Polishing with carbon - ZERO WATER

[RockinRockies]

I distilled a ton of feints I made and received, that were all already refluxed on 5 plate columns. Everything but the kitchen sink in them.

Held 94% on my column and collected, well... Lots. In fact I may have shut it down too early but easily kept 1/3 available alcohol by my calculations. I was surprised, pleasantly. It is a drop that needed refining, but not really that much, so I figured I'd pick up the zero water filter to test filtering for cheap. The results shocked me.

This has only been airing 3 days or so and just one run filtered polished the funk that bled through the entire run. Not nasty, but the similar edgy tails funk that isn't quite astringent, but also not perfectly pleasant. I notice this in my home distilled flavor that cleaner white spirits lack. It's likely my continued silliness of getting to greedy on the back end.

Well, I can't believe how incredible a difference filtering makes! 3 to 4 filtrations and it's such a subtle nose and near flavorless, soft profile on the taste. So ridiculously smooth dare I say it competes with great vodkas. Almost too smooth. The nose, because it's a feintkenshine, is in the arena of gin and rye, with a decent anise profile, but I know there was no gin in the low wines. So it's not vodka, because of legal definitions and the nose, but the taste definitely is. Indistinguishable.

Anyway, I wanted to share my excitement because I'm very sensitive to the headsy lower alcohols and the grungy tails, so much so that I'm having difficulty forcing myself to go wider for my bulk aging. I think this, combined with sodium carbonate for low wines can pull every last drop off of what some may consider a waste product.

I'm very, very impressed. I'll be interested to see if things change in 6 weeks. But, as this has been something that comprises many opinions, I thought I'd share my most recent endeavor.

Additionally, I'm very excited to do this with only all grain wheat vodka that I'll be making this year

[acfixer69]

Are you suggesting that we filter through a cheap plastic filter.

[RockinRockies]

No, it was a test to determine whether I wanted to invest in carbon filtering heavily recycled feints. It was done at 90 proof, and I've read as much as I could on here about polymers and such under 100 proof. People have mentioned using Brita and considering they sell whiskey at 92 proof in plastic airline bottles, I'm not concerned. Plus, I couldn't find mention of this particular manufacturer and results in the HD search forum, so I wanted to input my results.

I'm not suggesting that this setup is anything other than impressive enough to merit carbon filtering to polish heavily recycled refluxed feints, which I've read members saying it's not worth it. I didn't expect that much of a difference from using activated carbon. My buddy just ordered coconut activated media and I'm going to head to my LHBS to pick up activated carbon and we're building a filtering setup. We'll be using stainless steel for the device.

I would never do this to my rum or whiskeys, but I like it for this particular use.

[RockinRockies]

Are you suggesting that we filter through a cheap plastic filter.

I want to reiterate. NO. I started to read further and even though it doesn't concern me for this test, I misunderstood the plastic in liquor bottles vs the (unknown) cheap plastics in the filter.


So maybe I should have worded the initial post better to focus on how my expectations were exceeded? I bought stainless steel everything and store in glass. My apologies for any confusion

[greggn]

I distilled a ton of feints I made and received, that were all already refluxed on 5 plate columns.

I have to wonder what was really salvageable from feints that had already been refluxed. Just remember that carbon filtering removes the flavor and aroma components but doesn't "convert" anything. So, if your feints are comprised of lots of ethyl-acetate and propanol then, after carbon filtering, you're still drinking ethyl-acetate and propanol ... it's just that they no longer smell and taste like ethyl-acetate and propanol.

[RockinRockies]

I distilled a ton of feints I made and received, that were all already refluxed on 5 plate columns.

I have to wonder what was really salvageable from feints that had already been refluxed. Just remember that carbon filtering removes the flavor and aroma components but doesn't "convert" anything. So, if your feints are comprised of lots of ethyl-acetate and propanol then, after carbon filtering, you're still drinking ethyl-acetate and propanol ... it's just that they no longer smell and taste like ethyl-acetate and propanol.

That's probably the case but I can't pick up any nasty funk and they taste clean and I didn't get a hangover or headache. That's all I can say about my experience

[RockinRockies]

Can this whole thread please just be deleted. I'm embarrassed I ended up in what not to do. I trust mile hi distilling and figured the ez filter was safe, and so I wanted to do a test batch to see if it's worth carbon filtering.

I read more and honestly, I'd rather this just be deleted if possible.
My bad

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

Well, think about this. What says you to leaving it for the next guy to learn? If it disappears, then he is not spared possibly the same path.

Listen, there is nothing more redeeming than someone who says "I read more, and I change my mind". The world could use more of that. This forum is meant for education, it wasn't just a smack against mistakes. The only way it feels like that are to those who never read more and learned.

