uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

[Odin]

It does not stink. It smells great.

Odin.

[Kentuckyman]

It does not stink. It smells great.

Odin.

Great....I have read a post or two about some AG batches that really reeked, since I hadnt read this about Uncle Jesses,
I was hoping this. Dont want to alarm the neighbors!

Kentuckyman

[Odin]

Making a beer for AG, mashing, ... well, I like that smell too. Only most others don't. And yes, that smell can be pretty invasive.

The only thinh that can be a bit smelly in an UJ is the fermentation process, but the same holds for fermenting an AG. And that smell is nothing compared to the smells occuring during mashing an AG.

Odin.

[Prairiepiss]

I would like to point out. UJSSM is not an AG mash. It is a sugarhead that uses grain as a nutrient and for flavor.

[Jimbo]

Making a beer for AG, mashing, ... well, I like that smell too. Only most others don't. And yes, that smell can be pretty invasive.

The only thinh that can be a bit smelly in an UJ is the fermentation process, but the same holds for fermenting an AG. And that smell is nothing compared to the smells occuring during mashing an AG.

Odin.

What kind of yeast are you using that make you say AG mashes can smell invasive? I think they smell great. Whiskey smells sweet and Bourbons smell like sweet corn. Could be the yeast your using produces some sulpher compounds. Thats fairly common with some yeasts, especially lager type beer yeasts, but thankfully its a temporary smell. The sulpher compounds dissipate after time, and the copper takes care of any left during distillation.

[Odin]

Hi Jim!

My bad. It is not the ferment that's smelly, it is the mashing that is. And I like the smell. Only the rest of the family doesn't!

The copper... it is really getting to you, isn't it? Glad to see I could shake up that brain of yours a bit!



Odin.

[Black Eye]

I agree... I let the last All grain recipe ferment in my laundry toom and it smelled wonderful. It smelled like a sweet corny bread. Used US-05 and the wifey never onced complained.... and she's has OCD issues with laundry, so she's in there A LOT. I love the smell you get when you first dump your 2 row or 6 row into the corn.... it instanly neutralizes the backset smell and you get a really nice grain aroma as you mix it all in.

but thats not UJSSM so I'll get back on topic. The sugar content in the UJSSM give off a different smell.... Smells a little more like apple cider and once you start adding the backset is does have a unique smell to it.

[Prairiepiss]

I also think it smells great nout my head in the bucket , and taste every chance I get

Don't stick your head in the bucket to long. The CO2 can lay you out on the floor. Before you realize what happened.

I think all ferments smell good. Well all but that palm sugar stuff.
If it doesn't smell good. It leads me to beleave something is wrong. And time to check it out. Making sure to run it as soon as I can. My wife doesn't always like the smell. But I do.

[Shae]

I also think it smells great nout my head in the bucket , and taste every chance I get

Don't stick your head in the bucket to long. The CO2 can lay you out on the floor. Before you realize what happened.

I think all ferments smell good. Well all but that palm sugar stuff.
If it doesn't smell good. It leads me to beleave something is wrong. And time to check it out. Making sure to run it as soon as I can. My wife doesn't always like the smell. But I do.

I found the first generation of this smelled pretty bad. Once everything balanced out, however, the aroma has gotten more pleasant. So if you first try this out and it smells nasty, don't assume the worst. But if it has been going for a while and then starts to stink, be concerned.

[Shae]

Sounds like youve got a handle on this shae, this recipe makes a nice drop as your finding out. Have fun and be safe

Yes, my ferments are going well and I am enjoying myself.

I ran my first spirit run earlier this week. I diluted my low wines with the backset of the last stripping run (I used some for the next gen and saved some in the freezer in case I needed to restart at some time in the future). Let the jars breathe for 48 hours and made my cuts. Even as a novice to all this, the heads and tails were noticeable. I think I do like the more subtle flavor from the spirit run than from the hearts of the stripping runs, although their bold flavor is quite nice, as well.

I kept the very deepest hearts for drinking as white dog (I do love this stuff), and made a blend with the jars closer to the heads and tails to age with oak. As those deepest jars are more volume than I can drink in the time it takes to produce them, I figure I'll just replace what I've enjoyed from the previous run and put everything else on oak. I may even get an oak barrel for aging...I should be able to produce enough to fill and replace a 5 gallon barrel by the time the previous fill is ready to come out.

[CornMealKid]

I have 20L buckets for fermentation. I guess because of the corn, 5 gallons of water do not make it into the bucket so I've opted to do 4 gallons of water, 7 Lbs of cracked corn, 7 Lbs of sugar... Anyone see any problems with this or should everything go smoothly, just a gallon less wash to distill in the end?

