How long can you wait to distill fruit mash?

[Slivovitz]

In Hungary and Croatia they usually run a single time on a pot still and collect almost everything except the stinky stuff at the end and the fore shots at the start.

Fruit brandy will probably have its best flavor on one long run. I'm going to do a bit of research and talked to the family but I was not planning on running this two or three times.

Goal is Flavor not proof

[NZChris]

In Hungary and Croatia they usually run a single time on a pot still and collect almost everything except the stinky stuff at the end and the fore shots at the start.

I'm pleased I don't live in Hungary or Croatia.

[Expat]

In Hungary and Croatia they usually run a single time on a pot still and collect almost everything except the stinky stuff at the end and the fore shots at the start.

I'm pleased I don't live in Hungary or Croatia.

My friend is Hungarian and was anxious when I offered him some of my whisky, assuming it would taste like the nasty shit they make back home.... he was shocked by the difference.

[Slivovitz]

In Hungary and Croatia they usually run a single time on a pot still and collect almost everything except the stinky stuff at the end and the fore shots at the start.

I'm pleased I don't live in Hungary or Croatia.

It is almost always delicious. You don't need to distill something three times to get good flavor. In fact if you do you'll get no flavor.

I added sugar so it's not true to historical recipe. If all goes right and it's high-proof on the first run I won't do a second.

NZ do you ever use fruit?

[NZChris]

Yes, I do use fruit. I'm an opportunist and take advantage of free and cheap offers and excess in our garden.

I double distil unless it is for friends who insist that they want a single. When that happens, I do it for free, insist that they choose their own cut, then only keep a small sample rather than a share for myself.

I have done triple distilled flavored products. If someone you know loses the flavors by triple distilling their fruit, don't take advice from them.

[Slivovitz]

Well I am learning and I am happy to learn from you also. If I need to cook it twice I will but I'm going to taste it after one run and see what happens

[cranky]

I've read things about slivovitz and one sit was where a man fermented the plums, took the must down to the towns distillery where the first run is done by the person with the must but a second run is done by the towns master distiller.
( http://slivovice.org/ )

My personal experience is in line with NZChris, 2 runs or a 1.5 is best. I don't run brandy 3 times unless I make some sort of mistake but I will do an all feints run if I have enough at the end.

[Slivovitz]

Ok I will be running twice. I'm mixed up from bad advice from family (lost in translation literally).

I have 14 gallons apricot must and a 10 gallon pot. I'm thinking to do a first full 10 gallon run down to 25% or so loosely fractioned.

Then take the good stuff from that run, add to pot with remaining must and run the second time down to roughly 25%-30% collecting in lots of jars.

Does this sound about right? After reading here for 3 hours, and considering the recent suggestions from NZ cranky and others I think I'm on the right track.

From what I gather this is going to get me the most flavor and I can dilute with low proof distillate vs plain water.

If this all works, Monday I run 16 gallons of peach wine with a 10 gallon followed by 6 gallon with spirits from first run added.

I appreciate all the help so far.
18 hours until the fun begins!

[NZChris]

You don't "... take the good stuff from that run ...". That risks throwing out flavor.

The only part you may want to remove is a foreshot to get rid of some of the ethyl acetate. I collect into one vessel until it reaches the abv I want for the spirit run, eliminating the possibility of making common mistakes made by newbies who have been listening to poor advice or who have been tasting it. The last of the distillate might taste bad because it contains flavors that are unpleasant at high concentrations, but it still goes into the vessel. If you don't taste it, you won't be tempted to throw it out.

[jonnys_spirit]

For your 14 gallons of apricot i’d strip two 7 gallon charges and collect the low wines so you have some headroom. Similar with the peach. Then you’ll have peach and apricot low wines and you can decide to mix them or spirit run separate.

Out of all that you’ll probably have enough low wines to do a nice charge for your spirit run and peach+apricot would be nice.

A full boiler charge of low wines for your spirit run will make cuts easier but i understand the desire to do separate spirit runs and keep the spirits pure.

Cheers!
-jonny

[Slivovitz]

I prefer to keep the two fruits separate. Because this is my first time I'm doing my best to make it less complicated.

I will equally split the 14 gallon apricot must and run it to roughly 25% into a gallon glass jars.

Then I will clean up, combine them and run it again splitting it into jars for blending later.

I am confused on the 2 vs 1.5 run idea.

[cranky]

I think I do pretty much the same thing as Chris.

