Very first time... Air Still... ferment stall?

[Yenn Poxx]

I got an Air Still for xmas and I'm on my very first batch. Never done this before so I'm using the recipe that came with the still (supplemented by info gleaned from the British guy on the YouTube videos who, I am now learning, isn't beloved on this forum).
In the fermenter: 21 L water + 6 kg sugar. At 30 degrees added TurboYeast (I know, I know). Went to check the OG at this point and found the kit only came with a spirits hydrometer, which didn't register the reading. Ran to my buddy's house and borrowed a brewer's hydrometer and got a reading with that: 1.05. Added the TurboCarbon (I know) and put it in a 20.5 degree C room to do its thing.
It's now a bit over 3 weeks later and the airlock is still bubbling, maybe one bubble every 10 sec. Took a gravity reading and got 1.22. Smells a bit yeasty but not off. Tastes a bit fruity and certainly a bit alcoholic. I don't have a Ph meter.

My questions: 1) Does this gravity reading make sense? I took it numerous times. I'll attach a photo.
2) I've read that the Turbo is supposed to finish in a week. Why would this one still be going?
3) Any advice for my next step? Or should I just keep being patient?

I know some are going to tell me to chuck it all because Turbo is garbage and I should stick with

Tried & True, and I plan to do that in subsequent attempts. But I'd really like to make this work if possible. Also, I've been reading through this board for hours and haven't found this exact issue, so telling me to go do some reading isn't going to be helpful (there are 17 pages just under Sugar, and I do have other responsibilities). Thanks in advance!

[psf]

based of your water and sugar you should have a SG of 1.092 not 1.05. see below from the calculator on the front page.

6kg sugar made up to 25L total volume
should have an SG 1.092 and only require 21L of water
and should produce a wash of 14 % alcohol.

I edited it to remove my incorrect statement about turbo yeast

[Yenn Poxx]

Thank you for your response.
I understand how that should all be how it's supposed to work. I still don't know why my reading says 1.22 and whether or not the wash is still viable. Am I reading the hydrometer wrong?

[psf]

You should search "stalled" or "stuck" fermentation, not sugar. more info then I can type in that search query. this problem is a daily topic.

it's either your temperature is too low, your PH has crashed, or you need to be patient. probably a combination of all the above. which are preventable problems when doing a sugar wash no matter what yeast you use. what's the temp of the mash? and the PH?

you look to be reading in right. but the meter in a class of water, does it read 1.000 after temperature correction?

[shadylane]

I still don't know why my reading says 1.22 and whether or not the wash is still viable. Am I reading the hydrometer wrong?

The reading in the pic is 1.022
At 20c the turbo will be slower than normal, I'd warm it to to 25 - 30c.

[Yenn Poxx]

Thanks again. Checked the hydrometer and it is accurate, but I was reading from the middle of the meniscus and not the bottom, for what that's worth. I guess I should invest in a pH meter and be more patient. Doesn't help that my wife is telling me she's tired of seeing a white bucket in the corner of the dining room. I'll give it more time and attempt a stripping run when I deem it ready. I will post results here.
Cheers!

[Yenn Poxx]

Thanks shady. A bit behind the learning curve still...

[rubberduck71]

I would guess the pH crashed too low, which is inherent to sugar washes, and the yeast stalled.

If you haven't already done the sacrificial run, use 4L of this stuff as that step. You can run it even though it's 1.022, just make sure you use some anti-foaming agent to prevent puking. You can also use some ceramic rasching rings (aka boil enhancers) which help break up big boiling bubbles into smaller ones, again to help prevent puking.

From your post-count, I see you're new to the site. That Search Bar in the blue banner at top of the page is your new best friend. Or you can Google it: just type your question or topic & add "+ homedistiller" and you'll get right to it. There's lots of info on how to make stuff on an AirStill (which was also my first rig).

Lastly, when going for whiskeys or other flavored spirits, I would recommend the 1.5 distillation technique. I cut & pasted this from another thread I posted on an AirStill question:

What's nice about the AirStill is that each run is ~3 hrs. But it comes at the cost of volume per batch constraint.

When I read about the 1.5 technique on this site, I used it exclusively until upgraded to a larger system for whiskeys, tequilas, rums (not for neutrals). It is a time & space saver & also brings over more flavors from your wash (Odin's Rye Bread recipe was my go-to).

You start with your 4L charge & run it. Consider this your "stripping" run. It would start north of 50% & I'd take it down to ~10-15%. You'll end up with ~1L of low wines.