[Prairiepiss]

Should be fine. Remember you won't get all the liquid out you put in. The water and sugar will make about 4.5 gal and 11% potential. You add the corn in. You have right at around 5 gal total. Most 5 gal buckets won't hold 5 gallons for a ferment. Better off around 4 gallons total. To give you headroom for the ferment.

[Offshore]

Hello, a few months ago I did a 3 generation run of UJSSM, it was much to hot and sharp foe me, how ever I thought I should use up the rest of the cracked corn, 3rd generation is working away right now, however gen 1 and 2 is the same as it was a few months ago, sharp and hot, What I am wondering is I was to make wash with cracked rye or something and take them low wines and add them to the corn low wines, and then do a 2nd run with my LM reflux still, do you think this would smooth it all out? Hope this all made cense.
As always, thank you all for any help.

[acfixer69]

Hello, a few months ago I did a 3 generation run of UJSSM, it was much to hot and sharp foe me, how ever I thought I should use up the rest of the cracked corn, 3rd generation is working away right now, however gen 1 and 2 is the same as it was a few months ago, sharp and hot, What I am wondering is I was to make wash with cracked rye or something and take them low wines and add them to the corn low wines, and then do a 2nd run with my LM reflux still, do you think this would smooth it all out? Hope this all made cense.
As always, thank you all for any help.

Rye adds a peppery hot taste IMHO and you may want to try a wheat for the blend. I know cuts can make a world of difference. Rye is spicy.
AC

[Fastill]

Hello, a few months ago I did a 3 generation run of UJSSM, it was much to hot and sharp foe me, how ever I thought I should use up the rest of the cracked corn, 3rd generation is working away right now, however gen 1 and 2 is the same as it was a few months ago, sharp and hot, What I am wondering is I was to make wash with cracked rye or something and take them low wines and add them to the corn low wines, and then do a 2nd run with my LM reflux still, do you think this would smooth it all out? Hope this all made cense.
As always, thank you all for any help.

Some here say that if you use less sugar, keep it below 10% potential abv, closer to 8%, it will not be so hot.
Also how did you make your cuts. What ABV is it distilled at and what proof are you tasting it at?

[jtate-1]

I am having the same problem with sharpness in my product. On my 3rd gen of uj and just seems very sharp even cut at 40%. I've read all about cuts and it all seems the same to me. New at this so probably expecting to much. Frustrating spending 6 hours the still and not liking the end result. I have a cm still running in potstill mode. Still trying.

[Shae]

Rather than make cuts (other than fores) during your stripping runs, make your cuts after collecting in small jars from a spirit run. Run slow through the heads, and you'll get better separation. If you're running full out, you may just have so much smearing you really don't have much in the way of hearts. Let them air out for 48 hours first (it makes a huge difference). Start tasting from the middle and work to the ends. You'll then be able to notice the heads/tails flavors increasing.

I liked the flavor of a small amount of hearts from each stripping run, but I really prefer the less in your face flavor of the spirit run hearts. It seems more refined.

[Offshore]

Ok thank you all for your reply's and help, I think you may have answered my ? My starting SG ran any where between 1.080 to 1.090, to high.
Ok I am going to do a 4th generation with the corn, and get the sg at about 1.060, then mix all the low wines together and then do a nice slow
reflux run. What are your take on running it reflux? I know I will loos some flavor.

[Offshore]

I forgot to mention one thing, It don't pay to get greedy. now I know why the pros say, don't get greedy.

[Ayay]

Do your cuts every time on a spirit run. The cuts will sort out all variables.
Greedy comes in many disguises. First is fermenting to a higher ABV. Second is to skip the cuts and rely on post-processing to cover up.

[jtate-1]

I've heard i'm smearing product twice now so in doing the research I must be running to hot I'm assuming. I have a mile high cm still and have done all the recommended upgrades on the site. Even got a fancy 350.00 dimmer switch for free from a buddy to control my power input on the element, works nice. So running in potstill mode my second batch of uj and followed the recipe to the T and fermented out perfect. Charged the still full power till got some vapor then cut the power till I was getting 3 to 4 drips per second. Collected in pint jars each half full. started out at 75% collected down to 60% about 6 hours total and 9 half pint jars. I let air for 48 hours then started to try and make my cuts starting in the middle and working out. I notice very small differences in smell. Cut my middle jars to 40% with distilled water and taste and it just doesn't taste that great. Sharp tasting, bitter just not very pleasant. I was expecting something a little sweet with some corn flavor. I guess what i'm asking is am I expecting to much and should wait and put on oak to bring in more flavor. I want a good base to oak out and some honey and a little orange spice to to get a nice sipin drink, but ive read so much on here about garbage in garbage out and I don't want to play mask the shitty flavor game. Gonna try again my 3rd uj will be done soon. Thanks for any input.

