Corn Whiskey On Oak

[PNW Smoker]

So I thought I'd put some on charred oak just to see what I'd come up with. It think I cut it down to about 95 proof give or take a bit. I'm sure this has been done time and time again by others though. Who has done this and what were your results?

Below is after 24 hrs in warm weather. Notice the oak is floating




Below is after about 20hrs in the freezer. Notice the stick is not floating anymore



I'm not sure what I'm going to end up with but I hope it's good to drink.

[BW Redneck]

Any wood used takes about 24-48 hrs. to sink, regardless of temperature.

Looks nice.

[Superking]

Is that how much oak we're supposed to be putting in? I haven't been putting in nearly that much out of fear of over oaking.

Is there any kind of chart that gives a good idea of how much oak to put in by volume of alcohol?

[PNW Smoker]

Any wood used takes about 24-48 hrs. to sink, regardless of temperature.

Looks nice.

So have you done this before? If so how did it turn out?

PNW

[PNW Smoker]

Is that how much oak we're supposed to be putting in? I haven't been putting in nearly that much out of fear of over oaking.

Is there any kind of chart that gives a good idea of how much oak to put in by volume of alcohol?

I only put in a piece 5 1/2" long by 1" wide by 3/4" thick. I figured if the big boys use a whole barrel I can use a little stick. I could be totally wrong with that thinking but time will tell.

How have your set ups go like this and how much did you use?

[wineo]

I usualy oak at 65% because it gets done faster.The more you use,the faster it gets done.I just do it by color,and taste.When it gets some color,taste it,and see what you got.when you get it where you want it,take out the oak.I use jack daniels barrel chips,and use a handfull or 2 per gallon.It only takes a day or 2 to get it where I like it.I dont even put it in the freezer.It depends on your oak too.I do it by taste.Thats how I make my cuts also.
wineo

[Superking]

I only put in a piece 5 1/2" long by 1" wide by 3/4" thick. I figured if the big boys use a whole barrel I can use a little stick. I could be totally wrong with that thinking but time will tell.

How have your set ups go like this and how much did you use?

I have a small still and can only turn out fairly small batches (about 3/4 of a fifth at best diluted down to about 120-140 proof). I usually put in about 3 or 4 pinky sized deeply toasted sticks. In about 24 hours I get pretty close to the same coloring that you have. I have one right now that I've been aging for about 5 days that has the same coloring as Wild Turkey. The flavoring turns out pretty good for individual batches, but I blend my batches of whiskey with other batches to get the flavor I'm looking for.

I'm new to this though, so I'm probably not someone you should listen to for advice. Hopefully, some of the old pros on here can give us both advice.

[PNW Smoker]

I usualy oak at 65% because it gets done faster.The more you use,the faster it gets done.I just do it by color,and taste.When it gets some color,taste it,and see what you got.when you get it where you want it,take out the oak.I use jack daniels barrel chips,and use a handfull or 2 per gallon.It only takes a day or 2 to get it where I like it.I dont even put it in the freezer.It depends on your oak too.I do it by taste.Thats how I make my cuts also.
wineo

wineo do you make yours from a UJSM run or from something else?

As for the oak I used I had an old oak board I bought from home depot to do something with but never got around to using it. I think it's probably white oak but I'm not sure.

PNW

[PNW Smoker]

I use jack daniels barrel chips,and use a handfull or 2 per gallon.
wineo

Where did you get those from?

PNW

[CoopsOz]

Where did you get those from?

PNW

You can get them at most of the chain homebrew shops here in Oz, incredibly expensive for what they are though. About $8 or $9 for a 200g bag. I've found smaller independent home brew shops have better deals on the wood. Also, look for a local cooper, I know Rudi gets his for next to nothing that way.

[wineo]

Those jack daniels chips are sold for smoker chips.I buy them at walmart in the same place they sell charcoal.There jack daniels barrel staves that have been ran through the chipper.I have used them on UJSM,and other whiskeys,rum,and brandys.
wineo

[Tater]

Is that how much oak we're supposed to be putting in? I haven't been putting in nearly that much out of fear of over oaking.

