Birdwatchers sugar wash recipe

[Samohon]

And this of course was after 1 run only. I can well imagine that after two runs this distillate would be very clean.

Hi gavin, I've never done a single run on BW with my VM. Most of the neutral guy's here on HD strip the wash and gather the low wines produced to make a big spirit run.
Iv'e never went down the turbo yeast road but a friend has, distilling twice, (2nd time with 1L of milk to 10L low wines), Carbon filtering, ect;
Turned out quite clean smelling and tasting, but there was a little something there that I only ever tasted in cheap vodka.
Then he tried mine made with BW's recipe, he said it was night and day.

Keep the SG @ 1.080, temps between 24C - 30C, plenty of headroom in your fermenter and don't stir the yeast into the wash, let it sit on top.
I promise you won't flunk it. Works for me everytime...

I'd love to know the results from a professional chemical analysis done on your neutral...

Keep us posted man, hope this helps...

[gavin]

And this of course was after 1 run only. I can well imagine that after two runs this distillate would be very clean.

Hi gavin, I've never done a single run on BW with my VM. Most of the neutral guy's here on HD strip the wash and gather the low wines produced to make a big spirit run.
Iv'e never went down the turbo yeast road but a friend has, distilling twice, (2nd time with 1L of milk to 10L low wines), Carbon filtering, ect;
Turned out quite clean smelling and tasting, but there was a little something there that I only ever tasted in cheap vodka.
Then he tried mine made with BW's recipe, he said it was night and day.

Keep the SG @ 1.080, temps between 24C - 30C, plenty of headroom in your fermenter and don't stir the yeast into the wash, let it sit on top.
I promise you won't flunk it. Works for me everytime...

I'd love to know the results from a professional chemical analysis done on your neutral...

Keep us posted man, hope this helps...

That is very helpful, especially the direct comparison between the turbo and the BW. Although the milk kinda throws a variable in there! What was the reason for the milk?

The "little something there" that you mention is I suspect what I'm noting in my turbo results, clean but not spotless when compared to a high quality vodka.

For interests sake I threw my birdwatchers distillate back through the carbon last night, and I just checked it before comming in for lunch. It hasn't changed it one bit, the taste/odor is still there.

Weird really, the birdwatchers was definatly cleaner than the turbo at 94% straight out of the still after one run, and even after dillution to 40%. Yet after going thru the carbon the turbo stuff seems noticibly cleaner (emphasis on seems at this stage!) .

I certainly take on board what you say though about single runs not being the norm for neutral, and that a second run on both may well change those results around completely.

Even though I don't think I went too far wrong with the actual recipe, I may chuck another BW wash down exactly as you have outlined just to be sure. One thing I am wondering about is that none of my washes ever ferment out as fast (including the turbos) as what they are stated to. They all ferment out to .990 or better, but all take longer that what others are claiming. For example my BW took 12days, and I currently have one of rads all bran wash which was pretty well followed to the T, has been sitting at 26deg solid, but is only just dropping past .995 now after a week even though it was started at quite a lowish SG.

I'm not complaining about the time frames, just noticing they are considerably longer that what others are stating. This makes me wonder about my water? (rain water)

cheers

gavin

[Samohon]

That is very helpful, especially the direct comparison between the turbo and the BW. Although the milk kinda throws a variable in there! What was the reason for the milk?

Ukrainians and Russians are limited to what is at hand, turbos, lalvins and other yeast strains are just too damn expensive there.
My father-in-law used water, sugar, bakers yeast and unsalted tomato juice. He used a Pot still to strip the wash and the same potstill to do a spirit run adding milk to the low wines. I had tasted his vodka without the milk being added and with the milk being added and there was a remarkable difference in the overall quality I tasted with the milk. He told me that when he added milk, the impurities were more noticable and the cuts, more definable. Hav'nt tried it myself as my VM really is very easy to drive...

