Extract + Grains

[cuginosgrizzo]

Hi there,

I have to use up some DME that I have so I figured up this kind of faux islay style whishy.

My Bill:

#3kg Pale DME
#1kg peated malted barley
#20lt water
#2 digestive enzymes capsulesù
#1 package yeast US-05

My process:

Mill 1 kg peated malted barley and put it in a fermentor, heat 5 liters water to 57C, pour it on the grain. Should settle at 55C, insulate fermentor and cover. Heat to 55C 5 liters water and dissolve 3Kg DME. Pour on fermentor with grains. Add 2 capsules of enzymes (should help with FG). Let it cool overnite, add 10lt water @23C, measure SG, which should be around 1.065. Pitch yeast.

Whatcha think of this? see any major flaws?

[still_stirrin]

With the digestive enzymes (Alpha-galactosidase), sometimes know as "Beano", the ferment should finish dry making it good for distillation.

Dry malt extract (DME) is processed grain malt that has been dehydrated. The company that produced the malt extract determined the fermentable and non-fermentable portions in the extract. Since DME is intended for beer brewers, there will be many flavors in it too which will, or should carry over to your distillation.

Again, using processed malt extract is OK. But it is more expensive than mashing the malted grains yourself. And you would have control over the flavor profile and non-fermentables if you would do your own mashing. But you elected the "quick & easy" method. Fine.

Questions for you....did you lauter your peated malt? Or are you fermenting it on the grain? Did you mash the peated malt, or just pitch it into the mixture?

In the end, you'll end up with a whiskey. It's hard not to. Make frugal cuts and age it on wood and you'll be treated to some nice sipping whiskey.
ss

[cuginosgrizzo]

Hi ss, thanks for your input! I am doing this as a test, and in order to use some extract that I had. I have grains ready for when I'll feel confident enough, after some testing with rum and ujssm.
To answer your questions, I chose to ferment on the grain in order to try to maximize the peat flavor, even if risking some more tannins. I'll strain before distilling. I did not exactly mash the grains but I steeped them in 70C water for 30 minutes before adding more water and DME. This is the standard procedure for beer when you do E+G (only in that case you lauter the grains before boiling).
In my corner of the world we do not have beano, but the closest thing I found is called Similase, which has Amylase, alfa-galattosidase, maltase, lipase and other goodies.
I'll keep you guys posted on the results!

[cuginosgrizzo]

After 8 days it finished fermenting at FG 1000. Not bad, I'd say, being it mostly DME. The enzymes did their job. Smell is very good (no peat there) and taste is also good, with the peat coming through well. Gonna distill it tonite. I am going for a single distillation since it's such a small batch (25lt or 6.6 gallons) and I won't be repeating it to get enough low wines for a second run. Also, I'd like to retain as much of the peat flavor as possible, and double distilling it might make me lose it.

[cuginosgrizzo]

Yesterday night I ran it. I am satisfied: the peat smell I was after passed through very well. Total run time for the 25 lt was 2,5 hrs. I got 21 200 ml jars out of it, now airing and waiting for my cuts. Tossed first 200ml, then started collecting at 65% ABV. Last three jars were in the 30%-20% range. On first impression I say that the heads carry more peat, the tails carry more malt taste, the hearts are more neuter. Tonight me and the wife will be doing cuts. I hope the keep will have enough ABV for oaking.

Let me thank you all again and this very informative forum. Without you this would not be.

[cuginosgrizzo]

Ok, last night it was cut time. Unfortunately I am not very satisfied, a little disappointed. I ended up keeping 1.5 liters @50% ABV. A little in the lowish zone to oak it, but I am giving it a try and it is sitting with two new toasted and charred 5"x1" sticks. Sniffed it this morning and it is already starting to smell like a decent whisky should. My only disappointment springs from the fact that most of the peat smell/taste has been lost either in the 24hrs airing or in the feints. Do you reckon the peat might show again later with aging?

[der wo]

If you want strong peat flavor, you have to mash 100% heavily peated malt. No DME.
Do you have a ppm number of the malt?
If you would distill twice, you would get much more hearts.

