Whiskey Column Still

[chemeng]

Has anyone had success making whiskey with column stills? I've read Ian Smiley's book (Making Pure Corn Whiskey), and it looks doable, but from what I've read most people swear by pot stills.

I'm thinking of building a Nixon-Stone type reflux still with a 2 foot column packed with 6 mm ceramic Berl Saddles to make Whiskey. That'd be about 3 plates, counting the boiler. Given limitations of column stills (you can't run at total reflux), this wouldn't be quite as efficient as 3 pot distillations, placing the effectiveness of the column still purification at somewhere between two and three pot distillations, which is (I think) how most whiskey's are made. This wouldn't be good for making 190+ neutral, but for a dedicated whiskey/rum/brandy still I think it'd work.

Thoughts?

[Prairiepiss]

I think you are waiting your time. If you are wanting a single run whiskey. Then look at a plated column. Like a flute. Or a pot still with a thumper.

[heartcut]

I make excellent one-run whiskey using a packed CM column with the reflux coil in the vapor path as a dephlegmater. Don't have a flute so I can't compare them. Based on my experience, your idea should work. You might want to consider making it tall enough for neutral and using less packing for whiskey, but it should work either way.
http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 50&t=23172

[Prairiepiss]

I make excellent one-run whiskey using a packed CM column with the reflux coil in the vapor path as a dephlegmater. Don't have a flute so I can't compare them. Based on my experience, your idea should work. You might want to consider making it tall enough for neutral and using less packing for whiskey, but it should work either way.
http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 50&t=23172" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

There is a difference in a CM and a LM. A CM is better suited for what he intends on doing. A LM is not. A flute is a CM still just has plates instead of packing. And a CM is just a pot still with a dephlagmater.

By the way a slant plate boka would be a better LM build then a Nixon stone offset. Price and easy wise. Still not suited for your plans.

[Odin]

Heartcut, this is interesting! I have a CM. I tried to run Ian Smiley style, but was not happy with results. It gave me a very, very light whiskey. Eau de vie de whiskey. Tried it with feints from previous runs too. No success. Now maybe my problem is that my CM rig gives me 96.5% all the time. I don't seem to be able to detune it. Reading Ian Smiley, that should not be a problem. The better the seperation of a still, the more taste you should be able to get, he writes. What kinda abv are you putting out? Do you add feints? Curious to learn if there is a way to make my packed CM give me a one run whiskey.

Odin.

[blind drunk]

The better the seperation of a still, the more taste you should be able to get, he writes.

I've read that too but I just don't get it. To my way of thinking, in practice, one wants less separation when making whiskey but with better cuts and blending. Not knocking it, I just don't understand it.

[Prairiepiss]

Odin how do you have your cooling routed? I can tune mine down to anywhere between 75% to 95%

[Prairiepiss]

The better the seperation of a still, the more taste you should be able to get, he writes.

I've read that too but I just don't get it. To my way of thinking, in practice, one wants less separation when making whiskey but with better cuts and blending. Not knocking it, I just don't understand it.

That has to be a missprint or missing something?

[Odin]

Blind Drunk, Mr P,

No it is not a misprint. It is pretty much the central theme of his book: fractionate your whiskey and it will be better than anything else. With an LM.

Like Dunder, it goes against my intuition too. I tried it, got some results, but nothing close to what Ian claims (or what I get in a pot still). Halfway between vodka & whiskey. And adding more and more feints just made my heartcut smaller and gave me likker with a burning sensation. That is why Heartcuts post triggered me. Maybe he found the way Ian Smiley meant it?

Mr. P: I have got one of those old school thru tube CM's. One near the top, another only 1/3 up. Not the prefered aparatus on this forum, I know, but it gives me a great vodka at an incredible ABV at a fast speed. Now the only way to detune it is to get the packing out. But then it would not be "running a packed column" again. Just a slightly "upped" potstill.

Can't wait to see Heartcut joining in ...

Odin.

[Prairiepiss]

Ok how is the cooling flow routed? Odin.

