Rum Flavors

[Socrates]

As an avid rum drinker I have tried many rums from around the world. I do know that many commercial distiller's products are altered or flavored with all manner of natural and artificial flavors. For example, I think that sugar, vanilla flavoring, and peppery spices sometimes seem added.

I would be very interested in hearing from the many expert home distillers here, who I expect know the difference between distilled/aged flavors and those which are are added. For example I know that the products like Doorly's from Barbados is unaltered, while rums like Zaya or Diplomatico seem flavored (althouth they don't say so).

So my questions are: what unlabeled additives or flavorings have you found in commercial rums, and please do name the rum and suspected flavorings...

[homebrw311]

I'm by no means a connoisseur, but I find that many of the usual commercial rums are too.....um.......overly spiced for my taste.

For my rum, a little toasted oak, a touch of molasses (or carmelized sugar, after all, it's only for color) and the slightest hint of vanilla makes a great product.

I have a relatively neutral 20 litre oak barrel that I'm going to be retiring from winemaking once emptied - I think that will become the "rum repository" for the coming months. I should have enough to fillit shortly.

Eric

[Socrates]

Let me give an example. I often find that certain commercial rums have a hot peppery finish (something I like). I have always wondered whether "pepperiness" comes from the distilling or aging or whether it is "added" in the form of spices, or actual pepper later.

[Hawke]

They do add whole peppercorns to some of the spiced rums during aging.
Some of the junk they use for aging include cloves, pineapple, peppercorns, Cinnamon, nutmeg and citrus zest (orange, lemon or lime) just to name a few. Personally, I prefer a dark/heavy rum with no adjuncts. One of my favorites is Pyrat.

[Socrates]

Thanks for your post. Actually, Pyrat XO is one of the rums I had in mind. Most of the tasters I know - including me - like this unique rum, but tend to agree that it is noticeably flavored. For example the heavy, sweet orange tones. It is surely an example of a rum that has been altered, but that won't admit it.

[LWTCS]

I really enjoy the Venesualen anjeho "Pomparo".

Comes in a squat round bottle and usually a leather cover in the states.Probably $26 to $32.

Anybody care to speculate how those good folks get their product to,,,,,,finish up (and the like) the way it does?

If I could some day get close to that,,,,,,,,I'm sure that many of my friends would hold me in very high esteem.
But of course I'd get the evil eye from my wife!

[Hawke]

The only thing I can taste in Pyrat XO is the grassy taste of cane juice, instead of molasses. This can come over as citrus for many. Wish our bottle stores here would carry a few more of the smaller volume brands.

[Socrates]

Here's a couple exerpts of some rum reviews for Pyrat XO:

XO is definitely my favorite - lighter, smoother, more sophisticated. Its wonderful aroma is like an orange-apricot nectar. Touch of banana. Like a jam or marmalade with a deeper, thicker aroma than fresh. Or like jam cooking in the pot. I also picked up a nice roasted caramel, vanilla and a nutbread like almond. The XO's taste was smooth, creamy and is consistent, reflecting its orange/apricot aroma. The body is syrupy, like a caramel dissolving in your mouth. The finish is medium long, smooth, warm and peppery.

And...

Its warm, alluring aroma has a unique but not overpowering touch of fruity and spicy sweetness....overall complex variety of flavors of molasses, citrus (orange), vanilla, and maybe anise. Has an interesting overtone of whiskey...

Bottom line - this rum is known for it's peppery, syrupy sweetness with pungent aromas and tastes of orange/apricot, vanilla/banana and spices. Pure distilled rums simply don't present this way without being adulterated with additives or flavorings of some kind.

What I'm getting at - and would like to hear more about - are commercial rums that have been secretly altered or flavored, and with what? Honestly, the more I drink commercial rums, the more I think most of them are altered.

[punkin]

You can get most of those flavours from either the fermentation, the distillation or the wood aging (or a master distiller can anyway) without adding anything.

