Shady's Sugar Shine

[BrewinBrian44]

Good advice again. I always rinsed them off before using them in the past.

As far as placement of the bag, I have a handle on the outside of the large kettle I can just tie a piece of string to before putting the lid on. Only downside is the shells will be all the way to one side. Not sure how critical the placement is.

[Deplorable]

Good advice again. I always rinsed them off before using them in the past.

As far as placement of the bag, I have a handle on the outside of the large kettle I can just tie a piece of string to before putting the lid on. Only downside is the shells will be all the way to one side. Not sure how critical the placement is.

It's not that critical. That how I used to hang mine when I used sugar. My washes were fine.

[shadylane]

I sometimes use the bag of grit to stir up what's settled on the bottom of the fermenter.
Raise the bag a couple inches off the bottom, then let it drop and hit the bottom to stir shit up.
Pick the bag up, let it drop, move to another spot and repeat.

I figure it works best @ the 18 - 24 hour point to get any sugar back into suspension.
And to get the bag into more contact with the wash for pH controle.

[BrewinBrian44]

Well, I ran my spirit run yesterday with a little recycled feints and a couple quarts of old UJSSM from when I started the hobby. Got a pretty decent yield of 1.5 gals at 95%ABV after cuts. Pretty pumped. Everything is very clean and crisp.

Now I need to make some Gin, apple pie and panty dropper!

[Wildcats]

Well, I ran my spirit run yesterday with a little recycled feints and a couple quarts of old UJSSM from when I started the hobby. Got a pretty decent yield of 1.5 gals at 95%ABV after cuts. Pretty pumped. Everything is very clean and crisp.

Now I need to make some Gin, apple pie and panty dropper!

Sounds like a good run. Thanks for sharing.

[shadylane]

Now I need to make some Gin, apple pie and panty dropper!

Set aside a pint or two.
Ya might want it for future comparisons.

[Jabman]

pH control can be a problem with a sugar wash
A cup or two of crushed oyster shell/coral that's normally used as chicken feed helps for pH control.

Any one tried dolomite? Does it work? I can see here only 25kg bags of calcium carbonate. Yes, it's not expensive, but the size is problem. Dolomite I can buy much smaller bag here.

Dolomite seems to be almost same, but with 40% magnesium with it. And it should do same, raise pH.

The difference between the two is that limestone is composed mainly of the mineral calcite (made up of a combination of calcium, carbon, and oxygen) and dolomite is composed mainly of a mineral that is also called dolomite, which is like calcite with magnesium added.

[shadylane]

I haven't tried dolomite yet, but it sounds like it might work.

[NZChris]

If it does work, it's probably just as much trouble to get right as is powdered CC.

[Jabman]

If it does work, it's probably just as much trouble to get right as is powdered CC.

This is crushed what I found, so it's basically same as crushed shells. Only difference is that it has magnesium too.

[NZChris]

If you search the forum for it, you will get several threads to read.

[Jabman]

If you search the forum for it, you will get several threads to read.

Did you read any of those search results? I did yesterday. It not give much info. And this thread no one ever tested dolomite.

I bought bag today and test it soon. Only think worries me is the magnesium. Is it too much for yeast or not, but soon find out. If it not work, then have to take hat in my hand and buy that big 25kg bag of pure calcium carbonate (crushed, not powder).

[Saltbush Bill]

Yeast need magnesium for healthy cell growth.
Having said that I'm not sure how much is too much.

[Jabman]

Little test run, 24 liter patch (total volume with all ingredients)

100g baker yeast (mixed with hot water around 100C)
300g dolomite (in small rock format) (100C water added)
4kg sugar
1/4 tsbp epsom salt
1 tsbp DAP
50g baker yeast, hydrated in 2dl water around 30C 15 minutes
b12 vitamin tablet
b vitamin tablet (complex) (I dont like smell of this)

SG 1.062 (I take this as measure point and add water or sugar rather than trying to calculate all water etc. exactly.)
Fermentation temperature around 28C

tried to keep all around 28C when tossing yeast in, (exept cooked of course dolomite and nutrient yeast) dolomite on bottom of fermenter, maybe should use some sock or similar and leave it to hanging. Maybe next time.

I have pH meter, but it's not calibrated, so didn't take any measurement. I will calibrate it if this crash and take measurements. Calibration is such a pain in ..... to do.

If this ferments ok, I will do 2 more patches and strip it and then do spirit run.

[NZChris]

If you are worried about too much magnesium, why did you use Epsom Salts?

[Jabman]

If you are worried about too much magnesium, why did you use Epsom Salts?

Because the recipe says so and it's possible that it wont dissolve from dolomite at all, who knows? Do you know for sure?. Only after fermentation I see if there any weight loss on those tiny rocks.

[shadylane]

Based on what little I've read.
Yeast needs a little bit of magnesium and it takes a lot to be too much.

"Yeast cells actively take up magnesium via high affinity,
specific transport system, having minimum requirement for
magnesium of 42.5 ppm (1.7 mM) with inhibition of growth
occurring above 25000 ppm"

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf ... .tb00958.x

[Jabman]

Based on what little I've read.
Yeast needs a little bit of magnesium and it takes a lot to be too much.