Empty your boiler, toss in the 1L of low wines & top up with 3L of wash. Now this "spirit" run starts >70%. I'd generally collect 9-11 beakers @ 150 mL each. From that I'd generally get 600 mL of hearts + 800 mL of feints. Keep tossing the feints into the next run until you run out of wash (generally 5-6 total for a 25L fermenter bucket). Keep the feints from the last run for your next new batch. Each 25L batch would yield ~3L of hearts.

Good luck, have fun, keep reading. Tried & True Recipes are your new best friend.

Duck

[Yenn Poxx]

Excellent advice Duck, thank you so much.

[Trapped-in-Oz]

Too many variables to guess why ferment misbehaving.

Alternative to the Duck method when using an Air Still:

With a wash of about 8.8 litre….. I run two 4 litre strips all the way down to near 0%…. each strip being about 1400 ml at about 30%…….. for the spirit run I combine the two strips and if it’s a malt or molasses also the tails from previous spirit run.

On the spirit run I collect the first 500 ml in ten jars of 50 ml. I discard the heads which is usually 300 or 350 ml. The hearts are collected down to about 40 or 45%…. the tails down to about 15%.

My heads are never reused and if it’s a vodka also no reuse of the tails.

If a vodka, carbon filter.

And on all runs I have copper in the basket.

[Lights Out]

Up the temperature if possible and use a sanitised spoon to stir up the yeast.

[shadylane]

It's now a bit over 3 weeks later and the airlock is still bubbling, maybe one bubble every 10 sec. Took a gravity reading and got 1.022 Smells a bit yeasty but not off. Tastes a bit fruity and certainly a bit alcoholic.

Sounds like it's still working, don't worry too much about the pH.
Turbo has pH buffers and nutrients mixed in with the yeast.

[Yenn Poxx]

Added the finings yesterday and start the distilling tomorrow!

[Trapped-in-Oz]

Added the finings yesterday and start the distilling tomorrow!

I have never used 'finings'.......... but my fermenter overnights in the fridge and clears nicely.

[Yenn Poxx]

Are you using the Air Still with that charcoal stuff? I'm not sure an overnight chill will clear that mess.

In other news, I'm on my second batch of distillation and it seems to be going very well. Some of the connoisseur on this site might find fault with the flavor but to me it tastes fairly, but certainly not entirely, neutral. For the first one, I followed the instructions that came with the Air Still. All the rest will go into a true stripping run.
Cheers!

[Trapped-in-Oz]

I followed the instructions that came with the Air Still.

I never follow instructions or use charcoal mess….. Still Spirit Air Stills are good equipment…. their instructions are a waste.

What brand of Air Still do you have ?

[Yenn Poxx]

It's from Still Spirits.

I'm inclined to agree with you re: the charcoal mess. Seemed to make things unneccessarily unpleasant. I think I'll skip that step in the future.

I'm starting my spirit runs today. Maybe get into flavorings this weekend. I don't think my still came with an infusion basket (or I somehow can't find it) so I suppose I'll have to use a muslin bag. Do you have much experience with this?

[Yenn Poxx]

Following the awesome chart by Mozr (Getting The Best Out Of My Air Still), I ended up with what you see in the photo. Behind hearts 1-6 are the first four takes from the tails run.

After tasting those four, I didn't detect much (if any) degredation in flavor. Could I assume that they are suitable to combine with the hearts? I did get a further 275 or so ml of tails after those which didn't seem top-quality. Looks to be approx. 3.5 L of liquid left in the still.

Final question, for anyone who would care to answer: should I be tasting these hot or adding an appropriate amout of water first? I'm thinking of going out to buy an eye-dropper so I can mix very small amounts for tasting purposes.

Thanks again everyone for the guidance.
Cheers!

[Saltbush Bill]

Best to cover jars with cloth or coffee filters and let air for 24 hours before deciding on cuts.
Mix samples 50/50 with water. A teaspoon bent to form a tiny dipper works for that job.
Don't just taste, smell as well, put a little from the tails jars on your hands and rub hard , smelling at the same time......it helps bring out the smell of tails.

[Trapped-in-Oz]

don't think my still came with an infusion basket (or I somehow can't find it) ... Do you have much experience with this?

Basket is not part of the ‘kit’……. can purchase
https://stillspirits.com/products/air-s ... ion-basket

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I continuously use Air Still and only an Air Still
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suggested diameters for copper are 70, 85 and 95 mm.... three disc increase the area of copper with about 7 mm between each disc... have no holes in the 70 (not in picture)

can sometimes even use the basket for infusion botanicals !
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[Yenn Poxx]

Seems most places don't have the baskets in stock

I'm going to try a muslin bag- hopefully I can get it to affix to the top. Maybe with string...

