Need A Rum Experts Advice

[Rain Distillate]

You guys have been extremely informative.

I left them in a baggy in the old ladies car over night and she already left for work (hope they don't stink up the nissian) when she gets home or sometime Monday I'll clean them up and start my second go at rum, this time using dunder, molasses and the right yeast. Should be a better final product.

[nerdybrewer]

You guys have been extremely informative.

I left them in a baggy in the old ladies car over night and she already left for work (hope they don't stink up the nissian) when she gets home or sometime Monday I'll clean them up and start my second go at rum, this time using dunder, molasses and the right yeast. Should be a better final product.

Have you any way to measure PH?
My biggest problem has been keeping the PH in the good range.
It can easily hit 2.9 - 3.3 and the yeasties get unhappy.
Dunder is acidic, so I wouldn't recommend adding anything else acidic.
If you can't measure it then just monitor the sourness, of course after it's fermented a couple days, it should be sweet at first then as the sugars are consumed by yeast it will head towards sour.

[Rain Distillate]

You guys have been extremely informative.

I left them in a baggy in the old ladies car over night and she already left for work (hope they don't stink up the nissian) when she gets home or sometime Monday I'll clean them up and start my second go at rum, this time using dunder, molasses and the right yeast. Should be a better final product.

Have you any way to measure PH?
My biggest problem has been keeping the PH in the good range.
It can easily hit 2.9 - 3.3 and the yeasties get unhappy.
Dunder is acidic, so I wouldn't recommend adding anything else acidic.
If you can't measure it then just monitor the sourness, of course after it's fermented a couple days, it should be sweet at first then as the sugars are consumed by yeast it will head towards sour.

My buddy has a nice pH tester. I know he'll let me borrow come mash day. I'll check it with that. Had something come up today so looks like still'n and mashing my rum in will have to wait a couple more days.

[NZChris]

You guys have been extremely informative.

I left them in a baggy in the old ladies car over night and she already left for work (hope they don't stink up the nissian) when she gets home or sometime Monday I'll clean them up and start my second go at rum, this time using dunder, molasses and the right yeast. Should be a better final product.

Unless you want to eat them, clean shells off the beach are less trouble.

I use pH strips from a HBS shop. They're not super accurate, but they don't need to be.

[Yummyrum]

My biggest problem has been keeping the PH in the good range.
It can easily hit 2.9 - 3.3 and the yeasties get unhappy.

Nerdy I've only ever experienced that with sugar washes .

My all molasses washes always start around pH 5.5 and end at 5.0 ....every time ...I have never needed to add shells or other alkaline to raise it .
Yes Molasses and Dunder are acidic but they are a huge pH buffer (they literally "clamp" the pH)....to deliberately change the pH of an all molasses wash takes considerable effort.

I did some experiments with Clarifying Rum washes using Calcium Hydroxide and Hydrochloric acid a few years ago ( incidentally it was a waste of time )
But It surprised me.

Add a teaspoon of citric acid to a sugar wash and you can change the pH from 7 to 3 .
Add a teaspoon of citric acid to a Rum wash and there is no change at all ........the pH clamping thing....... To get the same change ( from 7 to 3 ) you need to add around 100mls of concentrated Hydrochloric acid .
Same for raising pH , you need ridiculous amounts of alkaline .I tried a few Calcium carbonate tablets ( same stuff shells are made of ) and it did nothing ....needed to add heaps of stronger Calcium Hydroxide to get a noticeable raise in pH

[NZChris]

My rums are regularly about pH4 on day eight, long after they've gone dead. The main ferment is usually well finished before the pH gets out of hand. Plenty of nutrients, toasty temperatures and sensible OGs should complete a ferment before pH gets a chance to be a problem, with or without shells.

[Rain Distillate]

My rums are regularly about pH4 on day eight, long after they've gone dead. The main ferment is usually well finished before the pH gets out of hand. Plenty of nutrients, toasty temperatures and sensible OGs should complete a ferment before pH gets a chance to be a problem, with or without shells.

I think my biggest problem will be the "toasty temperatures" I don't have a fermenting heater to wrap vessels with so it goes off of the ambient temp in my living room. I'd like to build a soda can solar heater and direct it into a box with the fermenting vessels inside of it. I guess thats later on down the road on a boring day.

[nerdybrewer]

80 gallon ferment using 150 LBs Panela I do get it to go sour after 3 or 4 days.
My water is a little below 7.0 PH and Panela isn't Molasses, it's raw sugar with all the molasses left in it.
If I run a ferment of Molasses and sugar it will also go sour, but pure molly doesn't.

