Mash Transfer with Aquarium Pump Question

[Mr_Beer]

Looking for some answers to use of aquarium type pumps for transferring mash results.

My process is to ferment on-grain in 20 gallon HDPE containers that have 800 micron mesh bags in the vessel. The bag is lifted with a pulley system and allowed to drain. It can be squeezed effectively as it is draining. Almost as good as using a press to squeeze the fermented results.

What is left is liquid, some minor amounts of stuff in suspension and of course the yeast residual at the bottom of the HDPE barrel.

I want to transfer that liquid to intermediate containers for settling for several days and then transfer that result to the boiler for distillation.

I have tried two transfer pumps from MooreBeer – one for about $85 and the other for $190. The first failed almost immediately – the small amounts of sediments in the mash ‘blew out’ the pump diaphragm. The more expensive pump has a pre-filter that is so fine it clogs up within a gallon or so of starting the transfer. My advice is to avoid those pumps for this application.

So the next notion is to use an aquarium pump inserted in the barrel. It would pump out the material – low head of less than 4 foot. Sort of the equivalent of a trash pump used in construction and de-watering activities. There would be no attempt to pump the yeast residue but some will most likely get disturbed and transferred.

Anyone had experience with this approach?
Opinions?
Other ideas?

[greggn]

Other ideas?

When you lift your BIAB, lift the primary fermenter too. Put it high enough to gravity drain into the secondary. Let the wash settle for a day or two in the primary (again) then drain it into the secondary.

[Mr_Beer]

greggn had a non-obvious answer -- avoid the pump altogether and use gravity.

Pull the bag and after it drains let the settling occur in the fermenter. Would need to add a drain spigot to the fermenter but that is certainly no issue. Then after settling for several days let gravity do the work instead of a pump.

The only issue would be carefully lifting the fermenter with sloshing liquid that weighs about 150 pounds so it does not tip about three feet into the air.

Very cleaver -- had not occurred to me. Thanks for the 'out of the box' thinking.


Still would like to here from someone who has pump usage experience.

[Deplorable]

I've been at this for almost 4 years, on the same $10 submersible pond pump, and it's still going strong. It's the same one that came with my original still kit for a recirculating cooling water supply.
I put it in a paint strainer bag and drop it in the finished ferment to the grain bed, to pump off the clear, and when it's done it goes in a bucket of Star-San to run and clean out the hose. Then I use the paint strainer bag and mop bucket to squeeze the grains. Once the 30 gallon barrel is empty of grains, I pump the Star-San into the fermenter to rinse it out before a light scrubbing.
Maybe an aquarium pump is too delicate compared to a pump rated for an outdoor pond?

Mine is similar to this one
https://www.amazon.com/DOMICA-Submersib ... 214&sr=8-5

[Mr_Beer]

Thanks Deplorable -- good to have some reassurance that the idea is not wrong.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0BVM ... =UTF8&th=1
is the pump I ordered -- more lift and more energy than yours so it should work fine.

My research seemed to indicate that aquarium and pond pumps are essentially identical -- lift capacity and power consumption indicate how much they will pump.

My notion of the 800 micron bag was to avoid the squeezing altogether. That part of the process works well -- lift the bag and let drain and squeeze with a wide 'belt' (think old seatbelt) around the bag that is twisted via a rod and in turn applies lots of pressure. Can easily use two belts for large grain bill.

[shadylane]

There's a drain valve in the bottom of the fermenter so it can be drained into a bucket and a 1/4hp submersible pump to transfer the wash into the boiler. This way the liquid can be gently drained off and the trub left in the fermenter. The pump also does a good job of degassing the wash.

[NZChris]

My largest fermenters don't have spigots, so I have them raised enough to be able to syphon the last dregs into a bucket and pump from the bucket to wherever I need it. It is a very gentle syphon when you get close to the bottom and most chunks either don't make it up the hose or settle out in the bucket.
I have had a couple of minor blockages, but I have a spare pump, both cheap 12V units, so I could swap pumps if I needed to.

I'd never thought of using a submersible, I'm sure mine would pass bigger chunks, so I'll try one next time.

[Saltbush Bill]

I use one of these to transfer sugar washes and rum washes from A to B......never had a problem.
It's the same pump that's used to provide water pressure to my still condensers.
https://www.bunnings.com.au/ozito-350w- ... lsrc=aw.ds

[Salt Must Flow]

I do two 40-50 gal sugar washes at a time, each in 55 gal poly drums. For transfer, I've been using a 1340 gph pond pump. It works well and since sugar washes usually don't have any solids, the impeller never clogs.

I've been considering doing something like what Shady posted, but I've been hesitant to cut holes and install bulkhead fittings in my fermenters. I've been thinking about installing a PVC 90 elbow pointing straight up on the inside of the fermenter to help keep the trub from getting sucked up. Maybe the elbow isn't necessary, but it's easy enough to try and remove if it's not a benefit.

[NZChris]

Draining my fermenters that do have spigots, I let the grain bed do the filtering for me. The first cloudy quart gets tipped back into the fermenter.

Because the ferments are always several stripping runs worth and I run a preheater, there is no hurry to empty the fermenter and the time it takes to collect the dregs for the last charge of the preheater isn't a problem.

[Mr_Beer]

Thank to everyone who responded.
Here is what I have determined. It is a long discussion but intended to help others that may have similar issues.

Using the expensive pumps from MooreBeer was a waste of money and time. The vendor stood behind the performance issues so aside from some aggravation with broken and non-functional items I was not out any actual money.

What was not mentioned previously is that my process is taking the on-grain fermented liquid in a 20 gallon HDPE barrel and transfer it to 7 gallon FerMonster type carboys with a pump. The grain is contained in a 800 micron mesh bag and the liquid is squeezed out. The squeezing operation is enabled with a pulley system to lift and hold the bag and two wide belts (3+ inches wide) and a pipe/stick that is twisted repeatedly to squeeze the grain bag. Much easier than prior methods of using a fruit press.

The FerMonster carboys are clear and two will easily hold the result of a 20 gallon mash after fermentation. I can see the result and as settling occurs decide when to transfer to the boiler for the stripping run.

The top of the FerMonster carboys is 4” in diameter. The pump method to transfer the settled liquid had to be able to pump from inside the carboys to the boiler.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0BVM ... =UTF8&th=1
is the pump I ordered -- good lift and more energy and inexpensive.

The pump is small enough to insert inside the FerMonster carboy and it can be raised/lowered in the carboy easily. Works great…
• Transfer from the fermenter involves enclosing the pump in a BIAB covering. Any excessive material (grain bits, etc.) are not transferred.
• Transfer of the settled liquid in the carboy to the boiler requires a careful watch of the pump so it does not suck in the settled trub as it transfers liquid. The clear carboy allows a visual verification of this.

Any questions PM me.