[Socrates]

Thanks Punkin... I agree most of these flavors/aromas can be achieved without additives - for example Doorly's or Mount Gay rums from Barbados. But the Pyrat is WAY over the top and I have no doubt it has been flavored.

I'm curious as to how you think these flavors are naturally produced without additives, in other words, from where in the process, eg...

Pepper finish?
Orange, leather - seems to come from aging?
Vanilla - aging
High, light fruit/floral - young, from distillation

These are my impressions. I'd love to hear from you and others with where different flavors and aromas develop. Also astringency, etc., the various qualities of rum that we enjoy. And of course, I'd like to hear the names of rums that you DO feel have been doctored, and with what.

For another example, I find 1 Barrel seem to be heavily flavored - thickly - with something like artificial maple syrup or butterscotch.

[Dnderhead]

why not try different yeast? as most ale yeast is fruity,spicy, they seem to have the most varied flavors.try different ones .
mite fiend something you like but of course if you run off at to high proof you will loose

[punkin]

Not a rum afficiado by any standards Soc, just mentioning that the flavours/aromas can be achieved other ways. I've never heard of most of the rums you are talking about let alone have any opinions on em and certainly wasn't arguing against your assertions, just listing another possibility for examination.

why not try different yeast? as most ale yeast is fruity,spicy, they seem to have the most varied flavors.try different ones .
mite fiend something you like but of course if you run off at to high proof you will loose

Put down a European Lager kit beer this evening Dunder, the taste and smell from the beer was fairly neutral when i first brought it up to level, but it came with a 15gm pack of lager yeast (usualy a 5g pack with extract kits here) that, when pitched dry, smelt like a rich ginger beer.
I've never got such a strong overwhelming aroma from a yeast before and called Bourbon Girl in to sniff it and ginger beer was the first thing she said. Just looked like pure dried yeast.

[Socrates]

Thanks, good stuff. Yes, I am a big afficiando of rum, own maybe 100 of em. After all that I came to the conclusion that many of them are really secretly doctored, and to be honest I take exception to that. I guess it's because I'm a purist - if I buy I single malt whiskey for example I want the pure, aged unadulterated product. Same with rum. And it's too dang bad most of em have been fooled around with and you don't know whether it's the rum or the flavorings you are tasting.

Personally I'm a big fan of all you home distillers who produce top quality pure product, and age it to your desires. Not that there's any problem with flavoring or adulterating a spirit, but that it needs to be done openly and honestly. And I suspect that most of us would not flavor a really, really good product. Like coffee, it's the lesser spirits that get altered to hide the fact...

Thanks again...

[punkin]

Yes, rum was the first spirit i tried to make myself. From all the flavouring advice i tried slices of mandarine in the wash. Turned out brilliant and i still have a couplea bottles that are 18 months old, but it took 12 months to reach any sorta maturity.

I now make rum with nothing but mollasses, 25% dudnder. water and yeast. I'm trying distillers yeast to see if i can get a cycle going with it. bakers only lasts two or three gens and then craps out, even using yeast bombs. There seems to be real acidic conditions form in the lees.

My new regime will see me dropping the yeast bomb, stripping wash and then diluting the charge with fresh wash to the 22% abv mark. this will give em a run at 1-1/2x that produces 63-65% rum after cuts.




ToFillA12MonthOld50LitreBarrellPunkin

[RumBull]

Subtle flavor can come from the yeast. Look here...http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... =11&t=7678
I agree that many rums are doctored. Pyrat is flavored and some form of sugar added. My bottle has crystals of sugar around the cork from evaporation. They don't distill their own rum, just purchase in bulk, flavor and sell. It is well liked and easy to drink. I can see why it is popular but may not be for the pure.
The leather flavor is found after the tails.

