So, Corn meal...

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

I'm in the middle of a cook, and I may have underestimated corn meal.

5 gallons hot water
7 pounds corn meal
.5 pound malt for pre mash (did absolutely nothing!)

Is this even going to mash? Should I split it, add more water, and then mash in?

[LBHD]

high temp amylase is where its at

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

Forget it. Corn meal fail.

I separated half, replaced with boiling water, and it's still gelling back up.

Maybe in the future I'll do a degerminated corn meal conversion test. But today, I'm done. Only lost my corn meal.save the malt.

[nerdybrewer]

This is where I'm going next, already got my enzyme package from Woodshed so now I just have to decide on a recipe and get cooking.

[Appalachia-Shiner]

Well, when you put the Alpha in it, it will go from Jelly to Soup.
Then is when my trouble seems to start.
My package from Woodshed is in the mail right now.
Ready to give it another go .
Filling jars right now from something dripping out a copper pipe. Modified UJ.

[MichiganCornhusker]

All was fine. Gelled great. Just had to add malt when cooled to 150F.
That's how mine always looks.

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

All was fine. Gelled great. Just had to add malt when cooled to 150F.
That's how mine always looks.

Well, I'm still fighting for it!

I scoop out 20% and replaces with water. It became manageable. So, I just mashed in the first bucket, and an waiting on the other 2 to cool.

I said screw it, what's 15 bucks in malt to say I tried.

So, we shall see. I have just never played with corn meal before, especially degerminated. Good God that sit became a block.

Gotta cut the corn meal down a few pounds next time.

[greggn]

That's a shame ... corn meal and liquid enzymes, using the "no boil" protocol, is about as easy as it gets for all-grain.

[MichiganCornhusker]

Liquid enzymes do keep it from becoming a block.
Adding your malt to the block at 150F will liquefy it just fine though.
You don't need to thin the block with water, the ground malt will turn it liquid right before your own eyes!
Ya done nothing wrong, that's a fine batch.

[bearriver]

Get you a ham bone. Tomorrow is navy bean soup and cornbread.

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

Yeah, so with about a third of the overall corn meal removed, I finished at 1.047. Dam shame. It's the moments when you freak out that you always regret.

So, yeah, lesson learned. I went to cornmeal because the cracked feed has not been performing, since the proponic acid came back out. Maybe old corn, I don't know. I can get food grade degerminated corn meal for 15 bucks a 50 bag. So, I figured what the hell. Man, could you imagine the sg if I knew it was normal. Man.

Well, a lesson in the books. We don't get to mastering by perfection.
It's here in the trenches.

[MichiganCornhusker]

Well, a lesson in the books. We don't get to mastering by perfection.
It's here in the trenches.

You done good! First you kept at it, second you didn't freak out about OG and go adding sugar.
Very nice, I say you just earned your corn patch.

[woodshed]

I'm with MCH. I would up the malt a bit but that's a fine finish.
The addition of hi temp enzymes will ensure maximum extraction from the corn.
Corn can be a bitch, in any form.

[frunobulax]

Unless your using a double boiler, Enzymes and corn meal = alot of fermentable sugar. But try to separate/squeeze it to run = failure. What I learned to do is add at least 20% malt just to make it squeezable.
What a buddy and I did last time was, after making beer, take some of the spent grain and dump it into the cornmeal mash. When it came time to separate it, it wasn't too bad.

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

Thanks guys for all your support. Mch and woodshed, thanks for the uplifting perspective.

So, I think I am going to stick with cornmeal for the winter, assuming the squeezing goes well. I know, someone is going to come along and see my back and forth brain bashing and want to know what the heck it's going on. So the final gravity actually came in at 1.054 I guess the temperature correction calc was off.

Truth be told, except for the mess and headache that was caused by me shoveling out 20 cups of polenta from each 5 gallon bucket, it was a lot more effective and easier cook up. And you are right,mch. As I was chilling it with the coil, I was surprised at how thin it was. There was nothing there. Not like my cracked corn chill sessions. At the time I couldn't see how I was even going to get the malt in the bucket.

I think it was still a successful mash. And the buckets were firing off before I could get the previous one chilled and pitched. I think next mash I will be more prepared for it. I will say, I am excited to compare notes. I did the same recipe last week with cracked corn.

[greggn]

>What I learned to do is add at least 20% malt just to make it squeezable.

My last two batches have been 10 lbs cornmeal and 2 lbs flaked wheat ... it squeezes out like a sponge.

[corene1]

Don't forget to get a nice stirring paddle for your drill, some use a paint stirring rod . For me it helps to disperse the enzymes a bit better and keeps things a bit more manageable than stirring by hand.

[MichiganCornhusker]

Don't forget to get a nice stirring paddle for your drill, some use a paint stirring rod . For me it helps to disperse the enzymes a bit better and keeps things a bit more manageable than stirring by hand.

+1
This is one of those things I take for granted now. Can't imagine trying to work a thick corn mash by hand stirring.

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

Don't forget to get a nice stirring paddle for your drill, some use a paint stirring rod . For me it helps to disperse the enzymes a bit better and keeps things a bit more manageable than stirring by hand.

Yep! I got a mortar paddle for the drill. It's awesome. Might need a second drill, more powerful one, if i try that much concentration in meal again.

Also, just to be clear to everyone, here its my full recipe:

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 11&t=58770

Honey Bear Bourbon.


The above ingredients was just my pre mash schedule.

