making distilled Vinegar

[LoC]

ok,. i got a wierd question, and i dont know if this is the place to post it, but i did a search and came up with nothing.

here goes.... does anyone make thier own distilled vinegar, say for use in pickling?

my theory would be to distill a Vodka, water down to 10% ABV, and add some mother of vinegar.

just throwing this out there..... cause if the ZOMBIE apocalypse ever comes, and i cant buy vinegar at the store for my pickles, and pickled beets, i'd be lost

cheers!

[Husker]

I would also be interested in more information. We do already produce the base product. I think a different boiler (different full still), would probably be recommended. I be also would like to do my own home brewed vinegar at some time.

H.

[RumBrewer]

Using Braggs apple cider vinegar as a starter, I've had great luck making cider and malt vinegars. I even made peach wine and converted that.
NO need to distill anything for your vinegar. Just distill the vinegar once it's made.
Also, when making vinegar, remember to cap your vessel with cheese cloth, as the acetobacter needs o2 to do it's thing!

[LoC]

can you provide more info on distilling the vinegar.... how does that work since the boiling point of acetic acid is 118C-119C. i would think it would be better to distill a clear neutral and dilute it in order to produce a clean clear vinegar for use in pickling and/or cleaning / whatever else you can use white vinegar for.

side note, i read a great rice wine receipe in the receipe section that would make a great rice wine vinegar for asian cooking!

[RumBrewer]

Sorry... I was unclear.
Just make a nice wine or beer and add the "Mother" 1/4 cup of Braggs Organic in a 1 gallon batch of juice wine has worked very good for me.
Between a few weeks to a few months, there will be a thick leathery mother on top which will fall and another will begin.
Once you have vinegar... and you'll know.... THEN you would distill it.
I have nothing to add to the conversation about distilling the vinegar... just about making it. I do know that most commercial products are diluted to 5% acidity... still plenty acidic to eat the enamel off your teeth.

This is what got me interested in making vinegar:
http://beerporn.blogspot.com/2011/02/vi ... t-for.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[cob]

distilled vinegar is not a distilled product. distilled refers to the source (rice wine, red wine, apple cider, etc) of the alcohol used to ferment vinegar from alcohol. making vinegar only requires some form of alcohol 15% or under, a starter, and a glass jar. the better product you start with rule applys. cob

[LoC]

HUSKER, why would you need a different type of still?

RumBrewer, thanks for the clarification.

Cob, thanks for the info, i was wondering what the upper %ABV to make vinegar was.

my theory (and all it is, is theory) is this:

1) create mash, and distill to highest proof/ cleanest neutral possible.

2) dilute to 7-10%ABV and add mother of vinegar and wait. (or 5% as that is what most comericial WHITE vinegar is)

3) use your white (also called distilled) vinegar where you would use store bought vinegar.

OR

1) create mash, and distill to highest proof/ cleanest neutral possible.

2) dilute to 7-10% ABV and add mother of vinegar

3) distill vinegar..... and by distill vinegar, i mean distill the water out of the vinegar since water has the lowest boiling point... this way you could create a much stronger acetic acid (vinegar)

now i dont know what high concentration Acetic acid is used for, but that is how i THINK you could make it..... can someone let me know if i am missing something, or am making an assumption that i shouldnt be?

cheers

[Dnderhead]

You have it or most.
if you aerate during the bacteria fermentation it will shorten the time considerably.
then strain.

[RumBrewer]

distilled vinegar is not a distilled product.

Thanks Cob!
Another little known fact to tuck away for that perfect moment!

[WhiskeyJeremy]

I know nothing about making vinegar but according to this link distilled vinegar is a distilled product.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinegar#Distilled_vinegar

[cob]

it's hard to disbelieve a wiki, however this source may also have merit. http://www.versatilevinegar.org/faqs.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow. spirit or distilled vinegar, under formal standards for vinegar. so apparently both descriptions are valid. cob

[Dnderhead]

It seems if you distilled at 240f/118c? you whould carry everything over.or most.

