First Run on Still

Bastardo · Post by **Bastardo** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 1:00 pm

I just got my first still, home made pot still I bought off a guy on ebay. It was similar to the designs I saw on the net and was going to try to build, but this came complete, with a water pump etc.. so I figured it would be easier than learning to solder.

Anyways, I did my first run ever with some un-drinkable wine that was probably around 12 to 13% abv. After discarding 100ml, the next 100ml that came out was around 65% abv according to my newly acquired alco-meter. I continued to collect 750 ml which ended up at 60% avb, then the next 750ml collected ended up 40% abv. After this point it was coming out at just over 30%.

The product was crystal clear. The flavour of the initial product was strong in that the alcohol attacked the senses. But I have to say it was quite smooth with the grapy flavour you would expect from Grappa. I will probably dilute this down to 40-45%. The taste of the second bottle stuff, 40% overall, had a more distinct flavour, I probably cut too deep into the tails. After all the reading I’m now understanding just from the initial run.

I’m wondering if I collect enough 40% product to fill the still again, would this be too dangerous to run, or is this double distilling done by a lot of you. thanks

showrguy · Post by **showrguy** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 1:20 pm

congrats. on yer 1st. run..
aint it funny how much information you can now "absorb" after only a few hours running your still ???
and yes, you can save up your tails till you have enough to charge the still and make an all tails run, collecting in smaller jars and let air out for a few days, then decide what to keep...
or add what you have (tails) to your next run and make better cuts...
good luck, have fun

Cruiser · Post by **Cruiser** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 1:26 pm

Not too dangerous to run.

Double distilling would be taking all your drinkable product (even at 65%) and re-distilling it. But it sounds like you'd be better keeping your 60-65% middle run and just re-distilling the lower grade stuff.

It doesn't need to be 40% either. All the tails you collect can be either run again by themselves or added to the next wash (after fermentation).

You should never be wasting alcohol. General opinion is not to re-distill the foreshots but you can set them aside for other uses. I use mine for BBQ or fire starter. Just a cap-full on a pile of sticks, light it, and away it goes. If I was a smoker, I'd be using the foreshots in a Zippo lighter.

By the way, what you made was really Brandy. But I'd tell my friends or family that it was Grappa. And yes, dilute it down a bit else you'll hurt yourself

Cruiser.

Bastardo · Post by **Bastardo** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:01 pm

Thanks for the feedback. I did not know that fermented wine is actually brandy. I just looked up the definitions. Grappa being the fermented stock and seeds.

Yes I have a feeling I will learn in leaps as I continue on with this. I have some turbo yeast I want to try next.

Another question, if I do a tails run should I still be discarding the first 100ml or so, or has this been taken care of in the first run?

Ricky · Post by **Ricky** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:33 pm

just to be on the safe side i do a foreshot cut on every run. if i triple distilled i would still do a foreshot cut. better to assume it is bad and throw away good stuff than assume its good and keep bad stuff.

CoopsOz · Post by **CoopsOz** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:58 pm

In my way of thinking there is nothing lost anyway, if it's not necessary you are only throwing out the start of the heads.

Bastardo · Post by **Bastardo** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 7:51 am

Great. thanks, Also, what do you guys think is better/more efficient,
putting the tails in the next wash or doing an all tails run. Is there a difference? Would an all tails run give the most nuetral spirit?

Cruiser · Post by **Cruiser** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:02 pm

I don't expect there'd be any difference in efficiency but I personally just add the tails to the next run. That way I'm not trying to store a large amount of tails. I only end up with about 500ml of tails anyway (from a 48lt wash). It would take forever to save enough to do an all tails run.

As far as flavour goes I can't really comment but I doubt there'd be much difference.

Cruiser.

Alchemist · Post by **Alchemist** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:39 pm

Ricky wrote:just to be on the safe side i do a foreshot cut on every run. if i triple distilled i would still do a foreshot cut. better to assume it is bad and throw away good stuff than assume its good and keep bad stuff.

Seems if you KNOW you are going to do a foreshot cut on the 2nd distillation of say a double distilled scotch, is there any real reason to make a foreshot cut on the first distillation.

I want to be safe, but I don't want to waste the alcohol either. Am I correct in my thinking that as long as you are conscious of your cuts a single foreshot cut should be fully acceptable.

junkyard dawg · Post by **junkyard dawg** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 4:57 pm

I take a foreshot cut on every run. I figure that it can't hurt... It might get rid of any thing in the still from cleaning etc... Its not wasted... I use it start fires, kill ants, cleaning paintbrushes, whatever... No matter if its one run or five, the first few ounces outta the still get set aside for something other than drinking... no need to be greedy, theres plenty of good stuff coming out later...

Ricky · Post by **Ricky** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 5:03 pm

JYD my thoughts exactly!

Butch50 · Post by **Butch50** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:25 pm

The last couple of batches I have been testing for cuts by letting a few drops fall onto my index finger - then I rub that and my thumb together to get a feel for it, blow on it to evaoprate it and then smell the residue on my finger tip.

If I try to smell it before it has evaporated, the alcohol itself interferes with the odor, but right after the alcohol evaporates you can smell it clearly. I can tell very well where the heads and tails are this way. Have to rinse your hands in between but it works a treat.

CoopsOz · Post by **CoopsOz** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:58 am

I do as UJ (I think) suggested, I put a little in the palm of my hand and clap my hands together, then take a sniff. The alcohol is quickly evaporated and you are left with a pretty clean indication of where your run is at.

themoch · Post by **themoch** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 12:34 pm

what do these different stages smell like?

I have seen all over the place to do this, but nothing that indicates what sort of oder, or lack there of, i should be looking for.

tracker0945 · Post by **tracker0945** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 2:38 pm

A bit difficult to accurately describe but to my senses,
Foreshots smell like fingernail polish remover.
Heads have a similar smell but lighter and sweeter.
Hearts have no detectable smell.
Tails smell like wet bags or cardboard.

If of course you are pot distilling or distilling to low %abv you will have an underlying smell of your starting wash/mash which you are wanting to cary over into your final product.
Cheers

wineo · Post by **wineo** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 2:44 pm

I throw away forshots every time.Some people would gasp if they seen how much I throw away.I used to save lots of heads and tails,and reflux them,but for me,its not worth the trouble and time.If your trying to get a really clean product,you need to throw some out.When I run a UJSM,I use quite a bit of ending heads and begining tails to get a good whiskey flavor,but I potstill my neutral at least 2 times,and throw out alot to get a truely clean,hangover free product.