Heating Element Control

[Yummyrum]

Never heard of or seen anything usable in any Australian hardware or electronic stores .
Closest was a kitset Motor speed controller but it was only rated at 10amps and cost about 5x more than the controller you just posted a pic of .

[Saltbush Bill]

These are reliable and cheap.....different distributors world wide if you look around.
https://www.stilldragon.com.au/diy-controller-kit/

[Deplorable]

I have this all wired up, but have questions

Does the input and output from the SSVR matter between 1 and 2?

I've read conflicting posts about grounding the Pot. Does it need to be grounded?

The side of my SSVR says grounding of the radiator is not recommended, but I see most here are? Ground it or not?
Reversing the wires from the pot at the SSVR will change the direction needed to raise and lower resistance if I have then crossed?

[Yummyrum]

Does the input and output from the SSVR matter between 1 and 2?

It will make no difference to how it works if you switch those around .However , there is more electrical stress on the Pot with one configuration due to the internal configuration of the SSVR . One of the first Manufacturers of these devices had this explained in their spec sheets .

In reality it won’t matter so long as you use a physically large Pot . It becomes a problem in pissy little Pots there the physical distance between the carbon track and the body of the Pot are small .

I've read conflicting posts about grounding the Pot. Does it need to be grounded?

You should always ground your Pot . Any exposed metal has the potential to become live and become a point for electrocution . The pot connections are actually at quite high voltage and there is the potential for internal breakdown in the pot its self.

Interestingly however , grounding the Pot does give rise to the reason above about why swapping the 1&2 wires can cause more stress on the Pot . However safety overrides component reliability ... so Always Ground the Pot .

The side of my SSVR says grounding of the radiator is not recommended, but I see most here are? Ground it or not?

I’m supprised to know why they would not recommend that . But again , all exposed metal parts need to be Grounded .

[Aarcuda]

Have you seen THIS...???

I have 2 fotek ssr's, one is a ssr 40 va that i got from amazon and I am pretty sure it is real and the other is an ssr 25 va that I got from ebay and I am pretty sure it is a cheap knockoff. I will try to post some pics of them tomorrow to show the obvious difference.

After ordering two of these Foteks SSR-40VA from ebay I found a few articles talking about cheap chinese knockoffs that use lower rated components so there goes that $9.00!

heres one http://www.kegkits.com/SSRs.htm which links to https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 19311.html

What is a quality brand to use that isnt plagued with counterfeit parts?

[NZChris]

No matter how much you spend, or how good the quality is, if a component failure is going to be a major inconvenience, you should have a spare, or spare parts.

A fellow NZ poster has recently had a controller failure, so I've bought another unit to build me a spare control panel so that, in the event of a failed controller, the fix is a simple swap done in minutes, not a repair of the control panel.

[Aarcuda]

Sounds like a good plan. nothing worse than the heat going out at a critical point. But man, I am just now buying the pieces for my controller and they arent cheap!. The dang plugs and sockets for a 30A controller are right up at $100 by themselves. The 10' 10/4 power cord was another $25 and thats just the start! I swear it might have been cheaper to just buy one made but then you dont know what the part quality is of the store bought controllers is until you get it!

[rubberduck71]

Could I get everyone's thoughts on this unit?

https://brewhaus.com/heater-controller-110v-220v/

Thanks,
Duck

[Andrew_90]

Or go direct to the source, China.

https://www.banggood.com/EU-or-UK-Plug- ... urEALw_wcB

[Deplorable]

Can you get it with the female receptacle you need?

[Andrew_90]

Can you get it with the female receptacle you need?

There are different versions, look different, do the same thing but are designed for different countries.

[Andrew_90]

https://www.banggood.com/4000W-AC-0-220 ... rehouse=CN

[6 Row Joe]

What about a Router Speed Controller....? I believe they are just HD rheostats, not the preferred variac.However, because they are designed to regulates the speed of a router motor, probably up to 3 HP at say 10-15 amps, wouldn't that do just as well...? Easy to plug into wall, and plug heating element into Speed controller....??? Not too pricey either..... Anybody ever done that??? Feed back............??

