Crazy idea for a SGC?

[Stilletto]

TL; DR at the bottom.

I'm running this past the group because I'm genuinely unsure.
I'm in the middle of a highly haphazard VM build. I decided on modular and in my craziness have ordered whatever bits and pieces I could off ebay and aliexpress. Living in regional Australia means postage is damn slow, so in my haste I skimmed an ebay post and bought a 115mm (4.5") long piece of 2" copper. D'Oh!
So here's my question.
Could I still use that for a shotgun condenser (7 x 1/2" tubes inside and a few baffles)? I recirc coolant w/ ice.

Is there any reason why the vapour tubes couldn't extend beyond the 2" tube? They should still be cooled somewhat by the water in the jacket. I've even toyed with an inverted glass jar on top to catch and return vapour.

TL; DR: Would a 2" × 4.5" SGC (7× 1/2"x4.5") do anything? Is there any reason why I shouldn't have vapour tubes extending past the water jacket (eg. 1/2" x 6"?)

I've searched but couldn't find anything. If there are threads I missed, please let me know.

[NZChris]

Does regional Australia have a metal scrapyard, or a plumber who drinks in your pub?

[Sporacle]

You are planning to use it as a deflagameter on top of your CM?
It's only my opinion but having the tubes exposed at the top would not achieve to much and....

on a safety note it would be unwise to have obstructions above your RC as the valve could be closed and the jar could potentially create a closed system.

It would help if we had a idea of the parts you have ordered and how much power and what sized boiler you will be running


Edit my auto correct changed VM to CM

[Stilletto]

Thank you for the reply!

I'll be running:

55L boiler (beer keg)
2" column x 18" w/ SS packing
2kw power (initially... probably 4kw eventually)

The idea isn't to have a bottle or jar screwed in. If I can get a light enough jar it should rattle in place without being sealed, or I can fit a pressure release. (I might do that anyway)

[Sporacle]

Just a general question, if the jar is inverted on top of the reflux condensor how is vapor being condensed and secondly how is it being channelled back into the RC tubing?
Also if a jar on top of a piece of copper pipe with no other cooling except for atmosphere was effective as a RC the why even build a deflagameter? Why not just use jars and tubes.
I would design my RC to be able to provide 100% reflux without the addition of anything else
Have you looked at a wound coil condensor and a modular design, search for Kimbodious and have a look at his rig.
Also search Shadylanes posts, he has some excellent build theories

[Yummyrum]

You might want to draw a sketch of what you are talking about .My reading comprehension sucks but I’m imagining too different things that both don’t sound good .

( we don’t expect any more than a drawing on paper and click a pic of it with your phone . )

I agree that a coil is probably going to be more effective than a shotty as an RC .

I think you are better to make a good VM head with an adequate RC and takeoff section with a shorter section of packing , and in the mean while order an extension for the packed section .

If you make a short arse RC you’ll be stuck with a short arse RC section . …… waste of a tall packed section .

Just my 2c

[Stilletto]

Does regional Australia have a metal scrapyard, or a plumber who drinks in your pub?

The scrapyard doesn't have anything over 1". I asked a plumber if he had spare 50mm tube... he said "how much are you after?"
"Anything over 500mm."
Next day he hands me 500mm. And mentions he'd cut it off a 1m length. FFS.

[Stilletto]

You might want to draw a sketch of what you are talking about .My reading comprehension sucks but I’m imagining too different things that both don’t sound good .

( we don’t expect any more than a drawing on paper and click a pic of it with your phone . )

I agree that a coil is probably going to be more effective than a shotty as an RC .

I think you are better to make a good VM head with an adequate RC and takeoff section with a shorter section of packing , and in the mean while order an extension for the packed section .

If you make a short arse RC you’ll be stuck with a short arse RC section . …… waste of a tall packed section .

Just my 2c

Cheers Yummy. I actually meant to accompany my last reply with a pic, but I couldn't work out how to attach it. Here goes...

I'm getting the message that no, a 115mm section is not long enough for a shotty. I'm still trying to understand how to calculate length in a shotty as opposed to a Liebig using the calculator on the parent site. If we were talking about a linear 770mm, that would be heaps, but a parallel 770mm doesn't seem to be enough. That's why I thought some protruding sections would add some length to condense on.

I'm a classic newbie. I'm too impatient and crazy. I've made a coil RC, and never used it... but I'm onto the next thing already. Maybe I'd be better off using that short section for the vapour take-off.

[Steve Broady]

The scrapyard doesn't have anything over 1".

Just a crazy thought. It’s a bit more work, but you could cut that piece of 4” in half and stretch it out for a longer shotgun. Split 1” lengthwise and flatten it out into sheets a little over 3”wide by whatever length you cut. You could then roll those into rings and stack them to fill in the center of your outer shell.

[Stilletto]

The scrapyard doesn't have anything over 1".

Just a crazy thought. It’s a bit more work, but you could cut that piece of 4” in half and stretch it out for a longer shotgun. Split 1” lengthwise and flatten it out into sheets a little over 3”wide by whatever length you cut. You could then roll those into rings and stack them to fill in the center of your outer shell.

That sounds super ugly... I guess I'll have to try it!

[Steve Broady]

Just like a few women I’ve known… if it’s ugly but it gets the job done, then it’s all right. It’s all about what’s inside anyway.

