Need advice on my first wash

[Longhairedcountryboy]

Here's what I got in the cupboard...
9 lbs fine granulated sugar, ~ 1 1/2 lbs brown sugar, 8 oz mollasses, 4 packs of dry activated yeast, and ~2 oz lemon juice in the fridge (one of those little plastic lemons 1/2 full).
I have a 5 gal glass carboy cleaned and ready. My set up looks some what similar to TNfrank's. I have a 16 quart ss boiler, a copper lyne arm, a mason jar thumper, a copper condenser coil going through a coffee can. I was looking for some advice on how to put the wash together. How much of what? At first, I was thinking about just using all of the sugar, mollasses,etc. but then I thought I should ask the pros what they think. I just want to make something decent so I can convince the wife to let me spend some money on equipment.

[Tater]

Then read read read

[knuklehead]

Here's what I got in the cupboard...
9 lbs fine granulated sugar, ~ 1 1/2 lbs brown sugar, 8 oz mollasses, 4 packs of dry activated yeast, and ~2 oz lemon juice in the fridge (one of those little plastic lemons 1/2 full).
I have a 5 gal glass carboy cleaned and ready. My set up looks some what similar to TNfrank's. I have a 16 quart ss boiler, a copper lyne arm, a mason jar thumper, a copper condenser coil going through a coffee can. I was looking for some advice on how to put the wash together. How much of what? At first, I was thinking about just using all of the sugar, mollasses,etc. but then I thought I should ask the pros what they think. I just want to make something decent so I can convince the wife to let me spend some money on equipment.

I will try and do this in lbs and gallons and I hope I am right. I usually use metric but I'll try.
This will give you a very light rum

4 lbs white sugar
1.5 lbs brown sugar
8 oz molasses for yeast nutrient
a little lemon juice to adjust ph if needed
and 3 gallons of water

Fill 1 1/2 gallons of water in a pot and heat till boil. Add the sugars carefully so you don't burn yourself. Stir until all the sugar is dissolved. Add the molasses and the lemon juice and pour contents into a sterilized bucket you will use as a fermenter. Add another 1 1/2 gallons of cold water. This should give you an initial SG of 1.070 which is 9.3% potential alcohol. This should ferment dry as it's all sugar. Wait till the wash temperature is below 104 F and pitch your yeast and don't be afraid to over pitch. Make sure all the tools you use are sterile as well. Then snap on a lid, use some packing tape to tape it on to make sure nothing is coming or going past the seal and install your airlock. It will take form 7 - 14 days to finish but I am just guessing, I've never used that yeast.
Like I said this was kind of like posting in another language for me since I use metric. I think everything is accurate though.
Once it's done run it though your still twice.

[Longhairedcountryboy]

Then read read read

That is the first thing I read when I first looked into distilling. That was 4 months ago. I have read the home distillers site completely and visit it quite often. I have read and re read alot, if not most, of the information at the alcohol library site. I have read months worth of posts on this forum and also at distillers and new distillers. I have studied photos of hundreds of homemade stills. I have studied lots of technical information. I have downloaded every pdf I could get for free, including "Alcohol Distillation: Basic Principals, Equipment, Performance Relationships, And Safety" by Eric Kvaalen, Doctoral Student in Chemical Engineering Philip C. Wankat, Professor of Chemical Engineering and Bruce A. McKenzie, Extension Agricultural Engineer, Purdue University, "Building a home distilling apparatus: A Step By Step Guide" and "Artisan Distilling" by Kris Arvid Burglund, Phd. I have checked out commercial equipment from numerous manufacturers. I have checked out the products offered by Gert Strand. There is more I could list but I hope this is enough to make my point. I have a good understanding of the technical aspects of what I am getting into.
After I read about the importance of reading, The second thing I ever read about distilling was, if you have a question, ask someone who knows. I just wanted to know how much of what I have on hand to use in my first attempt at distilling.


