sweetfeed whisky

[midwest shinner]

Sounds alrite. you can make cuts and blend or since you're using a pot still combine it all. and proof back to lower than 40% for a spirit run which will yield a slighty less flavorful but cleaner product. your call

[NIGHTOWL]

Sounds alrite. you can make cuts and blend or since you're using a pot still combine it all. and proof back to lower than 40% for a spirit run which will yield a slighty less flavorful but cleaner product. your call

Thanks midwest shinner,
If I combine all of it and cut it back to 40% with water,is that all I put in the still.
I have 2 1/2 gal. now ,then add the water to get to 40% then run it ,how much will I have after this run?
Thanks
NIGHTOWL

[midwest shinner]

Yeah just mix the whole first run together and water back to 40% abv or lower for safety reasons(less fire hazard) and on this next run you will likely end up with about 1.5 gallons or so(maybe a bit more, maybe a bit less) before it drops off below 20% but that also depends on your still. And then you would make your cuts on this second batch and keep the rest as feints to be added to your next run or saved up for an all feints run. Say your 2nd run or spirit run starts out at 80%abv a pretty basic cut range is about 75%-55or 50%. That means you will keep for drinking from 75% to 50%(everyones taste differs and depending on your still you may start out at a higher or lower abv%, this is just an example)and the rest would be feints to be rerun later. It is best to collect your run in smaller jars, maybe pint or half pint size and cover them with a coffee filter or paper towel for 24-48 hours to air out after running. This will help some of the higher alcohols work off and make your cuts easier to discern. There are a few great threads on cuts around and I do recommend some further reading as your cuts are one of the biggest factors as to how you likker will turn out. Check this thread outhttp://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 15&t=11640 The two run method for pot stills is a very common practice so there is a lot of info around about it. I hope this helps, good luck and have fun with it

[AlaskaHooch]

Greetings from Alaska,
Say I have been thinking when I start my sweetfeed of scraping out some of my corn from my ujsm then after it cools just tossing it into the pot with some backset. Any speed bumps I need to watch out for besides my ph? I am on my 5th run of ujsm and plan on doing 5 more before I try this move.


Thanks in advance
AlaskaHooch

[Prairiepiss]

Greetings from Alaska,
Say I have been thinking when I start my sweetfeed of scraping out some of my corn from my ujsm then after it cools just tossing it into the pot with some backset. Any speed bumps I need to watch out for besides my ph? I am on my 5th run of ujsm and plan on doing 5 more before I try this move.


Thanks in advance
AlaskaHooch

Are you asking if you can replace the corn in your UJSSM ferment with sweetfeed. And keep going? If so I don't see why you couldn't? Only difference between sweetfeed and UJSSM is the sweetfeed has molasses in it. So if you don't replace any molasses in the proceeding generations. It will lose some of the sweetfeed qualities derived from the molasses.

[AlaskaHooch]

Thanks Piss,
I have 2 bags of cob and some molasses. I was just going to add the cob (After it cools from the cooking first), molasses and sugar to my fermenter with my backset (2 gallons or so) from my last run of ujsm then if my ph is ok let it ferment. Then keep the sour going for a few runs like I did with the ujsm.

AlaskaHooch

[F6Hawk]

AH, UJSSM and SF are typically done without cooking the grains. Unless you are adding enzymes, there is little benefit to be had from cooking the grains. 99.9% of the ethanol will come from the sugar, the grains are just there to impart flavor. Not saying you can't cook them, just saying it will add little to your wash except propane burned.

[Jimbo]

well,.... its really not that much work to toss it in some 200 degree water, then add a few pounds of malted barley when the temp hits 150.... and skip the sugar. then you can really call it whiskey. just saying.

[F6Hawk]

200° water tossed into some corn? IDK, Jimbo... I boiled mine at 200° for over 3 hours, then added the 'zymes at the right temps, and all I have right now is a bucket of thick, foul-smelling cream corn. But I guess I'll strain it, boil it so anything lacto doesn't come over, and see what I get outta it. It was a lot of work, here's hoping it was worth it...

[Jimbo]

sounds like you did it up right. it should smell delicious like sweet corn muffins tho, not foul smelling. Thats how I do my bourbons, steep cook the corn in 205 degree water for 3 hours, wrapped up in a blanket to hold the heat. Its gets thick as it gelatinizes, but smells amazing.

[F6Hawk]

How long do you let it ferment?

[Jimbo]

I ferment most things for a week. Occasionally they take a little longer if its cold in the basement. What did you use for yeast F6?

[Stainless dude]

I have not atempted all grain as of yet. As yummy as uj and sf are, an all grain wash must taste just awsome. Sounds like a awlful lot of work though...I'm guessing it must be worth it.