[StillerBoy]

bought a 115mm (4.5") long piece of 2" copper. D'Oh!
So here's my question.
Could I still use that for a shotgun condenser (7 x 1/2" tubes inside and a few baffles)? I recirc coolant w/ ice.

No.. any less than 6" will not work any any water flow system, it's just to short even with extended tube on the output side..

And 3/8" tube are not the most efficient size, whereas the 1/2" gas tube (which is 7/16" inside) using 5 x 6 or 7" in length will work well for both stripping and spiriting.

But setting on recirculating system will require at least a 45 gal setup to be able to work properly for stripping, any thing less will be an ice eating system..

Mars

Pictured is a 7 and a 5 tubes x 6" cooling area x 7" overall in length.. the 5 tubes performs better, meaning using less water flow..

[Saltbush Bill]

If your building a VM, I'll presume it's going to be a VM reflux with packed column.
If that is the case why would you go to the trouble of building a shotgun condenser....or deflegmator.....when you could use a simple coil condenser for reflux.
On top of that a small liebig would do as the product condenser on the same still.
Maybe I'm just reading this all wrong.

[zach]

Thank you for the reply!

I'll be running:

55L boiler (beer keg)
2" column x 18" w/ SS packing
2kw power (initially... probably 4kw eventually)

The idea isn't to have a bottle or jar screwed in. If I can get a light enough jar it should rattle in place without being sealed, or I can fit a pressure release. (I might do that anyway)

An alternate idea would to use the 2" to build a LM head like Rad did in this post.

viewtopic.php?t=8439

His condenser section is 7.5" long.




.

[Stilletto]

An alternate idea would to use the 2" to build a LM head like Rad did in this post.

viewtopic.php?t=8439

His condenser section is 7.5" long.




.

I don't mind that little still at all. But I'd have to go 2" with a 1" waist. Will that slow things down too much? Doesn't seem worth having a 55L boiler that takes days and days to complete a spirit run. I've got a 3 year old!

RANT:

A big issue I've run into is the availability of parts. Here in the middle of nowhere (Darwin, Australia - where the first part of Crocodile Dundee was set), I just cannot find stuff. Or there's not enough of it, or it's outrageously expensive. (The minimum 2" tube length I can find is 6m long - that's about 20'!)

There aren't any scrapyards here because there's no industry. Nothing grows here. Nothing is made here. As a result, nothing has to be built here. So there's very little by way of supplies to be had. (To be fair, this is a city that's been literally destroyed 4 times in 150 years - maybe I should just wait for lucky number 5)

The scrapyards don't sell to the public because they're just collecting for the rest of the country. There aren't even any model railway clubs for boiler offcuts. There are a couple of Bunnings stores, but they don't sound like anything compared to what's in the US. They have tubing and reducers, but only 1/2", 3/4" and 1". Anything else is a two-week wait. The nearest city (Alice Springs) is a 16 hour drive, and is actually smaller than Darwin.

And it's too hot to brew beer, which is why I'm turning to distilling.

I want a simple(ish) column that I can use for both pure spirit and flavoured stuff (obviously with some kind of modification in the middle). I was looking at a Boka, but I can't find a needle valve at a price that makes it reasonable, and I've been warned off using a ball valve. I was going to make a CM still, but once again, I got told that it's hard to learn how to run a CM still optimally.

And nobody seems to be having these exact issues on here! I would LOVE for a fellow Darwinite to jump on, call me a dumb c*** and say "Go to this place and see this guy. Take a carton of Black Fish and he'll look after you." But I don't think that's very likely.

END RANT

[Sporacle]

download/file.php?id=63275&mode=view

Have a look at Kimbos set ups, I believe everything can be ordered online.


For copper pipe
These guys on the Gold Coast are awesome, sell by the meter and not to sure about Darwin but they'd be worth a look
https://g.co/kgs/hWftf3

My 2c a CCVM is a simple, cheap and easy to build still that has great modular ability if it's built right

[Stilletto]

We have Samios here! Their website doesn't show pricing because it's all trade and contract. I'll pop in, I think!

I have made this, too...

[Sporacle]

If that fits inside a 2 inch then you are only a few steps away from having a functioning CCVM, just saying.
It's the only proper reflux I have run so I am biased, no valves, no needle valves. Remove the RC and blank the T and hey presto.....pot still
It will run a litre an hour at 95
Just saying...

[Stilletto]

It does. 1.7" x 5" coil. I didn't want to go CCVM, but I guess if I'm having trouble getting parts it's the obvious choice.

[Sporacle]

You can always set the coil and install a valve in the future if you want, just make sure whatever you build is modular

[Stilletto]

Yeah. Sick. Just gotta find that coil now...

[Deplorable]

If that fits inside a 2 inch then you are only a few steps away from having a functioning CCVM, just saying.
It's the only proper reflux I have run so I am biased, no valves, no needle valves. Remove the RC and blank the T and hey presto.....pot still
It will run a litre an hour at 95
Just saying...

+1 for a CCVM. Crazy simple build and will do what you want it to do. High proof neutral, and easy pot still conversion. Mins spends most of its life as a pot still and the occasional reflux run to make neutral from the feints that didn't make the final cut for whiskey.
Living in the middle of hell like you do, it seems to be the easiest path to your end game.

[Stilletto]

Living in the middle of hell like you do, it seems to be the easiest path to your end game.

Yeah. I agree. CCVM it is.