[Kareltje]

I distilled a ton of feints I made and received, that were all already refluxed on 5 plate columns.

I have to wonder what was really salvageable from feints that had already been refluxed. Just remember that carbon filtering removes the flavor and aroma components but doesn't "convert" anything. So, if your feints are comprised of lots of ethyl-acetate and propanol then, after carbon filtering, you're still drinking ethyl-acetate and propanol ... it's just that they no longer smell and taste like ethyl-acetate and propanol.

Are you saying that carbon does not remove ethyl-acetate and propanol?
And on top of that: that if ethyl-acetate and propanol are present, they do not smell or taste anymore like themselves?

That would mean, that the carbon has converted them, does it not?? From foul smelling and tasting to not smelling and tasting.

[greggn]

That would mean, that the carbon has converted them, does it not?? From foul smelling and tasting to not smelling and tasting.

Yeah, I can agree with that definition.

[Dancing4dan]

That would mean, that the carbon has converted them, does it not?? From foul smelling and tasting to not smelling and tasting.

Yeah, I can agree with that definition.

I am interested in how charcoal can “convert” anything and what it converts to.

My chemistry is pretty rudimentary but am very familiar with treating overdose patients with activated charcoal and how that works. Activated charcoal works through adsorption. Being one of the most common elements in the universe it has the ability to chemically bind to many substances. In the GI tract this adsorption process chemically binds charcoal to the substance (ie Tylenol). Once the substance’s chemical binding sites are bound with charcoal they are no longer able to be absorbed through the gut wall and are eliminated in stool.

In a charcoal filter the charcoal chemically binds with many substances and they are removed from the filtrate. The filter media, in this case charcoal, will get saturated and need to be replaced. They can not be rinsed clean.

[Dancing4dan]

Can this whole thread please just be deleted. I'm embarrassed I ended up in what not to do. I trust mile hi distilling and figured the ez filter was safe, and so I wanted to do a test batch to see if it's worth carbon filtering.

I read more and honestly, I'd rather this just be deleted if possible.
My bad

Hey RiR. What you did was a good “test”. You have addressed the plastic issue in your plan moving forward.

There is a place for charcoal filtering in certain circumstances. One of those being exactly what you were doing. You just need to build your non plastic filter system.

I end up getting left over booze of many different types. It gets saved up until I have enough to do a spirit run. Kind of a salvage run. Up until recently this was done in a pot still. And Have used old beer, cider, wines, whisky, etc, etc.

Getting close to doing a salvage run through my LM/VM reflux column still. My goal will be a near neutral spirit.

Saving otherwise unusable ethanol through carbon filtration and making a decent end product makes a lot of sense.

[Kareltje]

That would mean, that the carbon has converted them, does it not?? From foul smelling and tasting to not smelling and tasting.

Yeah, I can agree with that definition.

I am interested in how charcoal can “convert” anything and what it converts to.

My chemistry is pretty rudimentary but am very familiar with treating overdose patients with activated charcoal and how that works. Activated charcoal works through adsorption. Being one of the most common elements in the universe it has the ability to chemically bind to many substances. In the GI tract this adsorption process chemically binds charcoal to the substance (ie Tylenol). Once the substance’s chemical binding sites are bound with charcoal they are no longer able to be absorbed through the gut wall and are eliminated in stool.

In a charcoal filter the charcoal chemically binds with many substances and they are removed from the filtrate. The filter media, in this case charcoal, will get saturated and need to be replaced. They can not be rinsed clean.

I do not think carbon can convert substances, I believe it just binds substances as you describe.
And ethyl-acetate will smell and taste like ethyl-acetate.
So if, after the treatment with carbon, the liquid does not smell or taste like ethyl-actetate, my logical conclusion would be, that this stuff is removed by the carbon and is not present anymore in the liquid. (If it does not look like a duck, does not quack, swim, dive etc. like a duck, it probably is not a duck.)

[RockinRockies]

Thanks everybody
It's a bit daunting on here at times because putting a mistake in print brings elder member berating.

It's just embarrassing because I consider myself a voracious reader, and I think what happened was analysis paralysis, where I was not just reading on here, but looking at other things that other people were doing all over the internet. Even though I've been making spirits for 5 years this is the first time I attempted to pass something through at 100 proof and I honestly didn't think it was a problem because of the EZ filter through Mile high. I've bought a bunch of equipment from them, in person, and trust them. They are awesome and they have high quality stuff.. Anyway... Lesson learned.

This is what we built. Turned the column upside-down.