[Bushman]

I believe you will always have some smearing if you run it that way. Doesn't sound like you allow it to equalize before collection. With mine I bring it up to temp and do 100% reflux for 45 min. to reach equalibrium then draw the heads out slowly (drip) so that it doesn't smear. Once I have reached the hearts then I collect at a bit faster rate (slow stream).

[jtate-1]

I understand that but I'm using the still as a pot still and not refluxing at all trying to maintain some flavor or is that wrong. really wanted a sweet corn flavor if possible. When I run in reflux mode with the column fully packed it goes straight to 90 95% alcohol and no flavor.

[Bushman]

Sorry I missed the potstill in the first read. Aging it on oak will make a big difference, make the cuts you think remove the largest heads leaving a bit of early tails for flavor. Give it 4-6 months and check it out should be much smoother. How do you plan on aging it on oak (barrels, chips, or staves)?

[jtate-1]

Chips that I bought at a brew shop. There a mix form jd, beam and wild turkey. Bushman you being the master distiller I have a question. The flavor that I drink in the bar is only what I have to go by. For instance I like the wild turkey honey flavor, Or a grand mardiea with a orange spice that's not spelled right lol and Ive been on the tour at Jim Beam which was very interesting and I know distillers age in barrels for months and years to achieve there flavor. So as i'm sure it is by reading through this forum to achieve a quality alcohol ourselves is what I produce coming out of the still going to always produce a sharp medicinal smell and taste to it that's needs to aged with something that's going to taste smooth, and I know theres nothing fast about this craft so i'm in no hurry. I guess I was expecting something different and I am very new at this and have much learning to do. I guess after I think about it we are just extracting alcohol from water which in my opinion just doesn't taste that good. I guess I ask because of my lack of experience and I've had what I thought was a good peach shine from WV but have since learned it was probably a neutral mixed with peach extract mixed with some water and sugar. I've got a 100 pounds of peaches in the freezer and don't want to waste them on lack of my experience. The peach shine I only know because I reproduced on my own and it tasted exactly the same. Thanks For your thoughts JT

[AlaskaHooch]

Can anyone tell me approximately how much stink is generated running a 10 gallon batch of UJSSM?

Russellc

Im like you Oden, My friends that come over tell me it smells like i am making bread. I have had as many as two, 6 gallon and one, 12 gallon mashes running at once and I never got any complaints.

AlaskaHooch

[AlaskaHooch]

Just checkin in fellas,
Been running this ujsm for a good while now. Started makin more than I could get rid of. have about 18 gallons sitting in the back room about 150 proof. think im just going to let it sit for a spell and check it in a few months to see how mellow it gets. So far I have some tempered down to 120 with oak sticks in it and I flavored some with molasses, coffee beans, oak stick and vanilla extract. My nephew cant keep his paws off it though. Decided to get some old whisky bottles on ebay and found some nice flasks to fill up and keep close by..... holy moly folks I sound like a real shine connoisseur dont ya think, LOL....anyway just wanted to let yall know what kind of mess im in... will check back in when I switch over to cob ... think when I have a good 20 gallon I will start to replace my spent corn with cob and go for another 20.... Keep shinning

AlaskaHooch

[Shae]

I've found that even after airing those 48 hours, it takes at least a week for the flavor to come into its own. I'm not a big fan of the flavor before then...it mellows and smooths out pretty quickly. Note that this will not actually be sweet, because there's no sugar in it. But I do find that the corn flavor makes it seem a little sweet, even though it really isn't. You also may not like the sour characteristic, which is definitely noticeable. With this recipe, that's pretty much unavoidable.

Throughout this thread, some people mention that they can't seem to get much flavor out of this recipe, and it seems their corn may be the issue. Perhaps try a different supplier for your corn and see if that makes a flavor difference...mine packs a wallop of flavor.

[Bushman]

jtate1 aging is the key give it some time. Aging on chips, staves, or small barrels as our hobby level limits us to has a good side in that you have more surface area that comes in contact pulling out the flavor faster. We can get a good drinking product in a much shorter time than aging in the large 55 gallon barrels. I would be patient leave it for 4-6 months. Once you build your quantity and are able to age a year plus it even gets better. Do a search for Solera method of aging it's where I am and it works great!.

[NZChris]

I've been running a pot still for thirty years and have learned not to bother trying to make drinkable cuts from the low wines unless it's to please a European wanting to make a schnapps.

My first ever UJSSM has heaps of corn flavor and I am very happy with it. Got rid of the first two generations by only doing small washes and using the low wines to experiment with my new mini pot still. The spirit run was the low wines from gens #3 to #6 and I have saved enough backset to start over when I feel the urge.