How to achieve proper PH for Sebstar Alpha Amalyse

[Pacman0810]

So I took my first shot with the Sebstar this weekend. Mixed results. I finished with a SG of 1.04, lower than what people normally report when using. I used 9lbs coarse cracked corn from the feed store, 5 gallons of distilled water from Wal Mart. Brought temps up to 200 F then added corn. When temp was 180, I added the enzyme. I did not see the instant shredding that most folks describe.

I realized my PH was probably the problem, so I added some PH balancer I got from the brew store which was supposed to bring it to PH 5.2. Then I realized that was too low.

Okay, so my question is, what do I add to get ph to proper balance for maximum effect for sebstar? I read a lot about enzymes here and the need for proper pH, but not much on how to get. I think I saw something about pickling lime.

[Truckinbutch]

You could do yourself more good by regrinding the coarse crack to nearly flour and investing in the low temp enzyme to use in conjunction with the high temp .
I'm mashing 50# in 25 gallons of water constantly stirred in a mash pot . Water is ph 7 at the start . i have had no issues in adding the low temp at 150 degrees without adjusting ph . Enzymes are only costing me $0.40 for a 50# mash . I dump about 1 1/2 pints of crushed oyster shell in each 30 gallon mash .

[Stainless]

Hi Pacman, distilled water is not the stuff you should be using, I don't know much about AG but normal tap water ( if it's safe) works much better. Maybe get yourself some ph test papers or a digital ph meter from feebay, about 15-20 bucks. Hopefully someone more knowledgable will chime in here with better info for you.
Cheers.
Will

[der wo]

Yes. The enzymes need calcium and later the yeast too. Distilled water is one problem. The other problem is the cracked corn, either cook it for a while or grind it. The pH is not a problem unless you use backset. Then you reach easily too low pH levels.
Did you use only the SebStarHTL or also the SebAmylGL?

[ShineRunner]

Also, it sounds like you're trying to shoot from the hip as far as your ph. Get yourself some cheap ph test strips and at least get yourself in the right area. Grind the corn down so that you don't have to cook the crap out of it and it'll work a lot better as well.

Depending on your water ph, I usually don't need to add anything other than some gypsum for the sebstar to be in the right area. I generally have to add a little citric acid to drop the ph some more for sebamyl. Citric acid is cheap. Backset is even cheaper though! But be careful not to go too far.

SR

[HDNB]

Starting with Ph7 water the addition of corn at temperature gives me a ph of 6.2, the 90 minutes at temperature + HTL the PH will drop to 5.2-5.4 which is fine for the Seb GL. by the time Seb Gl is done, the ph has dropped to 5ish and is fine for yeast. The only trouble i have had is stalling from a PH crash when i used too much backset accidentally for the GL phase...and another when i pitch yeast too hot and the PH crashed and could not get it restarted after increase and buffering.
i would not suggest backset until after the HTL has done it's work, and no more than 10% volume when lowering for GL. (the GL may withstand a bit less PH, but by the time GL is done it's work with too much backset the yeast will have a hard time.)

[Pacman0810]

Yes. The enzymes need calcium and later the yeast too. Distilled water is one problem. The other problem is the cracked corn, either cook it for a while or grind it. The pH is not a problem unless you use backset. Then you reach easily too low pH levels.
Did you use only the SebStarHTL or also the SebAmylGL?

I used both. Also, what I am gathering is that cracked corn, even with the SebStarHTL, still needs a finer grind to be effective? I have always shied away from Houston tap water, my fear was it can be over chlorinated. I have ordered PH strips so as to cure myself of "hip shooting".

[HDNB]

you can decay chlorine in about 4 hours in the sunlight.

250g/L of cracked corn/water will hit 1.062 no problem with Seb, i think your weight/gallon was a bit lower? probably more if ya try harder.
250g/L ground corn/water will go 1.064 with even less effort.

edit: water quantity

[Pacman0810]

HDNB,

do i need to cook the crack corn a bit longer before adding the sebstar if I don't grind it down? I always thought the enzyme would shred even cracked corn.

[seamusm53]

you can decay chlorine in about 4 hours in the sunlight.

This chemists suspects that tap water chlorine is largely gone by the time the water boils.

