Burner convert?

[Jimbo]

Hey Sungy, I tried to PM you but it kept bouncing back says you dont exist? Anyway, looks like you know about burners and fuel. I have a propane banjo burner that I want to convert to nat gas. Im pissing through tanks of propane like crazy with this hobby. Theres a gas line in reach. But what do I need to do to the burner? Can I drill out the orifice or some such?

[Sungy]

http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com ... _chrt.html
this will take you to a chart that will help in figuring what drill size you need.

[Sungy]

http://www.carlsgrilltalk.com/contents/ ... &Itemid=16

That should give you a reference to understand what you are asking about.

[Odessit]

Can I drill out the orifice or some such?

Yes, you need to increase the diameter, but not where the flame, and only where gas is supplied to the burner. If you tell me what the diameter of the holes for propane burner or heat or propane flow rate, I'll be able to calculate the new diameter for natural gas.
If You know the heat output (kW), diameter for natural gas (millimeters) is the square root of the power... With sufficient accuracy.
I'm not sure about the translation of mathematical terms.....
For example, the burner of cooker 1.5 kilowatts - diameter of hole is 1.25 mm.
Burner boiler capacity of 23 kilowatts - 5 mm.

If Tou know Old diameter (for propane), New diameter (for natural gas) = 1.67 * Old diameter.
For example, the burner of cooker has diameter of hole is 1.25 mm for natural gas, or 0.75 mm for propane.

Increasing the diameter above of calculation is not recommended because the gas will not burn completely, carbon monoxide and soot will be stand out.

This information is correct to the countries where the standard pressure of propane is 3 kPa, and pressure of natural gas is 2 kPa.
If you have any other standard, I can do another calculation.

[Jimbo]

Thanks for your help guys. Ill plumb in a straight on/off valve and I have an old multi turn gas needle valve for flame control, is that a good way to do flame control?

[Odessit]

Ill plumb in a straight on/off valve and I have an old multi turn gas needle valve for flame control, is that a good way to do flame control?

Yes, this is a good way to go, if you have iron balls

... I'm not sure again about accuracy of translate and my humor may be obscene...

Yes, this is a good way to go if you're not afraid to do it with no experience and training.

By the way, gas is my profession since 1984(my God, 28 years!!!), and I can assist You in solving this problem.

But i don't understand - what must be factor for controlling of gas flow? Temperature? It is not right, i think. It is impossible.

What do You think about it? How do You plan to control of gas (heat) flow?

[Odessit]

Two solenoid valve shuld be be used like this.

The first of them uses as main switch for close of flow of the gas when it is not needed, or when it is dangerous.
The second solenoid valve uses under control of device, who monitors of temperature, pressure or any other parameter, and opens / closes valve # 2 for stabilise this parameter (i name regime such this "start-stop").
Pilot burner ignites a main burner after opening valve # 2. It burns all the time after opening of valve # 1. If pilot burner goes out, the valve #1 must to be shut down automatically and fully close gas flow.

I drew and described the basic principle. It should be extended with security features.
Not all at once

I have practices in the gas business, but i do not have any practice in communicating in English. Therefore, I ask the indulgence perceive errors in my texts.
I would be grateful if someone will correct me.

Thank you.

[Durace11]

Odessit, your translation is fine, we have had worse. Very good information on the gas conversion. Two valves is a good idea, one for shutoff and one for fine adjustment.

[Jimbo]

Odessa,

Thanks for your help. Looks good. Your English is fine, far better than my Ukranian! Spasibo.

Nasdrovie,

Iron Balls

[Sungy]

If you are going to go that far ...why not salvage a gas valve and pilot assembly from a furnace or water heater. there is no need to convert anything just adapt a bracket to hold it and the valve to throttle with

[Jimbo]

Funny you said that sungy, I have a burner I ripped out of a busted water heater Ive been looking at. There's no orifice or anythign, just a pipe coming off the burner and with a compression nut on the end. Can I just feed this thing gas through a needle valve?

[Sungy]

you could I supose but...
The comment I made was related to the gas valve assembly from a furnace. It has the pilot vale built in and also has a solenoid valve built in for main gas. The pilot has a flame safety device called a thermocouple. No flame on the thermocouple, no gas threw the valves. Sounds like a much safer way to play. The furnace or water heater valve will have a safety on it to prove flame before lighting main burner. Where the gas exits the gas valve you can use a ball valve to throttle the gas flow to the main burner only, not the pilot. If you find you have trouble adjusting the flow change your ball valve to one size smaller. Smaller valves are easier to control but have a higher pressure drop.

[Jimbo]

Thanks. If this were something I'd light and leave the room I think its good idea for safety to have a pilot on a thermocouple. But there's no leaving the room in this hobby. And I dont want a pilot fire burning in my kettle cooker all day long anyway. My luck the dumbass cat would walk under it and catch her damn ass on fire. ...hey, there's an idea.

[NineInchNails]

Hey Sungy, I tried to PM you but it kept bouncing back says you dont exist? Anyway, looks like you know about burners and fuel. I have a propane banjo burner that I want to convert to nat gas. Im pissing through tanks of propane like crazy with this hobby. Theres a gas line in reach. But what do I need to do to the burner? Can I drill out the orifice or some such?

Why not go to Bayou Classic Depot (or give them a call) and they will hook you up with the proper natural gas orifice? They are small and likely cheap. They may even be able to recommend what the orifice size is if you ask. They should also be able to answer any questions you have about regulating the gas as well. It's usually wise to get the manufacturer's recommendation.