The "little something there" that you mention is I suspect what I'm noting in my turbo results, clean but not spotless when compared to a high quality vodka.

Turbo's are engineered with a concentration on added nutrients. As we are using tomato paste for nutrients and then adding a yeast that has had the nutrients added already, could be detrimental to the yeast having too much nutients and causing it to leach those bad smells and tastes into the finished spirit. Certainly somthing I'am going to research...

I certainly take on board what you say though about single runs not being the norm for neutral, and that a second run on both may well change those results around completely.

I think that stripping is the only way to go if you want a very clean +90%, it has an added bonus of condensing your washes to low wines and these can be run anytime you like. Months from now if you wanted to. This is not to say that an excellent vodka cannot be produced from a wash put through a single run on a reflux still, I believe it can be done, but I would think IMHO, that stripping is by far the way to go here...

I'm not complaining about the time frames, just noticing they are considerably longer that what others are stating. This makes me wonder about my water? (rain water)

I think water is a major factor here, ph levels, acidity, hardness, ect; I think further investigation is needed here gavin. A lot of members have had great success with BW's recipe, me included, but water differs throughout to world and could be a contributor to your long ferments. One thing to note here is that if a batch is fermenting a bit slower, then this can significantly produce a better finished result. Turbos are engineered to give you a faster ferment with a higher abv therefore straining the yeast culture used. I get about 13% abv on my BW batches and am quite happy with that, straining the yeast to give you more abv just comes back to bite you once your stilling the wash. Again just my opinion...

Hope this helps gavin... Sorry if there's any typo's, it's late here...

[maritime]

it's strange you had some flovor carry over with a BW wash.
i run a 5 gallong BW wash in my boka. every time i get the same finished product. right out of the still, the distilate has a strong sweet note. i let it air for two days, cleans right up. it always has a slight sweet note, but that lessens with age.
i do a single run in my boka. i have always landed at 94%-94.5% ABV. the foreshot is always the same, heads always the same. i do get between 1100ml-1400ml of clean, then the tails are 300ml-600ml.
not sure why i get different hearts. could be the temps that the yeast like better. i ferment in the shed, warm days it runs faster. but maybe on the 1400ml bactches, it is just right temp for the yeast.

i have another brewing now. first wash i tried, can't see a reason to try anything else.

[Samohon]

+1 on the sweet note maritime, I just air it for a few days, really does give you a nice drop of voddy...

[gavin]

it's strange you had some flovor carry over with a BW wash.
i run a 5 gallong BW wash in my boka. every time i get the same finished product. right out of the still, the distilate has a strong sweet note. i let it air for two days, cleans right up. it always has a slight sweet note, but that lessens with age.
i do a single run in my boka. i have always landed at 94%-94.5% ABV. the foreshot is always the same, heads always the same. i do get between 1100ml-1400ml of clean, then the tails are 300ml-600ml.
not sure why i get different hearts. could be the temps that the yeast like better. i ferment in the shed, warm days it runs faster. but maybe on the 1400ml bactches, it is just right temp for the yeast.

I have another brewing now. first wash i tried, can't see a reason to try anything else.

Yeah, I'm not sure what is going on. I actually took some of this around to my vodka drinking scientist mate yesterday to let him have a compare between the turbo distillate and the BW. He couldn't detect much in the way of smells as he was a bit blocked up. But without knowing which was which he also picked up the BW as not being as smooth to drink, which was the same as what everyone else (only 2 + myself) has said so far.

The slight smell could be described as sweet or sugary I guess. I'ts not a really off smell, just something that is not there to the same extent in the turbo distillate after carbon filtering (even though the turbo stuff was more estery smelling before filtering), and its certainly not in any of the high quality vodkas I have tried.

I will probably end up putting another BW down just to make sure I didn't muck anything up, and then possibly chuck it though on a second run as well. At the moment though I have one of the allbran washes clearing out so I'm really interested to see how that goes on a single run first.

cheers

gavin

[Samohon]

Interesting gavin, keep us posted ma...

