Foreshots and Heads removal based on temperature.

[prankster1590]

In sorry. Im a realy realy new newbie and I ask stupid questions.

The question is the following:

Say i have a 15 V% alcohol mixture with the Foreshots and Heads still in it. Don't know the amounts but I quess you could consider it a binary mix.

The liquid of a binary mix of 15V% alcohol would boil at about 92C (198F).

Somebody mentioned that you should remove everything that comes over before 80C (176F) but the mix won't boil before 92C (198F). So does something happen at about 75-80C (168-176F)? First drops should come over at that temp somebody mentioned. But again. If you consider the mix as a binary mix, it would boil at 92C (198F).

[Salt Must Flow]

Temp doesn't determine cuts. You don't make cuts on a stripping run either.

[Stonecutter]

In sorry. Im a realy realy new newbie and I ask stupid

Somebody mentioned that you should remove everything that comes over before 80C (176F) but the mix won't boil before 92C (198F). So does something happen at about 75-80C (168-176F)? First drops should come over at that temp somebody mentioned. But again. If you consider the mix as a binary mix, it would boil at 92C (198F).

Who is this “somebody”?
Spoon feeding is not an option here. I understand you’re new but you’re kicking a hornets nest. Even a half assed attempt at a search will yield plenty of info. You claimed in your intro post that you’re interested in the science of Distilling. Well scientists have to investigate and research right? Use that search function in the upper right and read through the novice distillers section.

[prankster1590]

In sorry. Im a realy realy new newbie and I ask stupid

Somebody mentioned that you should remove everything that comes over before 80C (176F) but the mix won't boil before 92C (198F). So does something happen at about 75-80C (168-176F)? First drops should come over at that temp somebody mentioned. But again. If you consider the mix as a binary mix, it would boil at 92C (198F).

Who is this “somebody”?
Spoon feeding is not an option here. I understand you’re new but you’re kicking a hornets nest. Even a half assed attempt at a search will yield plenty of info. You claimed in your intro post that you’re interested in the science of Distilling. Well scientists have to investigate and research right? Use that search function in the upper right and read through the novice distillers section.

Do you consider yourself to be a happy person?

[squigglefunk]

So does something happen at about 75-80C (168-176F)?

trying to find a question buried in that post is enough to make a happy man grumpy!

yes, something happens at 168-176°F - distillation happens

did you have another question? I see the title says something about fores/heads removal based on temp... that would be wrong

in fact nothing done during running a still is really based on temperatures

you could remove fores based on the volume of your ferment, you could remove heads based on your personal preference as to how much acetone you like to drink.

[bcook608]

making cuts by temperature has been covered in MANY threads. Temp is not a good indicator of what is happening at any given point in your run. The only time temperature is really relevant is while you're running reflux columns and even then, it's the CHANGE in temperature that you're looking for, not a set temperature.

If you want information on how to make good cuts, see the link in my signature about making cuts on a pot still. Realistically, this is the best way to do cuts on ANY type of rig until you get some good experience running your specific setup.

Keep reading. It'll all start to make sense more and more with each thread you complete.

[Twisted Brick]

.
Sorry for the 'welcome' prankster, but the heads-up offered above ring true. Unfortunately, the sheer number of new folks who show up mistaken and misinformed is a ball-buster because they never stop coming. In a great many cases, 'The Retailer' sees in every prospect an easy sucker and sells him an extra required item: thermometer, thumper, turbo yeast, pH stabilizer etc. As fallacies like these start flatulating around the internet groups they get blindly repeated and become gospel.

Sometimes HD members can be blunt, (we're mostly a happy group) but a characteristic of this forum is to openly question and challenge falsehoods and unsupported myths in order to promote sound, efficient stilling practices and most of all, safety. The real value in this practice is to try to ensure the most current 'best' information available thereby minimizing the specter of 'somebody mentioned'.

You don't know what you don't know (none of us do) but your best bet is to follow the advice to read. Alot. In time, it will all begin to sink in. Remove that 'crutch' thermometer from your still (and maybe fix it to the wall where you can monitor ambient temps). Only then can you start to rely on your senses and (growing) knowledge of the processes involved.

[Saltbush Bill]

ay i have a 15 V% alcohol mixture with the Foreshots and Heads still in it. Don't know the amounts but I quess you could consider it a binary mix.

The liquid of a binary mix of 15V% alcohol would boil at about 92C (198F).

Somebody mentioned that you should remove everything that comes over before 80C (176F) but the mix won't boil before 92C (198F). So does something happen at about 75-80C (168-176F)? First drops should come over at that temp somebody mentioned. But again. If you consider the mix as a binary mix, it would boil at 92C (198F).

