Warning for users of T500 boiler

[lampshade]

This note applies only to those using the boiler from a Turbo 500 still.

When I was just starting out I bought a Turbo 500. I quickly replaced the head with a pot still that I built and kept the boiler that came with the T500.

I only use sugar washes and have been plagued with burnt off flavors. To cover the off flavors, I only make fruit flavored cordials.

I first learned that the yeast in my wash was being burnt. So I made certain that my wash was crystal clear before distilling. This was a huge improvement, but I still had off flavors.

I began to suspect that my T500 boiler was at fault and was scorching my crystal clear Birdwatchers. Afterwards, l always need to wash the scorch marks off the bottom of my boiler.

So, as an experiment, I used the boiler to boil plain water. I noticed that this produced a C-shaped area where the bubbles formed. The OD of the C was 3-1/2" and the width of the C was 2" at its peak. I was surprised that the bubbles started to form immediately after I plugged in the boiler.

Hmmm.... maybe the boiler has a very hot and small hot spot, which could cause scorching. So I stripped a sugar-wash at only 1/4 power -- and here is the important part -- I used 1/4 power from the very start, when the wash is coming up to temperature.

The resulting product had the buttery heads taste (it was a stripping run) but no burnt off-flavors.

I think I will be modifying my T500 boiler to bypass the internal heater and add water heater elements. I will update this post with the results.

[lampshade]

When I install the water heater element, how high above the floor should it be?

[jholmz]

as close to the bottom as you can get the coupler

[pounsfos]

as close to the bottom as you can get, but leave an inch or 2 so you don't scortch the bottom

Interesting you say this as I noticed the same thing when I used my mates t500 while mine was getting welded for me

[meatheadinc]

I have seen the same in the past although some scrap copper in the boiler helped distribute heat and reduce the problem.
If you are planning an upgrade, maybe use a keg, gain some volume at the same time.
Cost of works shouldn't increase much.
You will still need to buy an element and build a controller.

[DAD300]

What about using an additional power controller (reducer) on the T500?

[lampshade]

What about using an additional power controller (reducer) on the T500?

I use a power controller on the T500 boiler.

I, like everyone else, use full power to bring the wash up to temperature, at which point the power is reduced.

I surmise that the burnt off flavors I was getting was produced by using full power to bring the wash up to temperature. To test this theory out, I used my power controller, to bring the wash up to temperature at 1/4 power. This greatly reduced the burnt off flavor.

[Prairiepiss]

I've often wondered about this. If its happening to you. You know its happening to others. No wonder they claim you don't need to make cuts with their still. And you need to carbon filter it. So that you don't find out stuff like this.

[lampshade]

Interesting you say this as I noticed the same thing when I used my mates t500 while mine was getting welded for me

I have seen the same in the past although some scrap copper in the boiler helped distribute heat and reduce the problem.

Anybody else notice this?

The T500 folks replaced the synthetics, I assume, because people were overheating and damaging the still. (That happened to me and was why I built my own pot still head -- ooohh if only I'd also replaced the boiler.) Maybe they can fix this problem too.

[lampshade]

(That happened to me and was why I built my own pot still head -- ooohh if only I'd also replaced the boiler.)

The reason I put up with this problem for so long (and only made Christmas cordials) was that I had no idea what a good product tasted like. I was beginning to think that I could do no better than burnt vodka.

So... I'm imploring the grey beards to prepare a sticky in the the new distillers lounge to describe what the novice distiller should be shooting for in taste and smell for his vodka, whiskey, and rum. That way the new distiller might know whether he is or is not on the right track to making good likker. I hope this is not a controversial topic.

[kaziel]

Could you describe the taste of "burnt vodka"? Can you also tell me about SG of your wash before distilling? I don't know much about T500 either, what kind of element are you using? The reason I'm asking is I've noticed caramel/chocolate sweetness in my last run. Recently I've made 2" VM and one only one run with that but I was running 2kW from the start (and I'm using plain SS element not low density one) and I've noticed sweet caramel taste in harts. Normally I'm doing stripping runs at 600W (got small graham that can only handle that) and didn't notice that smell/taste. My washes are always below 0 BLG. I'm searching HD about stuff like that and I think in my case caramel burned sugar taste comes from burning a bit of sugar or something else on element. I've also notices small dark (not black, maybe brown or dark brown) spots on my element that are 1-2mm in diameter and there are like 20-30 of them.

[kaziel]

I've got like 25L of sugar wash after firs siphoning in my basement (BLG -2 BTW) I will run that this weekend and will post my results. Actually I have two heating elements in one 5/4" fitting, 1 is 1.4kW and 2 is 2kW I will connect that parallel and start heat-up slow from 30% for some time then 50%, then 75% and then 2kW. Connecting both parallel will reduce power density right (without reducing max power)? I could connect them in series but my power will be reduce to ~820W.

[PhatFil]

Cheers for the heads up Lampshade, as a newbie t500 use its usefull to know.

How did u attach your potstill head to the t500 boiler im thinking of following suite..
however i would like to retain the option to use the cm reflux head for white spirits too so hope u have a removable not permenant solution.. Cheers..