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

So I am a corn meal convert! I think from a side by side, the propionic acid DOES stall the ferment. It takes off fine, but stops at 1.01. The corn meal finished dry at 1.00!

And squeezing was a breeze with my mop bucket! First time I got the grains that dry. Finally got a full 5 gallons of juice from the fermenters.

I'm telling you, I might go to cracked in the summer, but for the winter, I'm all corn meal all the time. Now I know how to handle it and know what to expect.

So glad I did this!

[jedneck]

Wait till you go 220 and build a steamer and use flour.

[FreeMountainHermit]

Don't forget to get a nice stirring paddle for your drill, some use a paint stirring rod . For me it helps to disperse the enzymes a bit better and keeps things a bit more manageable than stirring by hand.

Yep! I got a mortar paddle for the drill. It's awesome. Might need a second drill, more powerful one, if i try that much concentration in meal again.

Also, just to be clear to everyone, here its my full recipe:

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 11&t=58770

Honey Bear Bourbon.


The above ingredients was just my pre mash schedule.

How much "drilling" is required during an all enzyme event ??

In the YT vid it appears to be quite a bit.

Just wondering if building a drill stand is in my future.

Thanks.

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

Don't forget to get a nice stirring paddle for your drill, some use a paint stirring rod . For me it helps to disperse the enzymes a bit better and keeps things a bit more manageable than stirring by hand.

Yep! I got a mortar paddle for the drill. It's awesome. Might need a second drill, more powerful one, if i try that much concentration in meal again.

Also, just to be clear to everyone, here its my full recipe:

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 11&t=58770

Honey Bear Bourbon.


The above ingredients was just my pre mash schedule.

How much "drilling" is required during an all enzyme event ??

In the YT vid it appears to be quite a bit.

Just wondering if building a drill stand is in my future.

Thanks.

Never used enzymes. With malt it was only twice during the seep, twice during the malt, for 30 seconds for me. 3 buckets.

Battery power struggles a little.

[FreeMountainHermit]

Oops,.. my bad. I thought you had gone over to the "other side" but it doesn't sound like a lot of work with a drill. Correct ???

I have an old 1/2" chuck drill that's a torque monster.

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

Oops,.. my bad. I thought you had gone over to the "other side" but it doesn't sound like a lot of work with a drill. Correct ???

I have an old 1/2" chuck drill that's a torque monster.

Dude, between a drill and mop bucket, don't know what the hell I was doing before. Makes you want to cry at how much better life is with those two.

And, I hear ya on the enzyme confusion. The quick recipe above implies enzymes, but that was just the pre mash that was shown in the picture. I followed up with malt at 150. The full recipe is linked.

[Copper Thumper]

I'm with LB, did you add any enzymes or something like malted barley?

I just read fully and you gave up one post- but then you didn't?


People have been running corn for hundreds of years...I don't see why the mash won't work with enough water-temp-time and some sort of enzymes.


I usually run grain at 150*f for 90 minutes. No real boil but some thermodynamic action along with mixing.


Pitch the enzymes when mixing and no issues.


Might want to try a local brew/wine shop for supplies- here they have everything!


If no local shops- maybe start your own??? =$$$$

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

This is my Honey Bear Bourbon recipe. It's all malt. .5 pound to help thin, 3 pounds to convert.

.5 pound usually helps the cracked corn, but didn't touch the corn meal.

[Copper Thumper]

Amalyse might be in order...

[Brutal]

You're doing good bubba! Keep it up! If you have a process in place that you like and enjoy that's a great thing. Enjoy it and keep doing the same thing until you are a master of the art. There's always gonna be something else out there. But you gotta make something yours.

There's a saying in gun enthusiast circles goes like this: "Beware the man who only has one gun. He probably knows how to use it!" There's a great man named Clint Smith that coined that phrase. It illustrates the fact that if someone has 50 guns they are going to be "ok" with all of them, but if someone has one gun and learns to shoot that gun well they will be "above average" with it. They might even be telepathic with it.

You sound like you are pretty happy with your protocol right now and I say run with it!! Usually I am just almost as quick as Jed to jump in and point out how steam solves some problems, but it's not needed if you are comfortable with your process. Being comfortable is the best thing in the world that any mammal could hope for. Carry the ball and run with it.

Party on, ShineonCrazyDiamond.

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

You're doing good bubba! Keep it up! If you have a process in place that you like and enjoy that's a great thing. Enjoy it and keep doing the same thing until you are a master of the art. There's always gonna be something else out there. But you gotta make something yours.

There's a saying in gun enthusiast circles goes like this: "Beware the man who only has one gun. He probably knows how to use it!" There's a great man named Clint Smith that coined that phrase. It illustrates the fact that if someone has 50 guns they are going to be "ok" with all of them, but if someone has one gun and learns to shoot that gun well they will be "above average" with it. They might even be telepathic with it.

You sound like you are pretty happy with your protocol right now and I say run with it!! Usually I am just almost as quick as Jed to jump in and point out how steam solves some problems, but it's not needed if you are comfortable with your process. Being comfortable is the best thing in the world that any mammal could hope for. Carry the ball and run with it.

Party on, ShineonCrazyDiamond.

Thanks Brutal. This was a really great post for me to come and read.

I don't have anything against enzymes, and I'm sure they are awesome. But I do enjoy my malts, and the characteristics that they bring. I love the different ones they have, and trying different ones.

Thanks for taking the time to write up your post.