[Hawke]

One that was mentioned in another post was Gosling's Black Seal. Supposed to have some unique flavors. Guess I just don't have any taste buds, as I had a hard time picking out any oak, let alone any fruit/spice flavors. Just an overwhelming smell of heads.

[violentblue]

I read somewhere that appletons uses re-charred bourbon barrels, and thats at least part of the secret to their flavour profile.
not sure if they doctor it or not, but I'd like to figure out how to make something similar.

[bronzdragon]

I have to agree with some of the above posters. For rum, it's good to just make rum. It's just as easy as making a neutral, just different materials.

I've tasted several of the rum flavors, and some of them can be decent, but nothing compares to a good dark rum made with molasses and run into the tails for a bit....mmmmm.

And as far as the re-charring goes ... I do that also on my wood sticks. I use sugar maple and white oak in my rums. I use them once, then I let them dry out and re-char them and use em again. It works fine, just be sure to do a good deep alligator char on it. I use 1"x1"x5" sticks.

Also as far as rum flavors, I also like to put a few drops of real vanilla in my dark rum and a couple spoons of burnt sugar syrup.

cheers

~bd~

[muckanic]

I bought a bottle of Beenleigh white rum recently in a bid to improve my knowledge of the impact of aging & processing vs distilling. The only other whites we have generally available around here are Bacardi and various cane spirits. Initial impressions are that the label doesn't inspire confidence: "two years barrel aging", LOL! I'd say there is some vanilla and possibly some glycerol in there, but at least it is not sickly sweet and it is far more competently made than Bacardi from a perspective of heads bite. Actually, there is almost no reasonably-priced commercial spirit that I can think of that doesn't suffer from heads bite. I have some white schnapps that has received almost no treatment apart from the odd bit of aeration, and it lost its burn after about two years, so why in blazes can't the pros do better? The other thought that occurs is that wood is possibly not nearly as necessary as is commonly assumed for smoothing out booze.

But back to the topic at hand. I guess rum is a prime target for doctoring because some folks expect it to be spiced. Plus, if I see a rum that calls itself "Pyrat", then I start having visions of swashbucklers and all bets are off at that point! Some doctorings are possibly more acceptable than others. For instance, I can kind of accept a place for vanilla or caramel if someone doesn't want to try and get those qualities from wood, but glycerol is just flat-out cheating. Citrus in the wash is probably also OK, which makes one wonder what the objection to it is in the distillate.

[punkin]

The other thought that occurs is that wood is possibly not nearly as necessary as is commonly assumed for smoothing out booze.

I'm a strong believer in that statement, in fact i'm convinced.

I've found every time that spirits stored in a beer keg with a couplea sticks and a loose fitting lid will smooth out to the nose and tongue much quicker than the same size barrell.

[HookLine]

Pretty sure The Chemist made a comment a while back about how a lot of the benefits of 'ageing' come from just that, leaving it sit for a long time, independent of whether it is stored in glass, or stainless, or oak. I know my neutral improves over time, without any oak, just in glass, with a coffee filter held on with rubber bands.

[muckanic]

Without actually having tried it, I am always a little nervous that the coffee filter method of storage will diminish the proof with time. I am more inclined to chill the booze down every once in a while, and then slosh it back and forth between bottles a few times. Simply storing it in a bottle with a big head-space achieves something similar, with or without the distress temperature changes.

[HookLine]

Without actually having tried it, I am always a little nervous that the coffee filter method of storage will diminish the proof with time.

The proof almost certainly does diminish a little, depending on a number of factors, including how long it is stored for. That is what happens when spirits are stored in oak barrels, ie the 'angel's share'.

[Dnderhead]

"The proof almost certainly does diminish a little", Yes but I thank that is mostly "higher" alcohols that your loosing.

[bronzdragon]

When a spirit is new, I always let it sit in jars with coffee filters to let it air out and shake once in awhile for 24 hours. Then it goes into storage. I find that airing it out at first gives it a good head start on aging and tasting good.

~bd~