[kaziel]

I'm pleased to announce that connecting two elements parallel solved my burning (caramelizing vodka) problem. I'm not sure it the scorching issue with T500 is related to boiler or to element . I think it's wort mentioning that I've also changed my heating strategy a bit first I've run 700W for 20mins then 1.5kW for 30minutes then 2.1kW for the rest of the run (4.5h) no scorching and no caramel taste/smell.

[lampshade]

How did u attach your potstill head to the t500 boiler im thinking of following suite..
however i would like to retain the option to use the cm reflux head for white spirits too so hope u have a removable not permenant solution.. Cheers..

The problem with the T500 boiler is that the top coupler is 1-3/4". Other people have remedied this by cutting and welding.

My solution was to use 1-3/4" female adapter that I bought from a local plumbing supply.

Unfortunately, the T500 male was NPS, and so it did not screw all the way into the female adapter. This left a gap between the female adapter and the boiler lid. To fill this gap, I bought 2-1/2" washers from Grainger. Unfortunately, the washers were galvanized steel, which is not ethanol-friendly. So I wrapped the washers with PFTE tape. The washer inner hole diameter was 2".

The other side of the 1-3/4" female adapter was 1-1/2", so I used a 1-1/2" to 2" coupler to attach the ferrule.

Other people have used other solutions. You might ask them.

As I have mentioned above, I now run the boiler at reduced power. This power setting is just above the power that is lost to the environment through the boiler walls. My next step is to insulate the boiler.

I am at the point that I want to throw the T500 boiler in a ditch.

[PhatFil]

Hi Lampshade, thanks for getting back to us.. i am now VERY confused tho... i did some digging on NZ and Aussie forums and still shops and came up with the info that the lid hole is 48mm in diameter.. and a referencing the wikipedia page on bsp threads http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_St ... read_sizes" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
turned up that 1.5" bsp thread has a major diameter of circa 47mm....

And ive gone and orderd stuff on that basis,, checking the ebay ad for the sanitary fitting i was hoping to mate with the t500 column nut http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321019287069? ... 1439.l2649" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
And google is now telling me that the 'DN40' indicates a 40mm bore????? hmmmmmm

Well we shall see i guess.. sounds like i might need a few more ss fittings such as a 1.75-1.5 reducing socket and 1.5" nipple to mate it all up then, ho hum, it did seem a little too painless..


I also ordered a shed full of copper for the new head and a leiblig? condensor.

Taking your warnings on board i also ordered in the bits to knock up a pot controlled ssr for power limitation and a amp/volt meter to gauge the input.

so grain washes may soon be bubbling away here..
Cheers..

[lampshade]

Hi PhaFil,

It looks like my problem was inches instead of metric. Of course, I should have known the T500 was metric and the boiler cover would not accept couplers sized in inches. Duh!!!!

Looks like you are on your way to providing a much better solution for connecting your reflux head to the boiler cover than I did. Please post your solution in a new thread so that others can benefit from your work.

Lamp

[PhatFil]

Cheers Lamp, If it works.... i wld be pleased to do a lil write up n share a few snaps,
i got enough 54mm tube to screw up a few flange attempts so fingers crossed..

[PaulmyFinger]

What about using an additional power controller (reducer) on the T500?

I use a power controller on the T500 boiler.

I, like everyone else, use full power to bring the wash up to temperature, at which point the power is reduced.

I surmise that the burnt off flavors I was getting was produced by using full power to bring the wash up to temperature. To test this theory out, I used my power controller, to bring the wash up to temperature at 1/4 power. This greatly reduced the burnt off flavor.

Hi, which power controller are you using? Ive seen lots of diagrams but i wouldn't be confident to build one myself.

Cheers

[Chauncey]

This note applies only to those using the boiler from a Turbo 500 still.

When I was just starting out I bought a Turbo 500. I quickly replaced the head with a pot still that I built and kept the boiler that came with the T500.

I only use sugar washes and have been plagued with burnt off flavors. To cover the off flavors, I only make fruit flavored cordials.

I first learned that the yeast in my wash was being burnt. So I made certain that my wash was crystal clear before distilling. This was a huge improvement, but I still had off flavors.

I began to suspect that my T500 boiler was at fault and was scorching my crystal clear Birdwatchers. Afterwards, l always need to wash the scorch marks off the bottom of my boiler.

So, as an experiment, I used the boiler to boil plain water. I noticed that this produced a C-shaped area where the bubbles formed. The OD of the C was 3-1/2" and the width of the C was 2" at its peak. I was surprised that the bubbles started to form immediately after I plugged in the boiler.

Hmmm.... maybe the boiler has a very hot and small hot spot, which could cause scorching. So I stripped a sugar-wash at only 1/4 power -- and here is the important part -- I used 1/4 power from the very start, when the wash is coming up to temperature.

The resulting product had the buttery heads taste (it was a stripping run) but no burnt off-flavors.

I think I will be modifying my T500 boiler to bypass the internal heater and add water heater elements. I will update this post with the results.

Mine lit on fire after a few years. My own custom head. If anything scorched on bottom it would trip its breaker.

I highly recommend avoiding the t500 boiler.