[NZChris]

If you start it well, it should generate enough heat itself. You just have to find enough insulation to not lose it. Any old blankets, sleeping bags, duvets, will help. In summer I have to loosen the insulation and point a fan at it to cool it.

[shadylane]

Rum is historically made from the waste product of sugar production, Molasses.
It's also made from fresh squeezed sugar cane.
Homedistillers often make a batch of very light rum from brown sugar.
Just a thought
There's a big difference in the nutrient needs and pH control for these different feedstock's
Also in the distillation, cuts, aging, etc

[nerdybrewer]

Rum is historically made from the waste product of sugar production, Molasses.
It's also made from fresh squeezed sugar cane.
Homedistillers often make a batch of very light rum from brown sugar.
Just a thought
There's a big difference in the nutrient needs and pH control for these different feedstock's
Also in the distillation, cuts, aging, etc

Exactly my experience.
What is the most important is the quality of the spirit, and by far (for me) it's by using Panela from Sugar Daddy.
I know the 15 gallons in the barrel out in the shed is going to be awesome next July at 1 year old.
For now I'm drinking 3 month old Panela rum that spent it's aging time in an 8 gallon Black Swan barrel, it's YUMMY!

[Rain Distillate]

Rum is historically made from the waste product of sugar production, Molasses.
It's also made from fresh squeezed sugar cane.
Homedistillers often make a batch of very light rum from brown sugar.
Just a thought
There's a big difference in the nutrient needs and pH control for these different feedstock's
Also in the distillation, cuts, aging, etc

Exactly my experience.
What is the most important is the quality of the spirit, and by far (for me) it's by using Panela from Sugar Daddy.
I know the 15 gallons in the barrel out in the shed is going to be awesome next July at 1 year old.
For now I'm drinking 3 month old Panela rum that spent it's aging time in an 8 gallon Black Swan barrel, it's YUMMY!

Would you say you get a better rum taste from molasses or the panela? Let's say money's not a figure in the equation (just for a second). Which is better for rum? Does one yield more than the other.

Personal preferences- molasses over the panela or vice versa?
Going to be using golden barrel unsulphured blackstrap molasses. Only bought one gallon... 20usd! Splitting it with d.b.sugar. thinking between 5-8 lbs d.b. sugar & 1/2 gallon molasses per fermentation vessel.

[Oldvine Zin]

Loving the 100% panela over the 100% molly. The panela has a cleaner taste

OVZ

[NZChris]

Your final result has a lot to do with your ingredients, so stick your finger in them and taste them. The last time I made a rum out of a molasses that wasn't great, the rum wasn't great. Ageing hasn't improved it ... yet.

Brown sugar is white sugar with a layer of molasses covering the crystals. Unless you have some exceptionally good deal it is cheaper to buy molasses and white sugar separately and combine them.

[Saltbush Bill]

Would you say you get a better rum taste from molasses or the panela? Let's say money's not a figure in the equation (just for a second). Which is better for rum? Does one yield more than the other.

Lets look at it from this angle.
We all have different tastes, what do we consider that rum should taste like?
We have White and Pale Rums, Dark Rums and Black Rums, Navy rums , Over Proof Rums and Under Proof Rums and lets not forget spiced rums.
We also have things like Rhum Agricole and Cachaça.
Rum is produced in a multitude of countries, using a lot of different methods, Methods of fermentation alone differ greatly. Distillation of the rum in those countries and the still types used varies enough to make more difference.
Then we have the many and varied blending styles and the differences in oaking and aging techniques which change things even more .
All of these things need to be considered when we ask what is best ?
Make something that suits your and your friends tastes and be happy with that.
In short the question of what is best ..or what Rum should taste like is a little more complex that it first seems.

[Yummyrum]

Good point Salty...one mans poison

If you start it well, it should generate enough heat itself. You just have to find enough insulation to not lose it. Any old blankets, sleeping bags, duvets, will help. In summer I have to loosen the insulation and point a fan at it to cool it.

+1 Start with a high temp around 35 -40 deg C and it will look after itself .For Neutrals and whiskys you wouldn't dream of running this hot but for Rums with Bread yeast its perfect . Blankets work great . It is very rare that I need a heater pad in winter as well but I am in a pretty warm part of Aussie. Like NZchris said , summer is tricky to keep it cool enough ..... don't worry too much about the fine detail of fermenting ....its pretty hard to stuff it up .

Still need a solid method on how to navigate through the mold to get to the dunder. I will be installing a spigot for next time but this time will require finesse. Any tips? Scoop out the majority and boil it?

Rain , I'm not sure how good you are at siphoning ......some folk have tried it and ended up with a gut full of something they didn't like .

Here's how I do it .

