Bad Rum Aging?

defcon4 · Post by **defcon4** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 4:42 pm

I'm a relatively new distiller (been distilling for 6 months) and have been making some rum. I have a batch of rum that I distilled to about 80% ABV on a single run, (my pot still has a lot of reflux) and I then cut it to 55% ABV to put it on oak (1tsp of medium toast american cubes per liter). I have been putting the jars in and out of the freezer every day, I haven't really opened the jars or let them air out that much except when I open them to smell it. They have been aging like this for about 3 weeks now and the color gained from the oak is awesome and they Smell like REALLY good rum, but took out a small sample, diluted it down to drinking strength, again it smelled amazing but the taste was Awful. It was harsh and tasted like it had been run through a coffee filter, it didn't taste anything like commercial rums (Myer's Jamaican Dark Rum) I've had. It tasted like a mix of paper and plastic, I don't know how this is possible and/or what I'm doing wrong to distress age it. My still is an aluminum pressure cooker boiler with copper pipe and jacketed condenser (all copper) so the off flavors can't be from my still. The only thing I could think of is the mason jar lids, they may be responsible for the paper/plastic taste, or maybe I'm just not distress aging it properly. Please let me know what I'm doing wrong and how to improve my rum.

CoopsOz · Post by **CoopsOz** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 6:15 pm

I'd be using more oak and when it's out of the freezer, crack the lids. You need to let it breath.

msrorysdad · Post by **msrorysdad** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 4:48 am

I distress age mine in mason jars, no problem. Like Coops said, you need to let it brearh I put a napkin on instead of the steel inner lid and let them sit for a few days to breath befofe I age them. Are you sure it's not the aluminum boiler body? I've never used aluminum as a boiler, but... If you stand the jars around to breath and the flavor is still off, it may be your still. Air it out, I'm sure someone who knows more about al. will post up for you. HEY, I use a coffee filter to strain my finished product to get out any wood bits, a new filter.

defcon4 · Post by **defcon4** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 8:31 am

Well I put some more oak in it (now there's about 10-12 cubes per 900mL jar) and when I take them out of the freezer today I'll leave the lids open. How much oak is neccesary and is it possible to over-oak it? How long should I distress age them and how long should I keep opening the lids?

Yeah I used aluminum for my boiled because it was cheaper and eaisier to work with, I know there's no way that any aluminum could be leaching into the distillate since it's a heavy metal, but I wonder if it's possible that it's reacting with wash especially since it's at boiling temperatures.

Thanks ya'll

defcon4 · Post by **defcon4** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 8:36 am

msrorysdad wrote:I distress age mine in mason jars, no problem. Like Coops said, you need to let it brearh I put a napkin on instead of the steel inner lid and let them sit for a few days to breath befofe I age them. Are you sure it's not the aluminum boiler body? I've never used aluminum as a boiler, but... If you stand the jars around to breath and the flavor is still off, it may be your still. Air it out, I'm sure someone who knows more about al. will post up for you. HEY, I use a coffee filter to strain my finished product to get out any wood bits, a new filter.

I haven't seen any pieces of wood come off of the cubes, they're pretty clean. I've been using them to oak some of my wines, but since I've started distilling I've been using them to age my spirits. Haven't made anything drinkable yet but I have accidentaly made a lot of white lighting.

wineo · Post by **wineo** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:10 am

It sounds like the paper flavor is tails.How did you make your cuts?
I would air it out real good for a few days,or a few hours with an air pump.
It will change the taste,and let some of the bad stuff out.I airate mine with a fish tank air pump,and some copper tubing.It works good,and smooths out the booze.Dont use an airstone,because the booze will eat the glue in it.
wineo

Uncle Remus · Post by **Uncle Remus** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 1:00 pm

You sure it wasn't your mash? What did you make it from? Also you said you only distilled it once. I always run mine twice before I'll drink it. Aluminum could react with your wash, it's probably quite acidic.

defcon4 · Post by **defcon4** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 1:32 pm

wineo wrote:It sounds like the paper flavor is tails.How did you make your cuts?

I distilled very slowly, threw away the first 100mL, I kept the temperature between 174-185 deg F. I only kept distillate that came off between 80-85% ABV. While I was disilling, I didn't see or smell any signs of tails, no oily feel, no stinking smell. Even now my rum smells sweet like good rum, it just tastes bad.

As far as aluminum and acidity, would it be turning the wash in the still acidic and would this make the distillate taste bad? Or is the distillate itself becoming acidic. I have some litmus paper from my winemaking, I'll test my backset and the distillate next time I do a run.

As far as aerating the rum, I've thought about trying that but I wasn't sure if I could use an airstone or not, thanks for letting me know about the glue. I have some silicone aquarium tubing, could I just submerge that in the rum or should I find some stainless steel or copper tubing to use. I've seen some stainless steel airstones at the brewing store, I may get one of those.
How long and for how many days approx. should I aerate?