[Odin]

Cooling water in through the low tube (copper tube thru copper column). After exiting the column the copper thru tube meets the lower part of the product condenser. The water flows up, in the cooling mantle, cooling gasses. Then at the top of the product cooler the water exits the product cooler and runs, by means of a copper tube, thru the column again. Some 5 centimeters under the take off point. Nothing fancy. But the small diameter of the column (as compared to the size of the thru tubes) and the dense packing make its performance abv-wise astonishing.

Hope this gives a clear picture.

Odin.

[blind drunk]

And adding more and more feints just made my heartcut smaller and gave me likker with a burning sensation.

I've had the burning sensation too, but it does go away. Hiding behind the burn is some pretty nice flavors and aromas. Takes 6 plus months and some oak. Don't fear the burn!

[Odin]

Blind Drunk,

So you tried this Ian Smiley LM style whiskey with success? Or is it a general statement also for pot stilled whiskey?

I know my oats whiskey was pretty harsh too. Even after some time on oak. Funny thing was that after filtering it, it still was harsh. And then I left it for a month and a half, allmost forgetting about it. And when I remembered and took a sip ... all of a sudden it was great.

?

Odin.

[Prairiepiss]

Ok gotcha. Wasn't thinking about that style where you can't separate the condensers. I can see where that would make it hard to detune.

For what its worth. I like mine better when it comes off between 80% and 85%. And I never unpack mine now.

[chemeng]

So it people are saying the LM (which I think means liquid management- like a nixon-stone type head) condenser is no good for flavoured spirits. Why is this? To me the big advantage of LM is that it's mechanically simple, easy to build, and easy to wrap my head around. I understand distillation theory well enough, but I'm new to all the home distiller lingo. To my (admittedly theoretical) knowledge, reflux over packing should be reflux over packing.

[Odin]

Mr. P,

If I try to detune, it doesn't work. It is pretty much all or nothing. Ashame, but that is the way it is.

Chemeng,

Where to start ... Maybe by inviting you to read a lot in the new to distilling section? It has to do with LM stills (or fractionating stills in general) to be very, very efficient in seperating different fractions. And giving you a high ABV. And taste becoming less over 80% ABV. Anyhow, there should be lots of info around on your question. Or others to step in that run an LM. Mine is CM.

Odin.

[chemeng]

Odin:
I've been using a what I now know to be a CM type still of my own design with a 1 foot column packed with 6 mm Raschig Rings to make whiskey, with pretty good results. The thing's on its last legs, and I've been itching to upgrade to something a little bigger and more robust.

A big advantage that I see in the LM is that you don't always have to be keeping an eye on the coolant rate, just set the needle valve where you want and you're good. Are you saying that this single-condenser set up it too efficient? Would shortening the column height (2 feet of berl saddles ---> 1 foot of berl saddles) fix that?
Chemeng

[heartcut]

Heartcut, this is interesting! I have a CM. I tried to run Ian Smiley style, but was not happy with results. It gave me a very, very light whiskey. Eau de vie de whiskey. Tried it with feints from previous runs too. No success. Now maybe my problem is that my CM rig gives me 96.5% all the time. I don't seem to be able to detune it. Reading Ian Smiley, that should not be a problem. The better the seperation of a still, the more taste you should be able to get, he writes. What kinda abv are you putting out? Do you add feints? Curious to learn if there is a way to make my packed CM give me a one run whiskey.

Odin.

Hey, Odin-
I use about a foot of copper mesh in a 2 1/2" diameter column (as opposed to 32" for neutral) and around 1 gph reflux (after equilibrating), take the hearts at pretty much potstill strength, then as the tails approach, slowly increase the reflux and heat till I'm pulling over 80%. The dephlegmater keeps back the wet dog stuff and lets a lot of flavor through. When I get done with this last part, there's only about 1/2 qt of tails (12 gal charge). I add the tails to the next run, but do the heads by themselves. The hearts are really light and the last 2 qts have a very strong, really good flavor, almost like a liqueur. The blend is excellent. I suspect part of the secret is a reflux coil in a dephlegmater position instead of above the vapor takeoff (so it rectifies the vapor before it heads to the condensor).

[Odin]

Mine also has cooling under the take off point and with mine it works the same. Light heads, heavier towards tails. Only, since I cannot detune, the overal flavour is still too light. I might try running whiskey in it without packing and see if I can get to a one run approach.

Thanx for the explain!

Odin.