[Jimbo]

Not much work at all stainless. I suggest starting with a single malt, no grain cooking. Basically bring a gallon of water for every 2 lbs of grain to 170 degrees. stir it all together and it will settle in teh high 140's. wrap it up and let is mash for a couple hours. drop temp and pitch yeast, right on the grain. done. its that easy.

Even for bourbons, with corn to cook. I dont cook the corn over fire, too much stirring. Bring water to 205 and then steep cook the corn for 3 hours. Gelatinizes just fine. Then drop to 150 and stir in malt.

Detailed recipe's for both in my signature, but the crux of it is just that simple as above.

Give it a go.

[Stainless dude]

That does sound fairly simple jimbo, I think I will give that a try this fall.

[AlaskaHooch]

...I'm guessing it must be worth it.

You bet your ass its worth it. Just on my 5th run and I am in love. I plan to run ujsm for a few more runs then blend in sweetfeed and keep going like nothing has happened. So far I have 2 gallons of hearts (I kept putting everything back in and rerunning everything until I got to my 4th run) and I have corn flavor and no complaints. *tips hat to UJ*

AlaskaHooch

[Truckinbutch]

I been turnin out product with 1 1/2 runs on 30 gallon batches of SF with great results . The lengthening ferment times from diminishing ph levels is a constant battle . Racked off a gen #3 batch yesterday that I plan to start running Saturday . Got a gen #4 that will be ready to rack by then and run next .
I've been considering adjusting ph in 10 gal of backset before I recharge each barrel instead of adjusting the entire recharge . Any thoughts on this ? I'm using pickling lime to adjust with .

[AlaskaHooch]

sorry fellers I forgot what thread I was posting in.

AlaskaHooch

[fatboy_85]

I'm doing my first attempt. Got some sweet feed, wondering if some of these ingredients are ok or if I got the wrong stuff....
It's called plantation 10 all grain textured feed.
First starts with - oats, cracked corn, cane molasses, dehulled soybean meal / then goes to my worries.... Calcium carbonate, phosphoric acid, propionic acid, magnese sulfate, copper proteinate, vitamins and folic acid, niacin, choline chloride, pyridoxine hydrochloride... Are these ok?

[seaguy]

Seaguy, congrats on the your first sweetfeed whisky! The ferment will only slow with successive batches if you are adding backset, it is the super low pH of the backset that causes the ferment to slow. It changes the flavor of your likker a whole lot, the first generation will be sweet, the backset makes your likker a bit sour and more complex for sure. I've heard of some people taking it as far as 10-15 generations, I haven't myself so I don't know how the likker would turn out that many generations deep but I'm sure it's interesting at the very least. By the way over time your ferment will slow(like was mentioned earlier) so every 3rd or 4th gen. you can leave out the backset for a gen and just use water.

I was surprised to find ,on the third Gen, that after fores I had very little heads before I was in hearts. I had added maybe a liter of faints to the wash. The boiler (Bud Keg) was halfway up the curved top so pretty full. Hearts from that practically full boiler was 1.5 ltr ....Since I use my backset for the next gen I don't run tails very long. I think that for the good flavor and the excellent savings on grain/nutrient the ferment wait is well worth it for what you wind up with. Wish that SF came in smaller bags since I have to keep it refrigerated.

[midwest shinner]

Seaguy are you saying that from a nearly full 15.5 gal keg boiler you only got 1.5 liters of hearts? That seems low, especially considering that with a whiskey you want some of the late heads and early tails as that's where a lot of your flavor will come from. If you're making a neutral you only want the cleanest(hearts) and that's also one of the reasons neutrals don't need aging. But the more heads and tails included the more aging required to make a smooth flavorful product. Different types of liquor require different cuts. Fruit based brandies and such much of the fruit flavor comes over with the heads, so you would cut deeper into the heads to keep more fruit flavor, but require a bit more aging because of that. As long as you're saving feints none of it is wasted as it will be rerun later, but I'm just trying to help you get the most quantity of flavorful product that you can without compromising the the whole batch. I would do some more research on cuts for different types of liquor though if it was me in your shoes, i wouldn't just take one sources word for it. Be safe and have fun. Happy stillin

[Truckinbutch]

(Headscratch ?) I just pulled 13 quarts from a 12.5 gallon strip run after discarding a full quart to be safer on fores . Granted , I am going to run this again tomorrow in a 1 1/2 run , but I could have picked out quite a bit more than 1.5 liters of drinkable white from it . 3rd gen sweet feed 30 gallon batch . Started at 70% and tapered to 20% with some interesting flavors in the tails without airing . ? ; have I missed something here ?