[moosemilk]

HDNB,

do i need to cook the crack corn a bit longer before adding the sebstar if I don't grind it down? I always thought the enzyme would shred even cracked corn.

There's a thread around here by BigR on step mashing. Works well for cracked corn. I used to do cracked, but have a mill and grind it down further now, not to a meal, but fairly fine. When using cracked, I would often have a slightly lower pH to cook at, I find it helps. Just means you may have to adjust (I never had to) for enzymes later. Also with cracked, get your water up to a full boil first, then add in the corn stirring as you go (paint mixer and drill work wonders). Then bring it back up to a boil slowly (make sure not to scorch . . . I have a long wood paddle that i can keep the bottom of the pot scraped while heating back up). Wrap in blanket and let sit overnight. This should help get those starches out better. Temp should still be high enough for your sebstar (high temp) to thin it out, you can then bring it back up a bit if needed. Then let cool to 150 and add your sebamyl.

[skow69]

HDNB, did you mean 250g/L maybe?

As an American I might have the conversions wrong, but I usually figure 2 lb per gal.

[Tapeman]

Yes. The enzymes need calcium and later the yeast too. Distilled water is one problem. The other problem is the cracked corn, either cook it for a while or grind it. The pH is not a problem unless you use backset. Then you reach easily too low pH levels.
Did you use only the SebStarHTL or also the SebAmylGL?

I used both. Also, what I am gathering is that cracked corn, even with the SebStarHTL, still needs a finer grind to be effective? I have always shied away from Houston tap water, my fear was it can be over chlorinated. I have ordered PH strips so as to cure myself of "hip shooting".

Check to see if Houston uses chlorine or chlorimine to sanitize drinking water. Regular chlorine can be degraded in sunlight but chlorimine requires camden tablets to neutralize the bad effect on yeast.

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[Pacman0810]

Check to see if Houston uses chlorine or chlorimine to sanitize drinking water. Regular chlorine can be degraded in sunlight but chlorimine requires camden tablets to neutralize the bad effect on yeast.

Tapeman, we do use chlorimine, but I honestly don't know how much. My tap water chemistry is not so great. Is it any amount is bad or just a certain amount?

[Tapeman]

I checked with my local water district about this issue. It appears that if they are using chloramine to sanitize municipal water then they typically won't use chlorine. So it's one of the other. Chloramines are much more resistant to breaking down so I use 3 or 4 camden tablets per 5 gallons of water (crushed). Leave it for an hour or less to do the work and you will have water that won't kill your yeast. Found this out the hard way with batches I thought were stuck but we're actually dead and needed more yeast added to continue the ferment. I'm only a novice, but camden tablets work for me. My city water comes from a very clean lake nearby and is very soft but the water company bumps the pH to around 9 due to lead in the system, it's very old. They sanitize with chloramines, UV light, and ozone. I would use water from the well at my cottage but it has more minerals that would impact flavor and be a problem to clean up after.

[skow69]

I got confused cuz the only thing I've seen campden tablets used for in the past is to inhibit fermentation and other biological stuff, so I went looking for clarification. I found this on Wikipaedia:

Campden tablets (potassium or sodium metabisulfite)[1] are a sulfur-based product that is used primarily to sterilize wine, cider and in beer making to kill bacteria and to inhibit the growth of most wild yeast. This product is also used to eliminate both free chlorine and the more stable form, chloramine, from water solutions (e.g., drinking water from municipal sources)....

...the level of active sulfur dioxide diminishes rapidly as it reacts with chlorine and chloramine.... However, when used only for the purpose of dechlorinating tap water before brewing, one tablet will effectively treat 20 US gallons (75 L) of water.[2]

It's definitely the right tool for the job, but I would be wary of overdosing. It looks like a little goes a long way.

EDIT: It sounds like when it runs out of chlorine to react with, the rest hangs around as "active sulfur dioxide." I don't actually know what that means, but it sure doesn't sound good.

[Tapeman]

Interesting, the bottle suggests one tablet or gallon!

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[HDNB]

HDNB, did you mean 250g/L maybe?

As an American I might have the conversions wrong, but I usually figure 2 lb per gal.

umm yep....oops 250g/L weights and measures in Canada are tough to brain.

[skow69]

Interesting, the bottle suggests one tablet or gallon!

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Wow, that's a dot of difference. I would probably go with what is on the bottle.