Yeah, just finished reading this:

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf ... .tb00958.x

And I'm not very much worried anymore. Even though I'm not a chemist. And I didn't understand even half of it.

EDIT: Lol, just checked your link, I googled that document and took some time to read it.

[shadylane]

Yeast is bull frog tough.
It aways amazes me how often folks manage to stall a sugar wash.

[Jabman]

Little test run, 24 liter patch (total volume with all ingredients)

100g baker yeast (mixed with hot water around 100C)
300g dolomite (in small rock format) (100C water added)
4kg sugar
1/4 tsbp epsom salt
1 tsbp DAP
50g baker yeast, hydrated in 2dl water around 30C 15 minutes
b12 vitamin tablet
b vitamin tablet (complex) (I dont like smell of this)

SG 1.062 (I take this as measure point and add water or sugar rather than trying to calculate all water etc. exactly.)
Fermentation temperature around 28C

Measured around 1.030 today, 3 days in fermenter. Still bubbling, but looks like it takes 1 week to finish, if not crashed before that. Gave it little stirr and smell was quite neutral. I don't know if it has very little smell of rotten eggs or smell coming from vitamins, cannot say sure. Covid messed my nose somehow. Had it 3 times past 2 years. Wife complain smell on bathroom. Room temperature 28C.

Maybe next patch heating belt and now also consider to calibrate my pH meter too. But then, smell was not bad so maybe just wait what it is after big D. Very little foam in vessel. Could fill it more, next one few liter more for sure.

One question comes in mind this week. I'm little bit short on and have to buy shop booze. How about running this with lesser sugar and getting it faster? Or does it even get better result not to try to hit upper level of ABV.

[shadylane]

One question comes in mind this week. I'm little bit short on and have to buy shop booze. How about running this with lesser sugar and getting it faster? Or does it even get better result not to try to hit upper level of ABV.

1.060 is the upper limit. Using less sugar will make a cleaner, faster fermenting wash.

[Jabman]

1.060 is the upper limit. Using less sugar will make a cleaner, faster fermenting wash.

Ah, okay, then I had misunderstood here. Thought the max was 1.080. Had little bit over that 1.060 (1.062) and just started new one (second fermenter) just 1.055 SG Maybe should go to 1.050 maybe.

Thanks for clarifying.

[shadylane]

Ah, okay, then I had misunderstood here. Thought the max was 1.080. Had little bit over that 1.060 (1.062) and just started new one (second fermenter) just 1.055 SG Maybe should go to 1.050 maybe.

A 1.080 sugar wash would stress the yeast and not finish below 1.000
Long story short, the final gravity is as important as the beginning amount of sugar.
If a sugar wash finishes below 1.000 it's because it was a happy ferment.

1.060 will quickly make 10% alcohol after it's finished.
1.080 will take longer to ferment and after cuts will not make more alcohol.

1.060 - 1.050 is good, less than 1.050 means there's less alcohol made.
A ball park figure is 1.5 pounds of sugar per gallon or slightly less.

The stripping run will be the same, strip until tails start having a film of oil floating on top.
Switch jars and run a while longer to be sure.
The proof of the lowines means nothing, watch for what is happening.

[Yummyrum]

A ball park figure is 1.5 pounds of sugar per gallon or slightly less.

Shady , is that add 1.5 pounds of sugar to 1 gal water , or 1.5 pounds with enough water added to make up 1gal wash ?

[shadylane]

A ball park figure is 1.5 pounds of sugar per gallon or slightly less.

Shady , is that add 1.5 pounds of sugar to 1 gal water , or 1.5 pounds with enough water added to make up 1gal wash ?

First 1/2 gallon water with boiled yeast.
Then sugar, and the water is added to the gallon marks on the side.
18ish gallon total in the fermenter.

[Berserker53]

Great write up... and oops I think I stressed my yeast. My ph is good and temp is good but it has been 2 weeks and still not worked off. Guess it's time to start over....

[Yummyrum]

Great write up... and oops I think I stressed my yeast. My ph is good and temp is good but it has been 2 weeks and still not worked off. Guess it's time to start over....

Don’t give up on it Berserker

Maybe I’m the only one but my Shadyshine takes a couple of weeks to finish and I’ve never had the super fast finish that many get . Be patient .

[Berserker53]

Patience is a virtue that I have to learn lol...

[shadylane]

Great write up... and oops I think I stressed my yeast. My ph is good and temp is good but it has been 2 weeks and still not worked off. Guess it's time to start over....

How long sugar shine takes depends on temp, pH and the control of both.
At 70ish room temp it can be 2 weeks or more.

[Jabman]

Just side note, dolomite didn't work. No loss on weight, like shells has. Ferment was ok after all any way. Sad, that cannot take pH measurements. Ordered some pH strips to future use. Maybe check some day my pH meter too. If I stick on this recipe. Strip run was good, no much bad smell etc.