Firstly raise the bucket of dunder so its on a bench . Place a collection vessel on the floor below it .
Get a piece of clear hose about 3/8" is good and about 4 foot long .
using a spoon or similar , move the mold and dip one end of the hose into the dunder .

Standing above the dunder start sucking .each time you finish sucking , stick your tongue in the end of the hose . Take another breath and suck a bit more , each time sticking your tongue in the hose when you have finished .You should see the dunder rising up and up the hose .

When its about 6-9 inches from your mouth lower your head toward the collection vessel and quickly pull the hose from your mouth ....the flow will happen and not a drop will end up in your mouth .
If you are really worried , put a condom over your tongue

[Oldvine Zin]

Or something like this:
http://www.northernbrewer.com/auto-siphon-1-2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

OVZ

[nerdybrewer]

Or something like this:
http://www.northernbrewer.com/auto-siphon-1-2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

OVZ

I have one, works great!

[Rain Distillate]

I've seen these at the local brew shop. I have a drill pump I use for racking. I'll probably use that.

[NZChris]

What a bunch of wimps. Just suck on the hose. You don't have to keep sucking til it's coming outta your nose. It isn't going to kill you if you if you get a taste and you should taste it before you put it in your wash anyway.

[Rain Distillate]

[quote="NZChris"

"you should taste it before you put it in your wash anyway.[/quote]"

True

[Oldvine Zin]

What a bunch of wimps. Just suck on the hose. You don't have to keep sucking til it's coming outta your nose. It isn't going to kill you if you if you get a taste and you should taste it before you put it in your wash anyway.

OVZ

[Rain Distillate]

If all goes well I will be making up the rum on thursday.

[Rain Distillate]

Didn't add the dunder to the molasses ferment. Guess I didn't wanna risk ruining that expense molasses. I'll charge the boiler with the wash and dunder and see what happens.

[shadylane]

Didn't add the dunder to the molasses ferment. Guess I didn't wanna risk ruining that expense molasses. I'll charge the boiler with the wash and dunder and see what happens.

Sounds like a good idea
Some boiled yeast and a pinch of Epsom salts for nutrients is also a good idea.

[nerdybrewer]

What a bunch of wimps. Just suck on the hose. You don't have to keep sucking til it's coming outta your nose. It isn't going to kill you if you if you get a taste and you should taste it before you put it in your wash anyway.

OVZ

It should always be noted that it can be dangerous to do it this way when transferring high proof alcohol.
I use a 1/2" ID PTFE tube and a 1/4" copper tube along with a damp cloth. (those are both safe for high proof)
Insert both tubes into container with the spirit, one of the tubes (the PTFE) must extend under the surface of the liquid while the other (in my case copper) stays above the surface.
(It works if it's below the surface but blowback can happen)
Seal up the entrance to the container with the damp cloth and blow into the container via the smaller tube.
The liquid should be forced out through the larger tube and once it forms a siphon you can let go of the smaller tube.
Pull out of the liquid once your transfer is done, or continue if you are moving all of it to another vessel.

One time of getting a blast of high proof alcohol to the throat will convince you it's a bad thing.

[Rain Distillate]

Didn't add the dunder to the molasses ferment. Guess I didn't wanna risk ruining that expense molasses. I'll charge the boiler with the wash and dunder and see what happens.

Sounds like a good idea
Some boiled yeast and a pinch of Epsom salts for nutrients is also a good idea.

Is Fermax not a great source of nutrients?

[nerdybrewer]

Didn't add the dunder to the molasses ferment. Guess I didn't wanna risk ruining that expense molasses. I'll charge the boiler with the wash and dunder and see what happens.

Sounds like a good idea
Some boiled yeast and a pinch of Epsom salts for nutrients is also a good idea.

Is Fermax not a great source of nutrients?

Molasses doesn't require nutrients.
Already has enough, if you use enough molasses your yeast will be happy.
I use a large amount of baking yeast, a cup full well hydrated yeast in a gallon size container for a large batch of rum.
Kicks into high gear within an hour of pitching usually even faster.

[shadylane]

Molasses doesn't require nutrients

I'll have to somewhat disagree, Molasses may not require nutrients
but it will ferment faster and cleaner with a yeast bomb

[Rain Distillate]

Molasses doesn't require nutrients

I'll have to somewhat disagree, Molasses may not require nutrients
but it will ferment faster and cleaner with a yeast bomb

So my yeast bomb grew from around 1/2" to about 4" before I pitched it. It stayed very warm and fermented very hard for 2 days. 1-2 days of slower fermenting. After 4 days could this be finished or did it stall? Thought bakers yeast took awhile. Daughters bday tom so I won't be able to check with hydrometer til late tomorrow or the following day. Just bought refractometer will be here in a few weeks.