And Knucklehead, Thank you very much. You have been a great help. I hope that I can return the favor some time. Here's the figures you gave me converted to metric...
1.82 kg white sugar
0.68 kg brown sugar
0.23 liter molassas
11.36 liters water
and to pitch yeast at 40c
My boiler holds 15.14 liters to the brim and my fermenting "bucket" holds 18.93 liters to the brim.
It sounds good to me. I'm going to give it a go. Thanks again

[linw]

After that explanation I reckon you can be said to have done a bit of reading!! But to be fair to Tater, a one minute look at the homedistiller site under wash turns up many rum sugar/mollasses recipes. But there ya go.

Good luck with your first ferment and run. It sure is fun and be sure to let us know how it went.

[Tater]

Not trying to be ugly to ya LHCB . Seems like so many are comming to fourm now looking to be spoon fed info.Rather then reading or using search.Example look at guest post about getting a keg from restraunt or store .I told him do like i do offer to pay dposit on keg.He asked how much that would be.Like I would know what they are in his area.lol sorry if ya took offance.

[jbrew9999]

LHCB,
Those papers sound interesting. Do you have links to them handy? If not, I'm sure I can dig them up later when I get some time.

[Big J]

From one noob to another I thought I would share the rum recipe I have used twice so far with success. I pulled it from another thread in this forum. I know its not exactly what's in your cupboard, but thought it might help.
1 gallon molasses
5 lbs sugar
Dissolve the sugar and molasses in about a gallon of boiling water in the fermenter.
Fill the fermenter to 5 gallons with water

To that I added 20g yeast and 2tsp of DaP. I used Lalvin EC-1118 yeast, fermented to about 14% in 6 days. Ran it through my pot still twice and it comes out really nice. Good luck.

Cheers,
Big J

[possum]

Longhairedcountryboy, beware the worm....

your wormcan and or worm may be too small

a coffee can may be to small, maybee a bigger bucket.

a test run of distilled water will tell you if the condenser bucket is too small, or needs a cool watersource.

[Guest]

Yes, the can is too small. I have redone it with a 5gal bucket. The wash is comming along well, I think. I started it 5 days ago. The vapor lock is bubbling every few minutes and it kind of smells like wine. It stays at about 75F/24C. I'll keep posting my progress.

[Longhairedcountryboy]

I forgot to log on before I posted ^

[possum]

Alright LHCB...hear that fermenter chuggin'

Boil boil,toil and troubble
Fire burn and caulbron bubble

Eye of newt
Wing of bat
fat from a newborn babe....


(the three witches)

[possum]

Sorry, I misquoted The Bard (Shakespear, not Dylan)

from Macbeth

A dark Cave. In the middle, a Caldron boiling. Thunder.

Enter the three Witches.

1 WITCH. Thrice the brinded cat hath mew'd.
2 WITCH. Thrice and once, the hedge-pig whin'd.
3 WITCH. Harpier cries:—'tis time! 'tis time!
1 WITCH. Round about the caldron go;
In the poison'd entrails throw.—
Toad, that under cold stone,
Days and nights has thirty-one;
Swelter'd venom sleeping got,
Boil thou first i' the charmed pot!
ALL. Double, double toil and trouble;
Fire burn, and caldron bubble.
2 WITCH. Fillet of a fenny snake,
In the caldron boil and bake;
Eye of newt, and toe of frog,
Wool of bat, and tongue of dog,
Adder's fork, and blind-worm's sting,
Lizard's leg, and owlet's wing,—
For a charm of powerful trouble,
Like a hell-broth boil and bubble.
ALL. Double, double toil and trouble;
Fire burn, and caldron bubble.
3 WITCH. Scale of dragon; tooth of wolf;
Witches' mummy; maw and gulf
Of the ravin'd salt-sea shark;
Root of hemlock digg'd i the dark;
Liver of blaspheming Jew;
Gall of goat, and slips of yew
Sliver'd in the moon's eclipse;
Nose of Turk, and Tartar's lips;
Finger of birth-strangled babe
Ditch-deliver'd by a drab,—
Make the gruel thick and slab:
Add thereto a tiger's chaudron,
For the ingrediants of our caldron.
ALL. Double, double toil and trouble;
Fire burn, and caldron bubble.
2 WITCH. Cool it with a baboon's blood,
Then the charm is firm and good.

[Longhairedcountryboy]

I'll drink to that.