Thanks,

CW

I bought one from Harbor Freight and use it on a 1250 watt element. It has worked perfect a few years now. It's not 230 v. Or what ever you use.

[ThomasBrewer]

After ordering two of these Foteks SSR-40VA from ebay I found a few articles talking about cheap chinese knockoffs that use lower rated components so there goes that $9.00!

heres one http://www.kegkits.com/SSRs.htm which links to https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 19311.html

What is a quality brand to use that isnt plagued with counterfeit parts?

In the US, order from Auber. They stand behind what they sell.

[Littlestan]

After ordering two of these Foteks SSR-40VA from ebay I found a few articles talking about cheap chinese knockoffs that use lower rated components so there goes that $9.00!

heres one http://www.kegkits.com/SSRs.htm which links to https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 19311.html

What is a quality brand to use that isnt plagued with counterfeit parts?

In the US, order from Auber. They stand behind what they sell.

Can second the high quality of Auber Instruments products; just completed assembly of my 220v controller comprised entirely of their offerings and am very happy with them.

[NormandieStill]

Just wasnt sure if there was something different I could use that I could pick up at a hardware/electronics store.

I would suspect that most hardware stores would only have household dimmers which are designed to dim loads of up to 100W (OK, maybe 500W if you put lots of bulbs on the one circuit). They're far from able to handle the 1500W of your element. If you really want off-the-shelf, you might see if you can get your hands on a lighting dimmer for concerts. They'll handle the loads and some have override knobs which would let you use them without a lighting control desk... but even an old one second-hand will cost considerably more than an SCR from eBay.

[RoninFrog]

This is what I got going on,i purchased an assembled unit in a locking 12"j-box wired for 120 volt and to drive a 2500watt electric hot water heater. The controller i have(if it's a controller) measures in amps,when i am driving my heater element , before i forget my boiler is 13 gallon stainless steel milk jug with a light and sight glass.2500watt element,and it is very slow not enough horse power for my tastes,i started out and continued to run propane burners and electric seems allot very slow. What i have been doing is using my handheld butane scorch torch. It's got some flame. So i set up my rig in a fashion where i can hit the boiler on the opposite side of the heating element and low, i fire up my torch and with the electric running at 6 amps(it goes up to 14 amps)i start heating with my torch and in 30 maybe 45 minutes i can get the first plate bubbling and going up fast. I then cut my torch and with only electric finish off my run no problem. Without the torch it took almost 5 hours at 10 amps,just to get the first plate bubbling. Way to long. I have also been thinking of induction cooktop,and my other electric. I really prefer electric. I don't like running propane but i have to and i keep 4 different fire extinguisher..my goal is 100% electric.still.when i use combo torch and heater element i get it stripped and hot back set cooking my mash for my next run.and cleaned up in under 2 hours. Otherwise i have spent 7 hours before i got frustrated.with my 2500 watt element.can anyone i.d.what this is called? The bottom photo

[still_stirrin]

What gage wire do you have on the input power cord? What about the wire to the element?

Your circuit will see up to 20 amps at full power: 2500 watts / 120 VAC = 20.83 amps.

Any wire run at that power should be at least 10 gage, preferably 8 gage.

Remember, when your SSR fails, it will fail at full power. But, if your household circuit is protected by a 20 amp breaker, it will most likely trip at that condition. So, you have a little security. If your house is wired like most homes here in the USA, then most household circuits are protected to 20 amps although the electrical outlets are made for 15 amp circuits only.
ss

[shadylane]

120v x 20a = 2400w that's the max a 20 amp circuit can temporarily supply.
80% of 2400w = 1800W If the circuit is used for an extended period.

Forget using 120v and change over to 240V

[FLOB]

Well, I thought I could do this, but it turns out I can't so I am bothering the HD hive mind for some help.