EE0281A7-861C-4C0B-A595-1AFF8B2A19B6.jpeg (41.75 KiB) Viewed 5835 times

It needs 3 passes as the charcoal is only in the copper section.

The other thing is that I'm not a vodka guy and while I'm impressed considering what this was created from, we did blind taste tests with svedka, and sadly, we chose svedka every time after one pass. I didn't have time to finish the second and third pass, so I'll find out tomorrow when my buddy brings them rest back over for the Superbowl.

Regardless. I still think it's delicious, clean, and more than sufficient to sip and mix. Overall, it's a win and charcoal filtering is amazing in my opinion.

EDIT: Pardon the sideways photo. Couldn't figure it out.
Turned the column upside-down

[RockinRockies]

Also, we collected in glass carboys. That setup with the bucket was during charcoal cleaning with the water.
In case anyone wondered

[RockinRockies]

Update: I need to figure what other filtration mediums they are using because the zero filter polishes with a nice, crisp, almost citrus profile that is way more neutral and presents like a real vodka.
The triple carbon setup we made still has enough flavor and sweetness to make it clear it's not vodka.

Does anyone have any ideas for better polishing with another medium than just activated charcoal? I assume I can put the layers in our custom build. We have 15 gallons of feints at 144 that's ready to be run again

[bcook608]

After doing some looking around, it looks like they use a mix of activated carbon and Deionizing resin media similar to what is used to filter cooling water for nuclear power plants.

[bcook608]

Not sure how that is going to interact long term with high proof alcohol exposure.

[Bradster68]

That would mean, that the carbon has converted them, does it not?? From foul smelling and tasting to not smelling and tasting.

Yeah, I can agree with that definition.

I am interested in how charcoal can “convert” anything and what it converts to.

My chemistry is pretty rudimentary but am very familiar with treating overdose patients with activated charcoal and how that works. Activated charcoal works through adsorption. Being one of the most common elements in the universe it has the ability to chemically bind to many substances. In the GI tract this adsorption process chemically binds charcoal to the substance (ie Tylenol). Once the substance’s chemical binding sites are bound with charcoal they are no longer able to be absorbed through the gut wall and are eliminated in stool.

In a charcoal filter the charcoal chemically binds with many substances and they are removed from the filtrate. The filter media, in this case charcoal, will get saturated and need to be replaced. They can not be rinsed clean.

Very interesting.

[Bradster68]

Thanks everybody
It's a bit daunting on here at times because putting a mistake in print brings elder member berating.

It's just embarrassing because I consider myself a voracious reader, and I think what happened was analysis paralysis, where I was not just reading on here, but looking at other things that other people were doing all over the internet. Even though I've been making spirits for 5 years this is the first time I attempted to pass something through at 100 proof and I honestly didn't think it was a problem because of the EZ filter through Mile high. I've bought a bunch of equipment from them, in person, and trust them. They are awesome and they have high quality stuff.. Anyway... Lesson learned.

This is what we built. Turned the column upside-down.EE0281A7-861C-4C0B-A595-1AFF8B2A19B6.jpeg
It needs 3 passes as the charcoal is only in the copper section.

The other thing is that I'm not a vodka guy and while I'm impressed considering what this was created from, we did blind taste tests with svedka, and sadly, we chose svedka every time after one pass. I didn't have time to finish the second and third pass, so I'll find out tomorrow when my buddy brings them rest back over for the Superbowl.

Regardless. I still think it's delicious, clean, and more than sufficient to sip and mix. Overall, it's a win and charcoal filtering is amazing in my opinion.

EDIT: Pardon the sideways photo. Couldn't figure it out.
Turned the column upside-down

We've actually been discussing charcoal filtering alot lately. I'm going to try it for sure on my vodka.just 2c the difference.
I also got a ton of feints from lots of stuff. This is how I'll be doing mine

[RockinRockies]

Not sure how that is going to interact long term with high proof alcohol exposure.

Bummer, because I prefer the difference with that compared to just regular activated charcoal. I'll have to start researching safe alternatives

[Ben]

Make your own activated charcoal in chunks (google it), try citric acid as your activator. Drop a chunk or two in a mason jar, add spirit, add time. See where that gets you.

[Chevystairs]

Can this whole thread please just be deleted. I'm embarrassed I ended up in what not to do. I trust mile hi distilling and figured the ez filter was safe, and so I wanted to do a test batch to see if it's worth carbon filtering.

I read more and honestly, I'd rather this just be deleted if possible.
My bad

hey man I know what you mean. on here ppl sometimes are focused on the thing you are not asking about, it gets annoying quickly. but there is good info on here even if you have to wade through lots of info about things you're not asking about.