[midwest shinner]

That's what i was getting at too TB. 1.5 liters from an almost full 15.5 gal keg boiler is WAY too little

[F6Hawk]

Ditto the low volume. I normally get 1~2 L out of 5 gals. Unless he's talking a pony keg or something...

[Prairiepiss]

First off. That is to much charge. It could lead to foaming and pukeing. For a 15 gal keg I would stay under 12 gal. 1/2 to 3/4 full is where you want to be. Depending on what you are running. But a sweetfeed should be ok around the 12 gal mark. That would give you 3.5 gal of headroom. And is just over the 3/4 full mark. I like to stay in the 10 to 11 gal range for sugarheads.

I normally get a gallon of good stuff from a 10 ish gal run. Roughly. But I also only ferment to 8% ABV.

[seaguy]

I have plenty of tails saved up but it all has such an overpowering "wet rubber" flavoring in it I have only used very little as feints for a new run. Maybe I am just too picky with the results I like best. BTW I am not potstilling. I have about a 3' section of CU mesh (rolled up gutter screens) in a
4' column. The other foot is slant-plates and condensor section. I get the best SF results by running at a beaded chain discharge. I have never tried to run it with all the mesh removed in what is loosely termed pot still mode. I haven't so far because of the smearing that many Boka owners mention. I am running a 5.5kw sand element, therefore the condensor can easily be overcome. I drag out the initial heatup so I don't scorch the wash. Usually takes an hour to reach equilibrium. When I am getting close I start cutting back the heat and hold it when the product is about midway up the condensor. I use a vinyl tube to bubbler jar on the vent incase it overuns the coil that way I can reduce the heat a little and it will pull back into the condensor. Since everything above the keg (15.5 gal type) is CU I might try running it with no mesh next time. 4th generation is in the buckets with backset (1gal added to each ). I stirred in 1/8 cup baking soda per 4.5gal wash in each bucket to raise the ph. SG was set to 1.08 since there is low wines already in the backset and trube.

[Rastus]

sir,
the recommended back wash amount is approx. 25% but no more than 50%.
primarily to avoid ph problems as i understand it.
too much over several generations could potentially stress out your yeast and create a funk in the flavors.

i am also running a 3" boka like yourself and get the same results in quantity as the others. i also do the same as TB and run a stripping run through my potstill and save it for a reflux run mixed into the next wash, i felt it made better flavor and also boosted my ABV on the spirit run by 3-4%.
my next run will have 2 strip runs added to a regular wash, and should be killer as it is going to be gen 7 for me.

the other thing to think about with your bok is you can watch the temp as you go along and if the temp rises above 180f after 1.5 liters of hearts set it back into reflux for a bit and see if the temp drops back again if so take off more slowly and see if it holds steady for a while longer... i made that mistake in the beginning of pulling off product too fast, i was in a big hurry to get some drink stored up and ended up wasting a lot of good drink the first few runs, but then when i slowed it down and let my Bok find its groove, i realized the temp didnt rise the flavors didnt smear and get funky, and i got a lot more quality product before the temp went up rapidly.

I found when i would see the head temp rise a little i had to slow down my take off allowing more reflux just a bit as i went along, until all of a sudden the flavor changed and the temp would climb rapidly past 190 (below the top plate) thats when i quit.

hope it helps that may only be one piece of your puzzle

good luck and keep your stick on the ground

Rastus

[Prairiepiss]

I suspect you either have a vapor leak? Or are stopping to early.

[jollyroger]

Just started my 3rd gen SF yesterday. It is getting progressively more flavorful and complex. I started 10 gallons. It is my biggest to date. After an hour or so, it is bubbling nicely. Can't wait to run this one off. On a side note, I just started using rye flour for my flour paste. Totally superior to wheat flour for sealing, but it is such a PITA to remove. Couldn't get rye until recently, so I had to make do with wifey's biscuit flour.

[Stillatryin]

I've run no fewer than 7 runs of SF. There have been a few hickups with ferments.... I got some high class advice on what went "somewhat" wrong and think I corrected. I just started a new ferment with some 2 week old trub.. I removed one gallon of trub and added one gallon of fresh SF. My fermenter now contains the grain, a 12oz bottle of molassas, two cans of peach nectar, 16 lb of sugar, 46 grams of distillers yeast and some eye of newt.
My shop is averaging 88 degrees F.. so I think she'll be ready to run in 5 or so days. My friends say this is some of the best likker they've had and I concur. THis time, I'm not avertising to the buds that I'm making a run, so I should be keeping at least a gallon of good hooch on this one. BTW, I've added backset and got some added flavor, but it's OK just as it is... I take the first quart of the run and water my ant beds with it and keep it all till it gets < 25% Cheers!!!