Can reuse what’s in the slobber box?

[JamesH]

I thought it had been pretty much decided that they are not clarifiers and that they do nothing ?

Oh ok, so here’s what I found in those unless pieces of metal lol

I drained after heads cleared and there was about 400ml of some smelly stuff, smelt like diluted foreshot as expected I guess.

Just before tails came I drained again, this was a little floral (I’m not great at describing flavours) this was around 82% abv and this time only about 200 ml came off. I wasn’t really sure about taste. There was nothing that jumped out at me that was bad however very prickly on the nose. I added to faints jar.

[cayars]

Judging by the pictures SaltyStaves gave us, his device can not be a thumper, as it will hardly contain any fluid to make it thump: the fluid will flow back into the column. But the point of entrance is low, so a thumper could be used to do the same.

It will function like a cross between the two doing neither job well. However as he said "What I collect from the drain valve is thick, cloudy fusel-heavy liquid of a low abv." There just won't be a lot of it because when it reaches the height of the feed tube you're both starting to mix it back with the vapor and likely allowing it to drain back to the boiler.

The point of both a slobberbox and a clarifier is the drain valve at the bottom, to keep it empty. (If they are large enough, they can contain all the muke of a run and don't need a drain valve.) The point of a thumper is the bubbling of vapour through a liquid, thus taking up alcohol and/or taste.
A slobberbox is used to catch low boiling pukes and either remove them or redirect them to the boiler.

While many people use the slobberbox to catch puke it does catch the fusel-heavy liquids as well.

A clarifier prevents low boiling or less volatile compounds to re-enter the boiler. When they flow back into the boiler, they will be revaporated and so again polute the vapour. Besides: as the volume in the boiler diminishes during the run, the concentration of the unwanted compounds will grow and as the temperature in the boiler will rise, they will be more easily be evaporated. So taking them out of the system is benificial.

I'm not sure where you're going with the last part as no one at the home level would feed this gunk back to the boiler (if that's what you meant, not sure). Either way they won't make it back to the boiler as these fusels are already past the point of no return in the vapor path.

Clarifiers work, are good, but need to be built to be taken apart and cleaned (important in my book). They should also be modular as sometimes you WANT the fusels and don't want them removed (depends what you are making).

They are getting very popular in both Poland and Russia on dedicated stills for making vodka & other neutrals.

[Corsaire]

I don't think there were facts, just speculation. I'm interested in what comes out of those boxes.

I'm not convinced they're clarifiers like cayars said, it strikes me that slow moving fluid is not the same as faster moving vapor, although it's a fluid as well and I don't have any science credentials.

Maybe you're not supposed to open them up during the run. Would you mind doing a run and see what's in them if you let them undisturbed?
As for cleaning, I think hot ethanol is a pretty good solvent, so maybe they don't need cleaning? Surely this high up they won't catch pukes?
Please note I have zero experience with reflux columns. Just trying to wrap my head around this.

Great to hear you got the thumbs up from the family. I can attest that polish people know their vodka

[cayars]

Well they're called clarifiers on a still when they are tall and skinny and setup like a slobber box (input from the top vs bottom on a thumper) and have a drain valve. With out the drain valve it's a slobber box. It's just what they are called, so that part is fact.

Now how well they work or if you want/could use one is another topic in itself.

You can open the drain during the run but will want to close it after draining off anything that comes out. Unless you close off the containment system they are ran closed (like a slobber box). You don't want to create a different path for the vapor to escape.

It is vapor going through the clarifiers not liquid. It won't become liquid until it hits the product condenser.

PS anyone who has a normal slobber box can probably attest to the fact there will be some gunk in it on some runs even when nothing puked.

[JamesH]

I don't think there were facts, just speculation. I'm interested in what comes out of those boxes.

I'm not convinced they're clarifiers like cayars said, it strikes me that slow moving fluid is not the same as faster moving vapor, although it's a fluid as well and I don't have any science credentials.

Maybe you're not supposed to open them up during the run. Would you mind doing a run and see what's in them if you let them undisturbed?
As for cleaning, I think hot ethanol is a pretty good solvent, so maybe they don't need cleaning? Surely this high up they won't catch pukes?
Please note I have zero experience with reflux columns. Just trying to wrap my head around this.