[WhiskeyJeremy]

What makes this interesting to me, is that it Not being a distilled product makes more sense. Start with a neutral spirit, dilute, then add the mother of vinegar. Guess I will be spending some quality time with google.

[blind drunk]

Just make a nice wine or beer and add the "Mother" 1/4 cup of Braggs Organic in a 1 gallon batch of juice wine has worked very good for me.
Between a few weeks to a few months, there will be a thick leathery mother on top which will fall and another will begin.

Try as I might, I've never been able to get mine to do what you've described. My vinegar attempts never quite become vinegar, just sort of vinegar, and i never get that cap movement. My day used to make a demi john of the stuff to give to everybody. It was strong as hell and as delicious. His vinegar mother was this huge solid blob that he took out of the demi john and washed every year. When he died and the house got sold, my sisters tossed the whole lot away. Not their faults as I wasn't there for the house cleaning and clearing. Never thought to ask them to hold back a chunk.

[Dnderhead]

a lot of the vinegar has the "mother" filtered out,therefor will not make a "starter".
so I thank you need "organic" posably a health food store will have it.a small bottle will do.

[RumBrewer]

of juice wine has worked very good for me.
Between a few weeks to a few months, there will be a thick leathery mother on top which will fall and another will begin.

Try as I might, I've never been able to get mine to do what you've described. [/quote]
Yes, you need to make sure that the vinegar you are using is organic and unfiltered. Braggs is the brand I use, but there are others out there.
Also, make sure you're leaving some head room and that it's got a cloth cover. I use cheese cloth doubled over and banded to the top. it takes some time to get the first one going...but once the blob forms... it goes a lot faster. Try starting in a mason jar with like 20% Braggs (King soopers has it here) and 80% wine.
Homebrew stores often have mothers available too.

[jefvos]

Distilled vinegar is made from alcohol that has already been distilled. You would hope what you're buying in the store is made from corn or something similar but the likelihood is that the base is petroleum based ethyl alcohol (see the quote below right from the FDA website). Any distilled alcohol can be put through a secondary fermentation to change the primary alcohol,R-CH2-OH, to vinegar (acedic acid), CH3-COOH. You can do this the same way you would with wine, mash or beer but remember the higher the ABV the longer the time for oxidation and you will be fighting evaporation. Angel's share vinegar or Solera Vinegar might be something interesting but whose got the time for all of that?

FDA CPG Sec. 555.100 Alcohol; Use of Synthetic Alcohol in Foods
Synthetic ethyl alcohol may be used as a food ingredient or in the manufacturing of vinegar or other chemicals for food use, within limitations imposed by the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act, the Alcohol Administration Act, and regulations promulgated under these acts.

I've got some old school PDFs about vinegar making if anyone's interested. Old school, think 1800s.

[frozenthunderbolt]

I've got some old school PDFs about vinegar making if anyone's interested. Old school, think 1800s.

Yes please!

[eStill]

can you provide more info on distilling the vinegar.... how does that work since the boiling point of acetic acid is 118C-119C.

I'm not sure this gets a clear answer. I'm sure vinegar boiling point is affected by impurities the same way "wash" boiling point changes throughout a run.

There seem to be an equal number of sources claiming that distilled vinegar is vinegar distilled as there are claiming that it is distilled and then allowed to convert to vinegar. It would appear that in the UK distilled vinegar is actually vinegar which is subsequently distilled.

i would think it would be better to distill a clear neutral and dilute it in order to produce a clean clear vinegar for use in pickling and/or cleaning / whatever else you can use white vinegar for.

I can't see how this will produce a clear vinegar. Does it work?

[contrahead]

This place was hard to find. Although I began with the intention of finding vinegar information, it was by accident that I stumbled upon this thread. The search functions proved perfectly useless – as it provides 7,200 links to undesired conversations. Rad might have scolded me for not having thought to apply “distilled” vinegar to my search terms though. Unfortunately for me, this university just terminated what was probably its most knowledgeable and prolific professor. A resource and wealth of information this forum may not be able to replace.