[Longhairedcountryboy]

Here's a pic of what I got put together. I'm still working out the bugs with the water runs. I need to pick up some stainless bolts from the auto store, or do away with them all together by soldering the arm to the ss bowl. I don't know if that will work, but I have a few of those bowls to try it out on. The cork gaskets leak a little sometimes. I'm going to try a little flour paste on the seams. Does flour paste effect the taste of the product?

The wash has been going for almost 2 weeks and is still bubbling away. I picked up a cheap hydrometer at the homebrew store for $4US. The problem is, I didn't have it at the begining of the ferment so I don't have the exact starting sg, just KH's estimation. I won't have time to run it untill next week, anyway. I'll let y'all know how it goes.

[Longhairedcountryboy]

OK. The wash is at 0.996 which puts it at about 10% abv if the estimated starting sg of 1.070 was close. It is pretty dry with a hint of sweetness. I can't tell how sweet though because I have a cold and my sniffer and taster are a little off.

[Spiritmaker]

Hey LHCB, man thats one cool set up you have there! I mean it's realy neat (as in clean and orderly), I'd be ashamed for ya to see my rig right now. My "lab" is currently undergoing a little renovating and everythings a mess. I gotta question or two, what size copperr tubing did you use? I now have a 20 liter ss stockpot boiler, but I've attached a 3/8 inch copper tubing to it. I was wondering if I should go to a larger size like it looks as if you did? Also, do th "clothes pins" really work? How long is your worm and how many turns did you make inside the bucket? When my "still" finally grows up, it's gonna look like that too!
Great job pal,
Spiritmaker

[Longhairedcountryboy]

Thanks, spiritmaker.

I used 3/4 inch for the arm. The rest of the copper is 3/8 inch o.d. The coil is about 10 ft. and was wrapped 3 1/2 times around a 6 inch coffee can. might be a little overkill. I used cork stoppers and gaskets. I have only run water through it and I am having trouble with the seal between the boiler and bowl. The clamps and cork gasket are not holding tight. I'm going to try more pins and/or some flour paste. I'm also experencing some discoloration of the water in the thumper and a slight off taste in the collection from the cork. Hopefully that will go away after a few more water runs.

My wash is done fermenting. It took 2 weeks to the day. I don't have time to run it untill sunday. Will it make a difference if I leave it sit till then?

[Spiritmaker]

Hey again LHCB, I would't worry too much about leaving a sugar based wash sitting for a while. I routinely let mine sit until I can get around to running it! Sometimes thats a week or two after all the ferment activity has stopped, and I've not had any problems. Where I do have some concerns is with GRAIN or fruit based washes. I have asked on several pages (in replys to other postings) but I can't seem to get a straight answer. I haven't found it on this host site either. I have read that grain and fruit (if left in the wash while it ferments) continue to make methyl alcohol long after it stops making ethyl! So if you let it set on th grain or fruit, you (in supposition) end up with a more toxic wash!
I understand that you boil off the methyl first so it's fairly easy to seperate it from the good stuff, IF you know how much to cut! Problem in this case would be, that IF this claim is true, then the longer you let it sit, the more you'd hafta toss, but how much? Incidentally, I read this posted on one of the sites that I would generally trust to be accurate. The "author" was touted as a master bootlegger, so one would think he would know what he is writing about, right? I know "tater" always reminds us to "read, read and read some more" and I do, but when I see conflicting info like this, I hafta ask the question in an open forum where I can get more than one "expert" opinion.
Thanks for putting up with me, I didn't mean to go on like this, but like you, I still don't have a difinative answer to this stupid question!
Spiritmaker

[Tater]

Cant speak for others only what Ive done.Ive left fruit washes 4 or 5 weeks before distilling without any ill affects. Have seen others do wild yeast apple brandy that was set out in fall and not ran till spring
Most Ive ever left grain has been couple weeks.Agin with no Ill effects.If you have a cold place to set it even better make yeast settle better.The higher the abv of wash less Id worry about it sitting.Couldnt tell much differance if any in cuts either.