I have a Still Dragon control box I put together a while back. I wanted to add something so I could keep track of the power going to the heating element. Ordered a display I had seen go in a few controllers. The way I have it set up keep tripping my spa gfci. It did work once. And while it worked, it looked like it was working well. I don't know why it worked once but trips the rest of the time.

I fear the thing that might be causing the problem is that I am working with only two hots and ground, no 4th wire neutral. I'm not sure this display will work with what I've got. Figured I'd take a chance on the display working.

I don't have any of those bars people use in their boxes to run power everywhere. Maybe that is what is needed before going to the SSR. I thought (probably incorrectly) that wiring the display to the #1 post on the SSR and the ground would give it power. Read in several places the power needs to come from before the SSR so that's what I was trying to do.

Not sure if it matters, but the controller is running a 5500W heating element on a keg. Recently did three stripping runs without any issues. Should I just scrap it? Was hoping to have the display to help reflux those stripping runs for my first go at a neutral.

Thanks

[witch]

Is it overheating then tripping don't see any fan in there only few holes in the side ?

[FLOB]

It isn't over heating. The trip is instant. No fan, but extra vent holes. It has never felt hot.

[Salt Must Flow]

Well, I thought I could do this, but it turns out I can't so I am bothering the HD hive mind for some help.

I have a Still Dragon control box I put together a while back. I wanted to add something so I could keep track of the power going to the heating element. Ordered a display I had seen go in a few controllers. The way I have it set up keep tripping my spa gfci. It did work once. And while it worked, it looked like it was working well. I don't know why it worked once but trips the rest of the time.

I fear the thing that might be causing the problem is that I am working with only two hots and ground, no 4th wire neutral. I'm not sure this display will work with what I've got. Figured I'd take a chance on the display working.

I don't have any of those bars people use in their boxes to run power everywhere. Maybe that is what is needed before going to the SSR. I thought (probably incorrectly) that wiring the display to the #1 post on the SSR and the ground would give it power. Read in several places the power needs to come from before the SSR so that's what I was trying to do.

Not sure if it matters, but the controller is running a 5500W heating element on a keg. Recently did three stripping runs without any issues. Should I just scrap it? Was hoping to have the display to help reflux those stripping runs for my first go at a neutral.

Thanks

controller.jpg

I'm no electrician, but I'd presume your suspicion may be correct. I'd replace the cable with one that has a dedicated neutral. That is what the neutral wire is for. I'm sure I'm not telling you what you don't already know. I wire all of my 240V receptacles with 4 wires. Now if I intend to plug something in that runs on 3 wires, I simply replace that thing's plug with a 4 wire plug so all of my electric devices are compatible with all of my receptacles.

[FLOB]

Well, I thought I could do this, but it turns out I can't so I am bothering the HD hive mind for some help.

I have a Still Dragon control box I put together a while back. I wanted to add something so I could keep track of the power going to the heating element. Ordered a display I had seen go in a few controllers. The way I have it set up keep tripping my spa gfci. It did work once. And while it worked, it looked like it was working well. I don't know why it worked once but trips the rest of the time.

I fear the thing that might be causing the problem is that I am working with only two hots and ground, no 4th wire neutral. I'm not sure this display will work with what I've got. Figured I'd take a chance on the display working.

I don't have any of those bars people use in their boxes to run power everywhere. Maybe that is what is needed before going to the SSR. I thought (probably incorrectly) that wiring the display to the #1 post on the SSR and the ground would give it power. Read in several places the power needs to come from before the SSR so that's what I was trying to do.

Not sure if it matters, but the controller is running a 5500W heating element on a keg. Recently did three stripping runs without any issues. Should I just scrap it? Was hoping to have the display to help reflux those stripping runs for my first go at a neutral.

