic taste to the distilled water. Damn.

I am missing something.

Thanks for any help guys,

Bryan.

[markx]

Get rid of the galvanized metal top on your column and you should be fine. When you run water through the apparatus you alway get a sorta metallic taste to it.....it's the packing and it's quite inevitable. I was worried about it too when I was testing my first reflux still but it's ok. When running spirits the taste did not carry over.

[goose eye]

yup get rid of that galvanized plug

[Uncle Remus]

I think a metalic taste in distilled water is fairly normal. I've gotten that out of mine too, even from my pot stills that are 100% copper other than the boiler. But like the others said lose the galv. plug.

[Stillhead]

I changed to a brass 2" plug. I also changed the valve control from the standard 1/4" compression fitting needle valve from Home Depot to an aquarium valve I had lying around.

There is much more control with an aquarium valve. Problem is, is that I don't think they are stainless steel, so I am not sure about their effective lifetime.

I will try running tonight.

[hornedrhodent]

="Stillhead"

I learned of this from the late Dr. John Stone,

Bryan.

What did the late doctor die from?

[trippvc]

from everything i've read & all the plans i've seen it is my opinion on your set-up that your thermometer needs relocating. you are not going to get an accurate temp of the vapor coming out of the boiler w/therm. above the condensing coil. proper location should be BEFORE the condensor. my condesor knocks down ALL my vapor even on water-only runs. on your metallic taste it could be the boiler itself. or connections. tripp

[birdwatcher]

="Stillhead"

I learned of this from the late Dr. John Stone,

Bryan.

What did the late doctor die from?

---------------------------

I was tempted to say alcohol poisoning, but not respectful.

I got to know him personally when I lived in Ottawa. He was retired from Canada's National Research Council, living in Aylmer Quebec, just across the Ottawa River.

He had a Phd. Chemistry, University of London and his specialty was distillation. His hobby was making vodka in his basement and he wrote books on the subject. See: http://www.gin-vodka.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

This was back in the mid 90s and he was no spring chicken then. My guess is he would be well into his 80s when he died, but I don't know exactly the cause of death. We both moved and I had not spoken to him for a couple of years.

If your interest is making quality 95% ethanol, with no need for charcoal filtration and you want vodka at about $1.00 for 750 ml( a quart), I recommend you buy his first book, Making Gin and Vodka and follow his instructions to the letter.

I have been doing so for nearly 10 years and only lately, because I am upping my production, and finding this super website, have I begun to question his recipe for a simple sugar wash.

He insists, that sugar, water and bakers yeast and starting SG 1.06. 30C-35C is all that is required to achieve the above.

Could this be improved in some way. After doing a lot of reading, I am wondering if starting with a 23 liter solution:

I. adding a nutrient
1a. Tomato paste, if so how much. I am trying 1 cup presently
1.b Wine store nutrient (which of the two is better?)
2. adding lemon juice or lemon juice extract. If so how much using one or the other and why.
3. Increasing the SG to 1.09(I have begun this already for a higher ABV.

Finally; I grow about 75 lbs of raspberries annually. I am making vodka weekly, at the moment, to prepare for next July.

I want to make a quality raspberry liqueur and would appreciate a recipe.

Thanks to all of you who have supplied me with valuable information to date.

George

[Stillhead]

The temperature of the vapour that are let through is measured at the still head, just after the reflux condenser and before the vapours cross to the main condenser.

[erbachem]

Hiya,

Just a thought about tracking down the metallic taste. Have you tried removing the column and boiling water in the cylinder? You could catch some condensate by holding a glass over the top and check it for a metallic taste. Follow this up by pouring boiling water over each component of the column separately and then do a taste test. In theory, it should help you narrow down which portion of your setup is imparting the flavour.

[Stillhead]

that is a good thought erbachem. I found that replacing the galvanized cap and running alot of distilled water fixed the problem, since I think that the metallic taste in distilled water through a copper still is normal.

Appreciate the thought,

Bryan.