I made my wash with 2lbs of dark brown sugar, and one 250mL jar of molasses per gallon. I brought this mixture to boil then cooled it with my wort chiller to sanitize the wash. Then I thouroughly aerated it with my beer aeration equip. Fermented with some distiller's yeast (NOT a turbo, I've had bad exp. with those). It fermented to 14% ABV in about 2 weeks then I distilled it.

Again, thanks ya'll

defcon4 · Post by **defcon4** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 2:20 pm

I just read a thread in research and theory about aluminum. Apparently anything acidic (the wash) will leach out stuff from the aluminum, which can corrode or pit the pot (I can see no visual signs of this in my pot). It very well may be ruining my stuff but I want to be absolutely sure before I go buy a $40 stainless steel pot. If I do have to though I'm glad that I threaded the copper column to the pot. That way I could just remove the lyne arm, put threads on the stainless pot, and re-attach the lyne arm on the new pot. Then again, maybe I need to build a totally new still since my still outputs about 450-500mL of 80-85%ABV cuts then another 300mL of 40% ABV tails before the run is finished. Maybe I need to replace my newbie still now that I have some experience. Then again, how can I say I have experience when I haven't yet made anything that tastes good.

wineo · Post by **wineo** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 9:24 pm

As far as airating with an air pump,I do it for 4-6 hours,the day after my run.If you heat up the airline,and squeese it with a pair of pliers,you can seal the end of the line.Once you get the line sealed,and cut off any burnt
plastic,poke some holes in it with a sharp knife.You wont have to shell out the big bucks for a stainless air stone.The reason I use a piece of copper line to run the tube through,it because the copper removes so2 from the booze,and cleans it up.Stainless wont do the same thing.I would air it out,and pot still it again.the aluminum if hard enough shouldnt be doing any thing to the distillate,unless the wash was extremely acidic,or extremely alcaline.I use to run a aluminum presure cooker still,and had no such problem.It could just be your wash.What kind of molassus did you use? Was it unsulfered? Did it have proponic acid listed in the ingredents?
wineo

defcon4 · Post by **defcon4** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 5:05 am

wineo wrote:What kind of molassus did you use? Was it unsulfered? Did it have proponic acid listed in the ingredents?
wineo

Thanks for the aeration tube tips. There aren't any feedstores closeby so I just buy the expensive grandmas's molasses in the grocery store. It is unsulphered, contains no potassium sorbate, and there were no acids listed in the ingredients. But I wonder if the brown sugar I use could have any of these compounds in it. Maybe next wash I'll try mixing white sugar and molasses in a 50/50 ratio instead.

wineo · Post by **wineo** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 8:06 am

I have tried some rum made with all molassus before,and didnt like it.
I am wondering if the taste I didnt like,is what your discribing.I have only made a few batches of rum,and the first one was too lite tasting,but good.
It tasted like neutral,with a tad bit more flavor.My 2nd batch {10 gallon}was made with 28lbs of dark brown sugar,and 2 jars of molassus.This recipe is from elricko,and he has good results with it.It has plenty of rum flavor,but not overpowering.I used 1 pack of turbo 48 for 10 gallons.
Its on its 8th day of fermenting,and will work for another week,then I will rack it and let it clear for a week or so,till it clears real good,then potstill it.
Some people like the taste of a all molassus rum,but not me.If you make another batch,try using all dark brown sugar,and 1 jar of molassus,and see if it suites your taste.
wineo

triggernum5 · Post by **triggernum5** » Sat Jun 09, 2007 6:33 am

I'd focus on your fermenting first before assuming the Al oxide is seriously breaking the laws of physics.. Fermenting temperatures can be important with certain ingredients (my assumption is various processing chemicals since I've noticed brand differences with things like brown sugar [which can contain just about anything], or nutrient supplements [this can be major]..)
Yeast type is another biggie with rum, but luckily standard baker's yeast is a champ with rum..
Infections can be elusive.. Not everything thats noticable to the palette is noticable to the nose.. Also, since good rum comes from low ABV wert [what doesn't?], bacteria stand a better chance.. (Bacteria can also improve flavor though)..
Now the down-side of your still (gravitationally I mean).. The flavor you described reminds me of distillate drawn though dirty copper (Copper(II) oxide).. I ignore the big red warning on my steam cleaner about using anything more than water, and fill it with lemon juice.. I jam some salt in the end of the worm and let it rip.. This makes the room and cleaner pretty pungent! Then I run pure water through the cleaner/worm until the steam output no longer smells like lemonjoice.. That's like 5 water batches or more before running liquid water through it..

Edit: I forgot to ask about your settling/clearing methods..