[Yenn Poxx]

Did my tasting... and I can't discern a whole lot of difference between the 6 cuts I took from the hearts and the first four from the tails. It must be really subtle.

Since my goal from this batch is to do a third distillation using botanicals to make gin and absinthe, I'm thinking I can use all of the above plus some (or most) of what I am now thinking is the actual tails.

Now during that next distillation I plan on putting aside the fores again, but do I really need to worry about separating heads, hearts and tails? They will all be flavored with the same stuff, and one would think (ok, this noob would think) that the triple-distillation would have removed anything that counts as an off-flavor.

Thoughts, anyone?

[Saltbush Bill]

but do I really need to worry about separating heads, hearts and tails? They will all be flavored with the same stuff, and one would think (ok, this noob would think) that the triple-distillation would have removed anything that counts as an off-flavor.

Distillation on its own removes nothing......you could distill 20 times and unless you make cuts each time you will just be recycling the same old rubbish.

[Trapped-in-Oz]

Now during that next distillation I plan on putting aside the fores again, but do I really need to worry about separating heads, hearts and tails?

I have triple distilled for himbeergeist:
full strip.
spirit run cuts heads and tails.
add clean water to carbon filter at 45%.
add some more clean water.
and with the raspberries I ran until the collection reached the desired 42% (and the drip at spout was 3%).
~ ~

fores are heads and heads are fores

[rubberduck71]

Heads smell a lot like finger nail polish remover. They should be abundantly distinguishable in both taste & smell.

On my airstill they typically went away on jar 4 or 5. I was drawing off 250 ml per jar.

YMMV

[Trapped-in-Oz]

On my airstill they typically went away on jar 4 or 5. I was drawing off 250 ml per jar.

250 ml per 4 or 5 jars is 1 litre or 1.25 litre……. that's a lot of heads! ..... do you have an extra large capacity ‘airstill’ ?

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[rubberduck71]

250 ml per 4 or 5 jars is 1 litre or 1.25 litre……. that's a lot of heads! ..... do you have an extra large capacity ‘airstill’ ?

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No, just the standard 4L size, but I am super strict when making cuts. As others on HD have said: quality over quantity!

Looking back at my notes after I got home, it was actually 3-4 jars of 150 ml not 250... So ~450-600 ml of heads. And up to the point where I upgraded to larger system, I was utilizing the 1.5 distillation technique. So batch 1 was a "stripping run," and all of it (~0.6 L) went into the boiler & topped up with 3.4 L of wash for batch 2 as a spirit run. Each of the subsequent runs I got ~600 ml hearts & ~800 ml heads/tails.

[Trapped-in-Oz]

standard 4L size

batch 1 was a "stripping run," and all of it (~0.6 L) went into the boiler & topped up with 3.4 L of wash for batch 2 as a spirit run.

So you only have 600 ml from your strip run..... because?.... you have taken hard cuts on your strip?...... and cuts again on your spirit run?.... and your spirit run is mostly wash?..................

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[rubberduck71]

So you only have 600 ml from your strip run..... because?.... you have taken hard cuts on your strip?...... and cuts again on your spirit run?.... and your spirit run is mostly wash?..................

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Because that's all you get from a typical 7-8% wash. It starts coming out @ ~55% & I take it down to ~10%. No cuts on a stripping run. Keep everything & toss it into batch 2 stripping run.

On subsequent runs, you'll get ~800 ml of feints. i.e. the first spirit run is 600 ml of strip + 3.4 L of wash, but then second, third, fourth, etc... (until you run out of wash) average 800 ml of feints + 3.2 L wash.

[Trapped-in-Oz]

toss it into batch 2 stripping run

On subsequent runs, you'll get ~800 ml of feints. i.e. the first spirit run is 600 ml of strip + 3.4 L of wash, but then second, third, fourth, etc... (until you run out of wash) average 800 ml of feints + 3.2 L wash.

it has been hard to follow:

your 4 or 5 jars became 3 or 4 jars.
your 250 ml became 150 ml.
and your “for batch 2 as a spirit run” has become “into batch 2 stripping run”.
and your wash is 7.5%.

Would you describe your method…. "first spirit run is 600 ml of strip" and “average 800 ml of feints + 3.2 L wash”…. as single distilling ?

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