Thanks

controller.jpg

I'm no electrician, but I'd presume your suspicion may be correct. I'd replace the cable with one that has a dedicated neutral. That is what the neutral wire is for. I'm sure I'm not telling you what you don't already know. I wire all of my 240V receptacles with 4 wires. Now if I intend to plug something in that runs on 3 wires, I simply replace that thing's plug with a 4 wire plug so all of my electric devices are compatible with all of my receptacles.

House is old enough to have been built with only 3 wires in the 240V lines so the receptacle I'm using was pre-wired when I got here. Re doing it is an option, but I think would just continue trying to get by without it first. Or maybe try something analog.

[Salt Must Flow]

Well, I thought I could do this, but it turns out I can't so I am bothering the HD hive mind for some help.

I have a Still Dragon control box I put together a while back. I wanted to add something so I could keep track of the power going to the heating element. Ordered a display I had seen go in a few controllers. The way I have it set up keep tripping my spa gfci. It did work once. And while it worked, it looked like it was working well. I don't know why it worked once but trips the rest of the time.

I fear the thing that might be causing the problem is that I am working with only two hots and ground, no 4th wire neutral. I'm not sure this display will work with what I've got. Figured I'd take a chance on the display working.

I don't have any of those bars people use in their boxes to run power everywhere. Maybe that is what is needed before going to the SSR. I thought (probably incorrectly) that wiring the display to the #1 post on the SSR and the ground would give it power. Read in several places the power needs to come from before the SSR so that's what I was trying to do.

Not sure if it matters, but the controller is running a 5500W heating element on a keg. Recently did three stripping runs without any issues. Should I just scrap it? Was hoping to have the display to help reflux those stripping runs for my first go at a neutral.

Thanks

controller.jpg

I'm no electrician, but I'd presume your suspicion may be correct. I'd replace the cable with one that has a dedicated neutral. That is what the neutral wire is for. I'm sure I'm not telling you what you don't already know. I wire all of my 240V receptacles with 4 wires. Now if I intend to plug something in that runs on 3 wires, I simply replace that thing's plug with a 4 wire plug so all of my electric devices are compatible with all of my receptacles.

House is old enough to have been built with only 3 wires in the 240V lines so the receptacle I'm using was pre-wired when I got here. Re doing it is an option, but I think would just continue trying to get by without it first. Or maybe try something analog.

I suspected that was the worst case scenario. Well I suppose as long as you ditch that digital readout, your controller should continue to work just fine with 3 wires. Then again you could always modify your box so that you can run an entirely separate 120V wire from a 120V receptacle to that box dedicated for wiring that digital readout. That should solve your GFIC issue and keep the digital readout.

[PLAYMP]

I have hopefully a simple question that I'll drop here rather than create a separate thread.

My controller box that I wired up myself to control a 4500w element blew yesterday and I'm in the market for an upgrade. I think I ran it too hot for too long doing some marathon distilling sessions while my wife and kid were away for a few. Not unexpected for primarily cheap chinese parts from what I gather.

Looking at doing this kit from Auber Instruments:

https://www.auberins.com/index.php?main ... cts_id=786

It's expensive but it's also everything I need and I think will be built to last more than my previous controller. Anyway in the description it says it can accommodate 1 5kw element or 2 3kw elements. I'm a little hung up on the 5kw part and want to ask if anybody can see a reason a more conventional 5.5 kw element wouldn't work? I'll be using a 30 amp circuit and the relay that comes with it is rated for 40. I'll also be using 10 gauge wire which should be rated appropriately.

[kimbodious]

@PLAYMP I wired in a bypass switch in my controller for times when I ran the element at full power. Could be something to consider if you a making another controller?

[Yummyrum]

PLAYMP
I think you’ll be just fine with the 5500w.

[PLAYMP]

@PLAYMP I wired in a bypass switch in my controller for times when I ran the element at full power. Could be something to consider if you a making another controller?

That is some really smart thinking there. Between stripping runs and heating up my mash water I probably run at max power 75% of the time anyway. Guessing that probably took a toll on my unit.

[NZChris]

My control box has a three way switch, Controlled, Off, Full Power.