Is there any kind of chart that gives a good idea of how much oak to put in by volume of alcohol?

Might wanna give flavoring section of parent sight a read.Should find some of what ya been asking.

[PNW Smoker]

Those jack daniels chips are sold for smoker chips.I buy them at walmart in the same place they sell charcoal.There jack daniels barrel staves that have been ran through the chipper.I have used them on UJSM,and other whiskeys,rum,and brandys.
wineo

Now that you say that I remember seeing them. Thanks for that I will have to get some soon.

Do you ever add anything else with the chips? Maybe sugar or something like that to give it the ol' crown taste or Pendleton sweetness.

Thanks again.......PNW

[PNW Smoker]

Is that how much oak we're supposed to be putting in? I haven't been putting in nearly that much out of fear of over oaking.

Is there any kind of chart that gives a good idea of how much oak to put in by volume of alcohol?

Might wanna give flavoring section of parent sight a read.Should find some of what ya been asking.

Before you say it again I'm reading the parent site right now.

[CoopsOz]

PNW, if it were I, I'd chip up the oak. There will be more surface area getting to the spirit plus the wood wouldn't have to work as hard IOT get all the goodies out of it.

[wineo]

Try adding a little honey,or oloroso sherry,or a little of both.Ive tried quite a few things,and those 2 are my favorite.Brown sugar seems to cloud up the booze,so I dont use it for flavoring.Demerea sugar clouds it up too,but its great in the ferment.
wineo

[Husker]

2 things I have found that really add body to a corn whiskey, is just a touch of real maple syrup (the "real" kind), and just a touch of real vanilla extract. On both of those, it is only a touch that is needed. It adds a good "finishing" touch. About 6 drops vanilla extract (the good stuff), and about 15ml of maple syrup for a gallon of 95 proof oaked corn whiskey will add a lot of "body" and really finish the product out nicely. One can mess with the actual amount of either additive, to get the taste you want.

I have found that the actual amount of each of these adjuncts which make the flavor I want, will vary, depending upon the oaking, and the flavor/bouquet added during that process.

H.

[PNW Smoker]

Thanks for all the great info guys. I had a glass on the rocks last night. To be honest I was a little afraid of what I was about to taste. To my pleasant surprise it was wonderful. The oak taste came through a bit heavy but I think if I ad some vanilla and maple suryp as said above that should finish it out perfect. Oh yeah I got a buzz on quick too.

Thanks again for all the replies. I'll post some more pictures after I finish it up.

PNW

[pintoshine]

I just wanted to add, if you get a full flavored corn whiskey, not UJSM which is one the very light flavor side, or a really heavy rum made from 100% blackstrap, you cannot over oak it. There will be enough flavor to make it sweet and vanilla and not need any other flavorings.

[PNW Smoker]

So I added some vanilla and some maple syrup (but not the good stuff). I've also removed the oak. I cut down to 40% and gave her a good shake / mixing. Gave it a few sips and it's pretty decent I'd say. The oak flavor comes through pretty heavy as the after taste. Do you guys think the oak flavor will calm down if I let it rest for a couple of weeks or am I stuck with what I got? Either way for my first try I'd say it turned out pretty decent.

I'm going to start another one this weekend but I think I'll go pick up some Jack oak chips and use those instead of a piece of random oak. I forgot to take pictures but I'm assuming everyone has seen this type of thing enough time.

PNW

[Husker]

Sounds like you are on your way.

Be sure to document what you did, and then how the final result ended up. Then each time, you document, and after a few "runs", you will have a process that makes really good stuff, and something that you can say is uniquely your "own".

H.

[blanikdog]

PNW, if it were I, I'd chip up the oak. There will be more surface area getting to the spirit plus the wood wouldn't have to work as hard IOT get all the goodies out of it.

Yairss Coops, that's how I do it too. We aussies are such clever bastards.

[PNW Smoker]

Well it's been a few weeks since I started this little project. I've got this corn whiskey in a bottle and it's been hanging ten with a cork in it. Every once in a while I give it a smell just to see if it's changing at all. To my surprise it seems it really has.