Great to hear you got the thumbs up from the family. I can attest that polish people know their vodka

I dId and posted my finding above

[SaltyStaves]

Because mine tappers to the drain valve, it acts like a separatory funnel. There is less chance of the denser liquid reboiling and it can be drained off first, as it sinks and settles at the bottom.
With a flat bottom, its all going to pour out of the drain valve. That is fine if you plan to discard it all, but if like me you are making rum salts, its nice to be able to discard the excess water.

[Kareltje]

I thought it had been pretty much decided that they are not clarifiers and that they do nothing ?

Oh ok, so here’s what I found in those unless pieces of metal lol

I drained after heads cleared and there was about 400ml of some smelly stuff, smelt like diluted foreshot as expected I guess.

Just before tails came I drained again, this was a little floral (I’m not great at describing flavours) this was around 82% abv and this time only about 200 ml came off. I wasn’t really sure about taste. There was nothing that jumped out at me that was bad however very prickly on the nose. I added to faints jar.

Nice report, thank you.
This sounds as if the box contains more or less the same stuff as goes to the condenser. Could you compare smell and taste with the distillate coming out at the same time?

[Kareltje]

A clarifier prevents low boiling or less volatile compounds to re-enter the boiler. When they flow back into the boiler, they will be revaporated and so again polute the vapour. Besides: as the volume in the boiler diminishes during the run, the concentration of the unwanted compounds will grow and as the temperature in the boiler will rise, they will be more easily be evaporated. So taking them out of the system is benificial.

I'm not sure where you're going with the last part as no one at the home level would feed this gunk back to the boiler (if that's what you meant, not sure). Either way they won't make it back to the boiler as these fusels are already past the point of no return in the vapor path.

Clarifiers work, are good, but need to be built to be taken apart and cleaned (important in my book). They should also be modular as sometimes you WANT the fusels and don't want them removed (depends what you are making).

They are getting very popular in both Poland and Russia on dedicated stills for making vodka & other neutrals.

Now I read it again I can see the misunderstanding. And, thanks to your remark, I rethought it rephrase it like:
A clarifier prevents muck to re-enter the boiler. Without it, this muck would reflux into the boiler.
Past the point of no return a clarifier can prevent (part of) the muck to go with the distillate into the condenser.

The findings of JamesH suggest that even in the heart it takes out some of the sharp, prickly taste.

You seem familiar with Polish and Russian forums. What do they say about this subject? Are there any solid comparisons between with and without these things?

[JamesH]

Well I got round to making another run and just to keep everyone updated, after I finished the run I emptied everything for tube 1 and discarded it as it might have contained some nastiest but the 2nd one, smelt and tasted fine so kept it all and added to my final product.

[Tōtōchtin]

My fusel trap is at the bottom of the column, not the top. I doubt the slobber boxes on this still are much use for anything except a really bad puke, and I wouldn't trust the blurb in the Wiki about them removing congeners without seeing some quality reference material.

Would that be a boil ball at the bottom of your column?
T

[NZChris]

My fusel trap is at the bottom of the column, not the top. I doubt the slobber boxes on this still are much use for anything except a really bad puke, and I wouldn't trust the blurb in the Wiki about them removing congeners without seeing some quality reference material.

Would that be a boil ball at the bottom of your column?
T

Slant plates, like a Bokakob. Got the idea here, viewtopic.php?t=70666

[elbono]

Slant plates, like a Bokakob. Got the idea here, viewtopic.php?t=70666

I've had this on my wish list.

I also plan to add a LM takeoff below the tee on my 2" CCVM and thought making two wouldn't be much more work while I'm soldering. I was planning on doing a concentric style using a 2"x1" fitting reducer.

Is the side draw at the bottom worth doing? What benefits do you see? How much complication does it add to a run?

Do you think concentric vs slant plate will make a difference?

I'm running SPP if that matters.

[NZChris]

I haven't done enough experiments with it to have answers. It's probably better for running one run and done or continuous, which I never do. If I have anything useful to report, I'll put it here, viewtopic.php?t=70666