[Spiritmaker]

Thanks "tater", I too have personally left some of my homemade wine sit for a long time but I didn't care too much for th "rotten" or sulpher taste I got. Consequently I distilled it into brandy and it made a world of difference all around. I really don't know what caused this but I think the yeast ran out of sugar and started eating their dead relations(?) Anyway, th alcohol level was so high after double distilling I couldn't taste (or smell) anything for three days, and that was after th hangover cleared up!
I'm still scared of grain though, so it encourages me when you say you have suffered no (known) ill effects (yet?). Actually, the article I read said that even a few days more was too much, as in 7-10 days total, so I'm tending to doubt this guys self proclaimed "credentials" more and more. Just wanna be sure though, so I hope somebody will reply to this without gettin mad at me fer askin a stupid(?) question agin!
Thanks,
Spiritmaker

[Uncle Remus]

Spiritmaker,

I've left some grain wash up to 6 weeks before I ran it with no problem. However it was kept in cool temperatures during that time just a few degrees above 0 C for the most part.

[Spiritmaker]

Hey thanks guys, especially THM! You have given me the most direct answer I have gotten for this question since I first asked it. If I understand you correctly, then I really don't need to be all that concerned about leaving my grain wash sit on the lees for a month or so, right? It does seem that as with wine, this must be true, otherwise we'd all be blind by now. Unc' I 'preciate your "cooler" clime more now, (I'm in the southern USA) and I don't get all that much really cool weather to worry about. More often, my worry is keeping my fermenting yeastie beasties from "cooking" to death in their own self generated heat. I think I may have another try at making some corn liqour!
Thanks and enjoy, I'll be 'reading ya"
Spiritmaker

[hummelfahrer]

High LHCB,
Good lookin' rig,ya made.There's only one piece of equipment missing.
Your thermometer.It should sit right on top of your collumn,the lowest point of it should be level with the bottom of your lyne arm.
It is very important for correct temp measurement,that the thermometer is
placed in the FLOW of steam,not just sitting in a dead end.
You may even opt for using a parrot as well,to double check and measure your final %alc/vol,as to determine exact cut-off points.
Greetings from the
hummelfahrer

[Longhairedcountryboy]

Hey hummelfahrer,
That still was the first one that I threw together. The thermometer IS in the vapor path. Its in the thumper in that picture. It was the most logical position for it to get an acurate temp reading on the vapor right before it gets condensed. I used the thumper twice and did away with it. I moved the thermometer to the top of the column and connected the worm coil off the side of the column. I did a few runs with that set up untill I found a pump. Then I built a lyne arm with a water jacket and did away with the worm coil. After many problems with that poorly constructed rig, I have taken my time to build something proper. It is almost complete. I will be posting pictures while I sip on some of the product that it produces on its first run by next week.

[hummelfahrer]

High LHCB,
Trashin' the worm was probably one of the smartest things you did to your rig.I know that I'm gonna earn a lot of cussin' for my comment,but a Liebig
condenser is way more efficient in cooling capacity AND it is very easy to clean.This is probably it's biggest asset.Having only a straight tube,it can be cleaned with a rig resembling an oversized (rifle)bore cleaning kit.
My own rig is made out of SS,only the boiler being made of copper.
This is because copper has to be stored ansolutely dry after cleaning or else
this green shit starts to form almost immediately.And being a TIG-weldor.
I just love welding SS.If you want to lok at some fine european rigs,
go to http://www.schnapsbrennnen.at onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow and take a look at their
(photo)gallerie.
Keep up the good work
hummelfahrer

[stillman]

Hello Hummelfahrer,

That website wouldn't come up for me.

Shnapsbrennen also has a detailed book (in German) on the distilling process. Lot's of photos and recipes.

Unfortunately, my German is not so good, but getting better with a few trips to Europe under my belt.

There is also another German still making company that has great looking stills. "Adrian Adolf"

I have a copy of thier brochure that is in English and thier stills look amazing. No website info on them though. I'll google them later.

[stillman]

Try

http://www.schnapsbrennen.at onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[hummelfahrer]

High,
Guess I put in one too many n's in my schnapsbrennen.at
Go to discussions then>fotogalerie for pictures.
hummelfahrer.