I run a stripping run and just collect into one container until the total collected is down to less than 40%, or until I have as much as I think I need for the next run as long as it is less than 40%.
when all low wine runs are done I put them all in the boiler for the spirit run.

On a 1.5 run you would run a single stripping run, then add that back to the wine for the 2nd run. For example If I had 25 gallons of wine I might do two 10 gallon stripping runs then add the remaining 5 gallons to the low wines for the final run.

[Slivovitz]

Thank you for clarifying that. I don't know exactly what the benefit of One Versus the other is.

I will research it tonight.

Is one going to give much more flavor or is it simply easier to blend?

[cranky]

Thank you for clarifying that. I don't know exactly what the benefit of One Versus the other is.

I will research it tonight.

Is one going to give much more flavor or is it simply easier to blend?

I'm not really sure there is a benefit to a 1.5 run other than it being a way to use wine that you don't have enough to do a full stripping run with. I have a 15.5 gal boiler but because I have an internal electric heating element I try to never run less than 8 gallons to make sure it never gets low enough to uncover the element. Sometimes that works out where I have a little left over and sometimes I just feel it would give the best flavor in the final product, although it actually tends to be a little harder to blend the 1.5. A double run tends to be easier to blend.

One thing you can do is run the first run as if it were going to be the only run, try it and see what you think, then make the decision about if you want to do a 2nd or 1.5 run.

You are working with a handicap having added sugar so the amount of flavor that will carry over will be less than if you had made it without added sugar.

I know there is a lot of conflicting information but that is because everybody does it differently.

[jonnys_spirit]

Part of the concept of a double distillation pot still protocol is that the abv of the low wines for spirit run step will largely determine the abv of your new make after cuts and 30-40% low wines has consistently given me cut product of about 120-130 proof. That’s also a generally accepted optimal proof for barrel aging and easy measuring for dilution and napkin math (two parts likker, one part water for 80’ish proof) On a 1.5 run you might want to consider stripping to a slightly higher abv depending on how much must and low wines you’d be blending to get to a particular proof after spirit run fractions and blending your cuts. I don’t think there’s a particularly better way one way or another. I do think that going down that path a number of times will definitely lead somewhere very interesting and worthwhile.

I’m still experimenting but i think a 1.5 is mostly because one doesn’t have enough low wines to fill the still for a full on spirit run and reasons that there’s more flavor potential. All sounds logical and worthwhile exploring.

Cranky posted at the same time.
Cheers!
-jonny

[Slivovitz]

In future I won't be adding sugar. I wanted more volume this time.

I have 180 pounds of plums naturally fermenting on wild yeast. That will be my true Palinka / Slivovitz.

I figure I have 2 weeks until it is ready to distill so this is practice.

I'm going to run the first full pot and taste it. This is going to be a really exciting but confusing day Sunday.

I will live update in the "my first" section tomorrow.

[stillanoob]

I just did my first run of plum brandy. The "hearts" of the low wine were pretty good. But the double distilled product is better. I kept a little of the low wine "hearts" to be able to do some taste tests as it airs out and ages a little. However, I have no doubt that the double distilled product is better. The plum brandy is the best "white" I have made and I have to say I am a fanboy now!

[Slivovitz]

Ok, we are at 150 degrees on my first run. I'm making a "my first run" thread now!

[Slivovitz]

See my progress so far in the "My first" section ....

[BourbonBoi]

How many pounds of peaches and plums did you use for this run? I’m looking to pick some peaches this weekend for my first peach adventure! Was planning on using 5 gallon buckets, trying to determine how much to put in each bucket.

[Slivovitz]

BB,
you need to decide if you want max flavor or max ABV in your must.
This time I chose to add sugar and yeast to increase potential alcohol. The flavor is decent but would be better fermented naturally.

I used the "Tater" recipe. You need to read ever page of this thread like I did. viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2196

I will try to find my exact recipe. I made about 11 gallons of apricot wine which is what you see here.

Do your research!

How big is your still?

[Slivovitz]

How many pounds of peaches and plums did you use for this run? I’m looking to pick some peaches this weekend for my first peach adventure! Was planning on using 5 gallon buckets, trying to determine how much to put in each bucket.

posting.php?mode=quote&f=14&p=7622342

[BourbonBoi]

Thanks! My neighbor goes to Serbia a few times year and has turned me on to Rakjia. I have only run grains so I’m trying to break I to the fruit world. I have a 9 gallon pot still.

[Slivovitz]

In serbia/croatia where my family is from Slivovitz is the national drunk!

Plums naturally fermented and distilled twice.