Hydrated Lime

[BourbonStreet]

I do sour mash UJSSM, and often the pH is way too low. I have tried eggshells with good results. I usually throw in a bit of DAP and Epsom salts, too. I found some hydrated lime at a Hispanic store, and tried it. It makes a huge difference! I’ve looked it up on the forums, and a few people use it. I just add a bit at a time and aerate the wash. After a few tablespoons, the yeast really perks up. Plus, I don’t have to fish out egg membranes...

[Expat]

Yup, hydrated lime, quick lime, slaked lime, calcium hydroxide all the same and all very much in use (recommend with safety precautions) around here. Have a look around if you want to find more information.

Much better and more effective than things like sodium bicarbonate, both at raising pH and not impacting the yeaties.

[BourbonStreet]

I was just surprised at how well it works. I’ve been doing this for years, and often got stuck ferments. It really makes a clean product.

[DAD300]

You can get Hydrated Lime, Calcium Hydroxide at some pool stores or hardware stores.

Water departments use it by the 40lb bag to treat city water. Big bag runs about $10usd.

During ferment, I still use a suspended bottle/bag of marble rocks in a ferment. Ferment eats rocks and automagically stays around Ph 4.7. They are cheap and easy

[NZChris]

I reckon it's better to avoid stuck ferments than to have to fix them, so I use some whole shells to act like a buffer until the ferment is finished.

[pope]

Chris are you talking crushed oyster shell like what you give to chickens? You have a rule of thumb for ratio of shell:wash/mash?

[NZChris]

I prefer whole shells or marble as they have less surface area to volume so are less likely to give you trouble if you use to much or can't/don't remove them when the ferment finishes.

[BourbonStreet]

Chris are you talking crushed oyster shell like what you give to chickens? You have a rule of thumb for ratio of shell:wash/mash?

This is powdered lime, not crushed shells. I just add a little in the dissolved sugar, before I pitch my yeast. If it doesn’t start bubbling enough the first day, I add a little bit every few hours and aerate. Usually, it gets to the right speed after a couple of doses.

[NZChris]

I have that too, but seldom have to use it to correct pH in a ferment now that I add shells to ferments that have a history of giving me problems.

I have been using it for making rum lime salts lately.

[pope]

Just sliding oyster shells off the plate and into your pocket, Chris? This sounds like an excuse to go have seafood.

And I was just wondering what Chris was using, BourbonStreet I get that you're using powdered slaked lime. I am thinking of trying it but have you tried it against Calcium Carbonate? Wondering if, dosage differences aside, there's a difference in cost/performance. I don't fiddle with pH too much but I've also had some stuck ferments as I move into less common fermentables.

[NZChris]

CC in any shape doesn't come close to the effect of hydrated lime for adjusting pH.

[BourbonStreet]

It’s pretty common in Hispanic areas. It’s called “cal” in Spanish. The Aztecs even named a god after it! It converts the cellulose in the kernel into nutritious starch. People have boiled corn in a solution of it for thousands of years. In English, the resulting corn is called “hominy”. It’s also ground into grits.

[StillerBoy]

I am thinking of trying it but have you tried it against Calcium Carbonate? Wondering if, dosage differences aside, there's a difference in cost/performance.

There are there different ingredients that can be used to adjust the Ph of a wash / mash.. one is calcium carbonate (CC), another is calcium hydroxide (CH), and there is also potassium carbonate (PC)..

CC and CH from a level of efficiency are on a equal footing, both require about the same amount in making an adjustment.. and CH cost is considerably less than CC, and can be purchase just about everywhere, stores, building supply, etc..

PC is the most efficient of the three, only requiring about a third of the amount vers the other two, but the cost is a little more than CC..

Mars

[still_stirrin]

...one is calcium carbonate (CC), another is calcium hydroxide (CH), and there is also potassium carbonate (PC)...

Hey Mars, your point of strength of base is well made. But, I’d like to clarify for readers that the correct chemical shorthand for the respective chemicals are:

calcium carbonate —> CaCO3
calcium hydroxide —> Ca(OH)2
potassium carbonate —> KCO3
potassium hydroxide —> KOH

As has been noted, the caustics (hydroxides) are much stronger bases than their respective carbonates. And all are stronger bases than sodium bicarbonate (baking soda). As a result, raising the pH of the wash (reducing acidity) requires less of of the respective bases.

Also note that potassium is a valuable yeast nutrient, as is calcium, over the use of a sodium base.

So, I urge you to use the correct chemical shorthand when discussing the chemicals to avoid confusion to follow on readers.
ss

[NZChris]

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=55813#p7314166

[Expat]

...one is calcium carbonate (CC), another is calcium hydroxide (CH), and there is also potassium carbonate (PC)...

Hey Mars, your point of strength of base is well made. But, I’d like to clarify for readers that the correct chemical shorthand for the respective chemicals are:

calcium carbonate —> CaCO3
calcium hydroxide —> Ca(OH)2
potassium carbonate —> KCO3
potassium hydroxide —> KOH

As has been noted, the caustics (hydroxides) are much stronger bases than their respective carbonates. And all are stronger bases than sodium bicarbonate (baking soda). As a result, raising the pH of the wash (reducing acidity) requires less of of the respective bases.

Also note that potassium is a valuable yeast nutrient, as is calcium, over the use of a sodium base.

So, I urge you to use the correct chemical shorthand when discussing the chemicals to avoid confusion to follow on readers.
ss

Add to the list:

Calcium tetrahydroxide --> CaH4O4-2

Which is also sold as "Hydrated Lime"

[StillerBoy]

Thanks SS.. the name were identified the In brackets, was just to shorten the typing,, not on the chemical name.as per say. I think it was quite clear.. but then again, everyone has a different way of reading something..

I was just stating that there are different ingredients that can be used for raising the Ph, and their cost relations..

Mars

[Teddysad]

My goto system is as follows:
I use hydrated lime (the gardener uses it a lot so I bought a 20kg bag for about $20.00 from the farm supplies place. (Bunnings also sell a 500g bag for about $7 in the garden section - same stuff go figure !!)
In a 1.5 l soft drink bottle of tap water I add 12g of the Hydrated lime, shake and stir for a few minutes. Some powder will settle to the bottom.
I pour off the water into another container (leaving the sediment behind).
I now have a ready made solution of a "pH up" This stores for ages.
When required a small amount (50ml or so) at a time is added to the wash/mash. When stirred in it brings up the pH and can be checked on the pH pen.
The product is known as limewater and itself has a pH of about 12.5.