Forget the numbers, they will only serve to confuse the hell out of you. Reading the following link should help you understand why. http://www.kelleybarts.com/PhotoXfer/Re ... gMyth.html

You don't make cuts on a stripping run either.

Thats not a hard and fast rule, some choose to some don't......there is nothing wrong with taking a slow fores cut at the beginning of a strip run......it can save you a hell of a lot of time on spirit run day.

[Stonecutter]

Do you consider yourself to be a happy person?

No.
I’m a cantankerous belligerent old fool.

Who is this “somebody” you keep referring to?
If you want to have an open and engaging conversation within this forum let’s all get on the same page. Name your source. I respect that you’ve posted this in the new distillers lounge but honestly I think you’re smarter than this prankster. I think you know your source is in “Section 12”. I’m not going to feed you the topics that are readily available to inform you about why certain hobbyists make the decisions they do. That’s on you.
Twisted and BCook have given great info.
Again, all the information is here. Go find it. That’s the best advice I can give.

[shadylane]

Somebody mentioned that you should remove everything that comes over before 80C (176F) but the mix won't boil before 92C (198F). So does something happen at about 75-80C (168-176F)? First drops should come over at that temp somebody mentioned.

Good question.
Asked in the Novice section.

I think what has you confused, was a reflux still was being used.
The pot was boiling at 198*f and the top of the column was 170*ish.

[Stonecutter]

I realize I’m being a little bit eccentric

I’m not too proud to admit it. You’ve picked a topic title that sets pretentious ass holes like me off.
Truth is I have no idea about the science behind it. When I first started I was running my still off of a PID. Looking back now it was a complete sh*t show. Once I started relying less and less on thermometers, parrots and hydrometers my senses started to take over and IMO (which means nothing) I began to get more comfortable with my rigs and spirit. I’m not staying those things don’t have a place and each one is a tool but to understand their limits and use is the key.
From my experience collecting distillate is organic because in the end it’s tailored to the operators’ own preferences. It’s a clockwork orange so to speak. Once you get some time in front of the spout you’ll start to get a sense of what to expect.

[Bradster68]

I realize I’m being a little bit eccentric

I’m not too proud to admit it. You’ve picked a topic title that sets pretentious ass holes like me off.
Truth is I have no idea about the science behind it. When I first started I was running my still off of a PID. Looking back now it was a complete sh*t show. Once I started relying less and less on thermometers, parrots and hydrometers my senses started to take over and IMO (which means nothing) I began to get more comfortable with my rigs and spirit. I’m not staying those things don’t have a place and each one is a tool but to understand their limits and use is the key.
From my experience collecting distillate is organic because in the end it’s tailored to the operators’ own preferences. It’s a clockwork orange so to speak. Once you get some time in front of the spout you’ll start to get a sense of what to expect.

I couldn't agree more SC. I got 2 thermometers on my pot and after a year I dont even pay attention anymore. My cut jars are wide and my taste has gotten better. At least according to my tastes buds. Time and runs under the belt are the best thing.

[Twisted Brick]

Once I started relying less and less on thermometers, parrots and hydrometers my senses started to take over and IMO (which means nothing) I began to get more comfortable with my rigs and spirit. I’m not staying those things don’t have a place and each one is a tool but to understand their limits and use is the key.
From my experience collecting distillate is organic because in the end it’s tailored to the operators’ own preferences. It’s a clockwork orange so to speak. Once you get some time in front of the spout you’ll start to get a sense of what to expect.

Pretty damn good endorsement for trusting in yourself over what somebody else says to do. The value of what you learn firsthand over the course of a few runs is invaluable, and can't be disputed.

[6 Row Joe]

Wow. Forget about the thermometer and start smelling and tasting with your finger. Every different batch you make will be different. You need to figure out how to run your still and make proper cuts. There's lots of threads here about the subject.

[EricTheRed]

In sorry. Im a realy realy new newbie and I ask stupid questions.

The question is the following:

Say i have a 15 V% alcohol mixture with the Foreshots and Heads still in it. Don't know the amounts but I quess you could consider it a binary mix.

The liquid of a binary mix of 15V% alcohol would boil at about 92C (198F).

Somebody mentioned that you should remove everything that comes over before 80C (176F) but the mix won't boil before 92C (198F). So does something happen at about 75-80C (168-176F)? First drops should come over at that temp somebody mentioned. But again. If you consider the mix as a binary mix, it would boil at 92C (198F).

Dude. What others said. But first drips come over at as low as 60c
It is NOT a binary liquid.
Typically (on my still at 1500m altitude) fores come out at 60 to 78c

[Hügelwilli]

That the first distillate comes before 78°C is because of the air in the vapor at the beginning of the distillation. It is not because of low volatile foreshot compounds.