“Distilled vinegar is not produced by distillation but by fermentation of distilled alcohol”.

“Vin Aigre” (sour wine - vinegar) is inevitability produced by acetic acid bacteria when a fermented concoction is abandoned or neglected for a long period (months). This bacterium like baking/brewing yeasts, is on flowers, bees & fruit, in dirt and naturally present in the air, everywhere and all the time. In theory you should be able to create vinegar by fermenting a beer or wine from molasses, dates, sorghum, fruits, berries, melons, coconut, honey, beer, maple syrup, potatoes, beets, malt, grains, whey and so fourth – then leave it in open contact with air for a couple of months.

Commercial vinegar is produced by either slow traditional methods or by the faster industrial methods. The fast method involves inoculating ethanol (either concentrated or dilute as with wine or beer) with an acetobacter aceti starter called “mother of vinegar” and extra oxygenation. It might take only 2 or 3 days to produce vinegar this way. Pasteurized or not, vinegar's shelf life is practically indefinite. Mother of vinegar as a product can be purchased from places like amazon.com (but it is still a simple culture that can be collected and cultivated independently). This link provides advice for vinegar novices needing supervision.
http://boulderlocavore.com/make-it-your ... e-vinegar/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

The following “traditional recipe” was nabbed from a used library book I purchased called “Back To Basics” / published by Reader's Digest.

- Open a bottle a bottle of sweet cider and let it stand at about 70 deg. F. (sweet cider here > implies unpasteurized)
After about five weeks it will turn to hard cider, then to vinegar.
You can speed the process by adding a little “mother” (the cloudy clump of bacteria that forms on the surface of natural vinegar) from a previous batch or from a friend's cider vinegar.

And now: a picture of the nefarious “vinegar eel”!

[RockinRockies]

Our recent ferment was fantastic but we left it in the barrel for 2 months and it now seems to have a strong vinegar note. As of now we racked it and have about 25 gallons of cloudy vinegar ish bourbon.

Should we distill this and then cut it to 10%, add some mother, and let it do it's thing? It's very interesting and not unpleasant, but I doubt it would make anything worth adding to our barrels

[NormandieStill]

Malt vinegar! An essential of British cuisine (although cuisine is perhaps a strong word for deep-fried fish + chips!).

[Demy]

The "strength" of the vinegar is linked to the starting alcoholic contribution, more alcohol = strong vinegar .. this up to a certain point because if too alcoholic the opposite effect is obtained, that is the acetic bacteria will not survive in too high ABV ... 10% looks good but I recommend the steps .. start with a beer let's say at max 5% abv this to create a starter, then insert in our ferment.

[jonnys_spirit]

And an air pump with bubble stone pushing O2 through the ferment. Acetobacter need O2.

Cheers!
-j

[The Baker]

I have read all of this but some I have not understood and some seems to be contradictory.
My latest batch of UJSSM didn't seem to ferment much at all, it has been maybe months now; and when I checked it today after a week or two of not looking, I had vinegar.
I had heard of distilled vinegar, so I distilled the bigger part of it.
The result seemed a lot weaker.
I will check again today, the distilled against undistilled.

Anyway that would seem to be the last of this run of UJSSM! I have maybe fourteen runs and can blend the saved spirit.
And some unoaked with some that seems a bit dark.
Here's hoping I get some good vinegar and some good spirit.

Geoff

[jonnys_spirit]

“Distilled White Vinegar” is made from neutral diluted down to about 8%abv and inoculated / cultivated with acetobacter. In comparison to say wine, cider, malt, champagne, or rice vinegar. A mead/honey vinegar would be interesting!

-cheers,
-j

[The Baker]

More than one person has said that you don't really need a lid on your ferment, the carbon dioxide laying on the top will
prevent entry of 'infectors.'
Bingo.
My brew was fermenting so poorly (if at all in the later stages) that there was no CO2 there to protect it from vinegar infection.

As to why it failed to ferment I have no idea! I kept it nice and warm...

Geoff