[cuginosgrizzo]

Hi dw. This was a test, and a way to reuse those malts (I do not have the ppm number).

This time I also tried single distill because the batch was a very small size, and I won't be doing it again to put it together and have enough to run a spirit run.

In the near (I hope) future I'll move to AG and then I'll definitely ferment some bigger batch with 100% peated malt.

[der wo]

Ok.
Next time don't buy peated malt without a given ppm number. The most peated malts you can buy have only 5ppm. That's almost nothing. Try to find 30 or better more. Normally it's named "heavily peated".

[cuginosgrizzo]

Thanks dw, if you can, could you point me to an online seller that has it here in Europe? All the brewshops I know carry lightly peated malt or smoked malt (rauckmalz) but that's a different beast.

[der wo]

Oh i searched looong...
But finally I found a 30ppm peated malt from Belgium in an Irish online shop :
https://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/chate ... -2948.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
Good prices but shipping costs...
With 30ppm you don't get as much peat like in a Laphroaig or Ardbeg whisky , but perhaps like Talisker or Lagavulin

[EDR]

I guess you can always try smoking grains yourself. Like this guy:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQOhdceGXnw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

Was thinking of giving that a go this spring in the park with some flexible aluminum tubes and a BBQ.

[MichiganCornhusker]

I ran a 100% peated malt scotch this summer and I am very happy with the amount of smokey goodness that came over in the finished spirit. I did strip & spirit runs.
I got a 50# sack of Simpsons Peated Malt at my local brew shop. They had to order it in, but it was worth the wait.

[cuginosgrizzo]

thanks dw, I found the same brand in a belgian shop. it's a little cheaper and with shipping it's around 50€ for 25kg.

https://homebrewshop.be/en/speciality-m ... 25-kg.html

not cheap but I could go that route.

I thought about peating my own, maybe sourcing peat at the garden shop but I would never find the real peat and I could not control the exact level of ppm (now I learnt that didn't I ). So I think I'll pass. Well, come on...I know some day I'll give it a try but I don't consider this as the real solution. My neighbors would not be happy if I smoked 25Kg of malt for hours in the garden....

[still_stirrin]

Lots of novel ideas rolling around in your head, cuginosgrizzo. I hope you don't get so distracted that you can't get it done.

The first time you get to pour a little of your own whiskey, you'll rethink the multitude of processes you have and which are relevant to the product. Its best to stay focused when starting out so you succeed at the fundamentals first. Then, you can add complexity and diversity to your plans.

Be safe, responsible, and discrete.
ss

[cuginosgrizzo]

The first time you get to pour a little of your own whiskey, you'll rethink the multitude of processes you have and which are relevant to the product. Its best to stay focused when starting out so you succeed at the fundamentals first. Then, you can add complexity and diversity to your plans.

These are words of wisdom, ss!
Don't worry I am used to think in advance, and always be ready for the next step, as long as possible. But in the meantime I am humbly working myself up. I am going through simpler things first (UJ and now a RUM going) to learn from my experience and mistakes!

[der wo]

thanks dw, I found the same brand in a belgian shop. it's a little cheaper and with shipping it's around 50€ for 25kg.

https://homebrewshop.be/en/speciality-m ... 25-kg.html

Good link. Thank you. I bookmarked it for future

[engunear]

Odd coincidence here - just yesterday I finished a run with an almost identical recipe. I mashed the grain on the stove for an hour and added to the rest, and distilled with steam injection - though with that quantity of solids its not clear thats necessary. The one addition I'd make to that recipe is to add 1 tbsp of natural greek yoghurt to get a good lactobacillus infection going. And add about 10-20ml per bottle of good sherry at the end. Not a cheat since most (scotch) whiskey is aged in barrels with traces of wine or spirit.

I'm puzzled about how extract whiskey compares to all-grain. In home brew circles (from whence a lot of us came) its a no-brainer, but here? The lacto addition would freak a home brewer, but hey!