Has Anyone Here Successfully Applied for the TTB DSP Permit?

[texanmason]

I'm interested in pursuing a DSP permit. Does anyone have any success stories now that there is the HDA membership path forward? Does state-level law enforcement get involved?

[Corn Cracker]

From what I understand, it's available but its not for spirits, more of an industrial use for it

[Bolverk]

My understanding, Is that it still needs to be legal locally as well as you need to meet a lot of the professional requirements, HDA did a video on YouTube explaining some of it

[Deplorable]

I looked into the local laws in my state a couple years back, and the zoning restrictions alone were enough to discourage me.

[Copperhead road]

I started going down this rabbit hole in Australia, I did this because I was trying to import a big Still from Kentucky.
(an all Copper old school pot still that had a Copper 120 L boiler.)

Here in Australia, it’s done through the ATO or
“Australian tax office.”
First of all, I got a still permission which only allows me to import and own a still but not use it to make alcohol.
Then I started looking into all the other facets required to getting a license to make alcohol. First thing that come up was zoning…..
I only went that far. It was too much paperwork for a hobby that may turn into something..

[Corn Cracker]

I'm sure if I had the time and money I could dial in and perfect a couple of recipes and go that route but, I think that would make it work and no longer a relaxing hobby. It's a damn shame we can't pursue this hobby without being outlaws

[texanmason]

From what I understand, it's available but its not for spirits, more of an industrial use for it

Based on the recent 5th Circuit Court ruling, if you are a member of the Hobby Distiller's Association, you can apply for a Distilled Spirits Plant permit and receive one. I haven't encountered anyone in my state (Texas) that has done so, though.

My understanding, Is that it still needs to be legal locally as well as you need to meet a lot of the professional requirements, HDA did a video on YouTube explaining some of it

This is part of my hangup --- legal federally for now with the HDA membership, but not legal on the state level. If it's just the feds involved, then hey, great news, folks can distill at home without committing federal-level felonies. If state gets involved... that's a problem.

[Yonder]

… legal federally for now with the HDA membership, but not legal on the state level (and i think you still need a license).

That is the problem. In Texas I believe the law says it is illegal to own any equipment that could be used to distill alcohol (a rough interpretation). Of course that is blatantly stupid. Big liquor and big religion still hold sway. Of course unless you’re a complete dumbass and brag about your hobby or sell your product, law enforcement has more than enough to do without trying to catch a 10 gal a year hobbiest.

[Bolverk]

Yeah, HDA has admitted that this "legalization" is just the first step.. its not perfect. the goal is to have it structured like beer and wine

[Nagorg]

In Texas I believe the law says it is illegal to own any equipment that could be used to distill alcohol

Actually, I think you can legally own a still. It's just a problem if you use it for the distillation of alcohol where it becomes a problem. Kinda silly...

[texanmason]

As far as I can tell, owning the still is a federal offense, not a Texas offense (your mileage may vary in other states). I think in Texas, the problem boils down to the fact that the Texas alcoholic beverage commission makes it an offense to produce distilled spirits commercially without a permit. legally, because we have the ability to produce beer and wine at home, but not distilled spirits, all production of spirits is therefore considered commercial production, regardless of whether you're at home, or in a company facility.

[Nagorg]

It's definitely a confusing bag of mixed laws. Especially when it's easy to buy everything you need from individual components to complete setups, online or in local brick and mortar shops.

On a positive note, these times remind me of how making beer at home was first made legal in 1979 at the federal level (post prohibition). It wasn't legal in all 50 states until 2013 when Mississippi and Alabama finally came around to their senses.

I hope the legalization trends continue to improve. It just makes no sense. This is why I very recently joined the HDA in support of what they have been doing. My membership won't make that much of a difference but I'm hopeful others will jump in! They seem to be pulling the weight!

[Yonder]

Section 103.02 of the Alcoholic Beverage Code prohibits any person from possessing equipment “designed for, capable of use for, or used in manufacturing an illicit beverage,” is the “scary” part. Licenses are still required. Don’t tell! Don’t sell! Don’t give it away!
These laws have neen around way too long but every effort to rid us of them fails. So far. Wasn’t that long ago it was illegal to brew your own beer or make your own wine. Soon, maybe. Soon.

