Barley mash, pot still, and why does it taste like water?

riff42 · Post by **riff42** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 5:19 pm

I am stillin' a 4gal barley wash, and within an hour, the distillate started tasting like very watery.
I STILL don't have my alcohol meter, but I can very a VERY large difference between the first 300ml, and the second (so far, it just gets wateryer...)
Temp is stable at 97c.
I tried high heat input, just more output.
I tried low heat input, same temp, no output.

arg, I'm so confused.

pics:
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http://home.comcast.net/~dmr220/DSCN2471.JPG" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

edit: i gave up at 98c, and it just tasting like crappy water. Collected maybe 2 liters. Only about 600ml of anything strong.

junkyard dawg · Post by **junkyard dawg** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 7:05 pm

patience...

patience....

This takes time.

what are you expecting? what temp does the distillate start flowing? shot in the dark, you have a very low alcohol wash.

Uncle Remus · Post by **Uncle Remus** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 7:51 pm

Tell us all about the wash you made. I distill barley all the time and get lots of flavour.

riff42 · Post by **riff42** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:05 am

junkyard dawg wrote:patience...

patience....

This takes time.

what are you expecting? what temp does the distillate start flowing? shot in the dark, you have a very low alcohol wash.

I can only get a hint of somethign on the output around 90c.
And yeah, I did think of that last night, it might have been a low alcohol wash, since I think the ferment stuck. IF I measured everything, it was only 7.7%.
I'll prob just throw my last few batches back in and try agian.

riff42 · Post by **riff42** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:08 am

Uncle Remus wrote:Tell us all about the wash you made. I distill barley all the time and get lots of flavour.

It was the "Simple Whiskey" one on the parent site. 8lbs a barley, cook for awhile, drain and ferment.
I think the ferment stuck. I haven't had a good ferment on anything yet for some reason, so that might have been the problem right there.....
I let settle after my first filter, and siphoned into the pot.

I know it's a potstill, but the higher alcohol cuts didn't taste good at all....But as before, my initial dissapointment has faded into "just try again...."

Uncle Remus · Post by **Uncle Remus** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 6:34 am

It was the "Simple Whiskey" one on the parent site. 8lbs a barley, cook for awhile, drain and ferment.
I think the ferment stuck. I haven't had a good ferment on anything yet for some reason, so that might have been the problem right there.....
I let settle after my first filter, and siphoned into the pot.

I know it's a potstill, but the higher alcohol cuts didn't taste good at all....But as before, my initial dissapointment has faded into "just try again...."

Did you do a starch conversion? Did you add sugar? If all you did is cook it and throw yeast at it your not gonna get any alcohol.

riff42 · Post by **riff42** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:14 am

Uncle Remus wrote:
It was the "Simple Whiskey" one on the parent site. 8lbs a barley, cook for awhile, drain and ferment.
I think the ferment stuck. I haven't had a good ferment on anything yet for some reason, so that might have been the problem right there.....
I let settle after my first filter, and siphoned into the pot.

I know it's a potstill, but the higher alcohol cuts didn't taste good at all....But as before, my initial dissapointment has faded into "just try again...."
Did you do a starch conversion? Did you add sugar? If all you did is cook it and throw yeast at it your not gonna get any alcohol.

A starch "conversion"? Meaning did I cook the malt? Yes. Though, reading a bit more about this subject, I ended up cooking the grain a BIT higher than what was ideal (it was smeggin' hard!! The temp would stay steady for 15min, then it would jump up 10deg!! Should I stir grains as I cook them???), which seems to lead to lower alcohol content...WHICH might also explain the short ferment.

I used this:
Basic Whiskey Recipe
So a "no frills" whiskey recipe might go as ...
Heat 4 kg cracked or crushed malt with 18 L of water to 63-65 °C, and hold there for 1-1.5 hours. Heat to 73-75 °C, then strain off and keep liquid, using 250 mL of hot water to rinse the grains. Cool to below 32 °C (should have an initial specific gravity of 1.050). Add hydrated yeast & leave to ferment (maintain at 26 °C) until airlock stops bubbling and final SG of around 1.010. Let settle for a day, then syphon carefully into still.

Nothing about sugar in that one, nor the one below it.

Uncle Remus · Post by **Uncle Remus** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:57 am

Sounds like maybe you could have got it too hot and killed the enzymes in the malt and therefore very little starch got converted to sugars. No sugars-no alcohol.

LeftLaneCruiser · Post by **LeftLaneCruiser** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:48 pm

Hi Riff,

UR asked if the starches did convert to sugars, if not there won't be anything to ferment in the first place. Starch conversion is something else than just cooking the grains to make a porridge. It's about taking the enzymes to a temperature at which they work the best (around 63 - 65 degrees C.). At that temp it takes them an hour or two to make sugar out of flour. Enzymes work at lower temps too, but it takes a lot longer.
Basically it is nothing more difficult than making beer.

KJH

riff42 · Post by **riff42** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:59 am

thanks guys, I completely understand it all now.

Do you stir the grains while cooking, or just let it all slowly heat up and stay at the right temp?

TRANSPLANTED HILLBILLY · Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:17 pm

You will want to stir your grains while the heat is under them. Otherwise, your grain will stick to the bottom of your pot. Depending on the type of grain (whole, flaked, milled, flour) you may even want to boil them. After that let them cool before adding your malt so you don't kill the enzymes. After conversion, cool it all more so you don't kill your yeast.

Good Luck