I've had mutiple friends give it a taste and everyone seems to think it's good. I figure I'll give it some more time then mix up a whiskey and diet coke one of these evenings. If that goes well I'll be setting up a gallon batch shortly.

PNW

[blanikdog]

The last time I tried using charred oak the whisky tasted like burnt wood. I swore I'd never try it again, but now that I'm a year older I think I will give it another try.

After reading the parent pages and the posts above I suspect I put in far to much charred wood. This time I'll use less for longer and taste regularly.



blanik

[tonkyman]

Well! I thought I'd add my two cents worth to this topic.

Let me tell you up front that I'm not an expert on oak aging but I've made enough mistakes I can tell you what to avoid and what works for me.

First, the oak seems to work better if it has weathered until it darkens a bit. This seems to wash away some of the tannins that make your whiskey bitter. Makers Mark says their barrels are made from weather aged oak for that very reason.

Second, the percentage of alcohol makes a HUGE difference. Once you get over 60% you will start getting flavors out of the wood that you may not care for. I like to age light whiskey at 50-55% and bourbons 60-62%. I like my heavy rum on a dark toasted oak at 55%..... but that's just me.

Third, charing is more than just burning wood. The oak needs to be charred with a hot flame (like map gas). The science to charing is to form caramel out of the sugars in the wood and to enhance the vanilla flavor without it being to smoky. A lazy flame will make the wood have a burnt wood smoky flavor and I really don't care for that. I use 3/4 X 3/4 x 5 inch "fingers of wood and I hit it with my torch until I get a nice alligator char on all sides then I quench it in water very quickly to stop it from burning and activate the charcoal. Jim Beams barrel maker flames the wood and then sprays it with water to put out any flame and they say it opens the pores or the charcoal and activates it. I don't know if that is true or not but that's how I do it and it works for me.

Fourth, always error on the side of to little oak. When oaking any whiskey start with a little oak, watch and taste for a few days. It's easy to add more if needed but harder take away when you've over done it. If you over oak you can cut with neutral spirit or un-oaked whiskey of the same type to taste.

Fifth, air makes a difference. Not sure air is the correct word but dissolved oxygen may be the correct term. Barrel aging allows the natural expansion and contraction of the alcohol to move in and out of the wood leaching the vanilla and caramel from the behind the char and absorbing oxygen in the porous wood. There is a chemical change that takes place in the whiskey and it requires oxygen. There is a paper over on the yahoo distillers group files that talks about the chemical change and the time line for that change, it's a good read. Anyway, I age my whiskey in one gallon glass jugs and I pour it from one jug to another every month or so (until I get the flavor I'm after).

One last thought. Don't just use oak. There are lots of really nice flavors to be gained from other woods. I love a little apple wood (small amount) in my bourbons, it really rounds out the flavor. Pepper corns when used in small amounts really dress up a whiskey with a subtle complexity.

That's about all I have. I'm sorry for being so long winded.

I hope this helps.

[Woody_Woodchuck]

Excellent tips Tonkyman. I never thought about charring fast over slow and water quick to cool and activate. Prolly why I always got a burned taste when using charred oak, I roasted slow. The ABV% thing I think I always considered but I have a hard time diluting any batch prior to drinking. It is what it is and I deal with it as it is. Maybe I’ll have to leave my old schoolin’ behind and try some new techniques. Gona be reeeeel hard for me to corrupt a batch though.

[tonkyman]

I'd like to give credit where it's due. I learned about using a hotter flame to char the wood fro pint-o-shine. it was in a post on another forum but I've been doing it that way for a while now and it works MUCH better that the propane torch I was using.

Thanks Pint!!!

Humbly,
Tony

[pintoshine]

You are very welcome. Tonk...

[blanikdog]

Point three may solve my burnt wood problem. Thanks tonky.

blanik

[As-Ol-Joe]

Husker, I tried your vanilla and maple syrup idea on a pint of oaked corn whiskey. Used 6 drops of vanilla and 10ml of maple syrup. I could hardly taste the flavors. It maybe my taste buds (throat has been sore).

Do you let it sit for a while before drinking or does that matter?

I like both flavors, and I want to get the amounts right.