[Corn Cracker]

As far as I can tell, owning the still is a federal offense, not a Texas offense (your mileage may vary in other states). I think in Texas, the problem boils down to the fact that the Texas alcoholic beverage commission makes it an offense to produce distilled spirits commercially without a permit. legally, because we have the ability to produce beer and wine at home, but not distilled spirits, all production of spirits is therefore considered commercial production, regardless of whether you're at home, or in a company facility.

That definitely sounds like an arguable, loophole definition of commercially distilled product

[Copperhead road]

I’m with corn cracker on this one, I think if you were to go commercial you could turn a fantastic hobby that you love into a laborious job.
That’s just my opinion.

[Nagorg]

I’m with corn cracker on this one, I think if you were to go commercial you could turn a fantastic hobby that you love into a laborious job.
That’s just my opinion.

Indeed... And that's the same for brewing beer too! I personally have no interest in anything more than enjoying the hobby.

[higgins]

Decades ago I turned a nice enjoyable hobby (woodworking) into a job (furniture making - replicating antiques). That lasted about 8 years before I moved on (college, computer science degree). It ruined my enjoyment of woodworking, and it was nearly 25 years before I took up the hobby again.

[texanmason]

For additional context, I don't want to make this a commercial venture. I would like to get the DSP permit so that any potential activities that may happen in the future are not federal offenses!

[shadylane]

I haven't a clue about state or local requirements are for a Federal TTB DSP Permit?
I do know someone that's had a federal fuel alcohol permit for many years and never had any questions asked.
Just to be sure, he has personally consumed or burned any evidence of possible rule violations.
On a side note, the safety rules required for fuel alcohol production are a great idea starting point for homedistillation.

[Corn Cracker]

I'm interested in pursuing a DSP permit. Does anyone have any success stories now that there is the HDA membership path forward? Does state-level law enforcement get involved?

Came across this this morning, i reckon its the latest ruling explained, i will look further into this to get the permit, yeah, i will be on a list but, i will also be on a list saying im permitted to distill, at home. If your a member, you can print the membership certificate hes talking about.
I will have to see what my wife thinks but it seems legit enough to not get in legal trouble and if you do, you have hda working with you, not for you but with you to defend your right to do it

[Corn Cracker]

Digging and researching more,
here in Tx. its still illegal on the state level, whether you have a dsp or not. If i stay like i am and if authorities were to come to the door, it would be state officials that dont recognize the permit anyway so, all legal bets are off. Does my county sherriff care if i make whiskey? Probobly not unless i am being a nuisance to the neighbors while making it, selling it or using it to barter with. I think i might hold off on it till Tx recognizes the law

[Nagorg]

Digging and researching more,
here in Tx. its still illegal on the state level, whether you have a dsp or not. If i stay like i am and if authorities were to come to the door, it would be state officials that dont recognize the permit anyway so, all legal bets are off. Does my county sherriff care if i make whiskey? Probobly not unless i am being a nuisance to the neighbors while making it, selling it or using it to barter with. I think i might hold off on it till Tx recognizes the law

This is what I've concluded also. I did join the HDA though. Maybe that puts me on a list too? Who knows. But at least they are an org that's actively pushing for change. And it seems like there's been a lot of recent activity around this too.

Maybe in time this will wind up just like making beer finally did.

[Corn Cracker]

Digging and researching more,
here in Tx. its still illegal on the state level, whether you have a dsp or not. If i stay like i am and if authorities were to come to the door, it would be state officials that dont recognize the permit anyway so, all legal bets are off. Does my county sherriff care if i make whiskey? Probobly not unless i am being a nuisance to the neighbors while making it, selling it or using it to barter with. I think i might hold off on it till Tx recognizes the law

This is what I've concluded also. I did join the HDA though. Maybe that puts me on a list too? Who knows. But at least they are an org that's actively pushing for change. And it seems like there's been a lot of recent activity around this too.

Maybe in time this will wind up just like making beer finally did.

I hope so, with the permit, id have to have my detatched garage as my distillery plant, keep all product locked up,
Keep logs of supplies bought, runs ran and what got bottled with details. Everything aging will be bonded. As i pull spirits from the garage i have keep records of that and that is what i would owe taxes on

[Yonder]

It’s a damned shame but the way things are i don’t forsee a change anytime soon. Government loves taxes, no matter how small and many states have build sizable infrastructure to “combat the heinous crime” of enjoyment.
They will surely fight anything that even seems like loss of position.