[beerbaron]

Hi … I have a question on the birdwatchers recipe .

I did one 23L batch of birdwatchers wash. The wash temp was around 26 to 27c during the fermentation. The initial sg was 1.090. I let it ferment for 10 day’s and now the sg is 1.002.

Is the fermentation complete? According to the recipe my final sg should be 0.995.

If the fermentation is complete, do I have to transfer to a carboyd and let it sit for a few weeks to clarify? Do I have to add a clarifying agent? When it’s clarified will it be clear just like water?

[birdwatcher]

Hi,

Later posts by myself and others have suggested a better starting point is around SG 1.07 otherwise you are fine. I would consider your wash finished.

It does not have to be clear, nor do you add any clearing agents. Let it settle for a day and into your still.

Good luck and have a good day.

G

[marc83]

On a 25L batch,5kg sugar,and starting SG of 1070,5 days sees it ferment out to 0980.Then i rack into a spare fermenter,then its a week before i put it into the still.no worries.

[maritime]

just ran off another batch tonight. sometimes, when i can't count to 5, i get 6 gallons in the wash. i have noticed a get a bigger return when i go 6 gallons, with the same ingredients. not exactly sure why, guess the yeast has a little more elbow room to work??
i got the following;
100ml foreshot
100ml head
1650ml heart
400ml tails
this is the biggest return i ever got. i normally peak at 1400ml on a 6 gallon wash. i think the weather must of been perfect for the yeast. i ferment in the shed.

so, all else being equal, just the extra gallon gets you more heart. at the expense of a little more energy to boil the larger batch. is the extra +-400ml worth the energy? not sure.

[clacker]

My first Birdwatcher wash has been running for 1 hour now and gotta say I'm pretty happy with the head!

My ingredients were:

25L level (after all ingredients) - 31C temp 1.06SG
4KG sugar
1 tsp epson salts
50ml lemon juice
250gm tomato paste
75gm lowan bakers yeast (expired MAY 09)

I took a risk with the yeast but when I measured the remainder in the tin and it was the same as an ealier 25L wash... I took it as a sign from the spirits

Fingers crossed it keeps it up!

Thanks BW and to all the others that provided the info!




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[birdwatcher]

Hi Clacker,

It looks pretty good to me. Keep it loosely covered.

Cheers,

G

[Uisge_a_Ghlinne]

A quick question gentlemen (and ladies); has anybody tried to make a wash of over 150 litres with Birdwatchers recipe and if so were there any temperature problems? I would like to make a big wash but am concerned that this quantity might generate a bit too much heat. The ambient temperature in the shed at the moment is about 12 Centigrade. Your input is much appreciated.

[Dnderhead]

at 12c you can use the heat, the yeast will only rise the temps a few degrees. you mite even consider insulation.

[clacker]

It's day 6 of my first BW wash and SG is now at 1.00

The smell above the tub is quite sweet and pleasant like I've read here but when I smell my alcometer after it's been dipped..there is quite a strong tomato paste smell to it.

Is this normal?

[birdwatcher]

No problem Pal. Enjoy.

G

[WalkingWolf]

It's day 6 of my first BW wash and SG is now at 1.00

The smell above the tub is quite sweet and pleasant like I've read here but when I smell my alcometer after it's been dipped..there is quite a strong tomato paste smell to it.

Is this normal?

I found the early heads smelled like balsamic vinegar. Smell didn't carry to the hearts.

[clacker]

Thanks guys... so happy to leave the turbos behind.

Can't wait to taste!

['SideWinder']

Hey Fellas.

First off... Thx BW for the recipe!

I've got a 25L batch fermenting as we speak! It's been going since Sunday, bubbling has slowed down tho, I haven't checked gravity at all.. I've got plenty of time on hand. I've got about 4L of alcohol waiting to be used
I've had done 2x triple distilled turbos, then 2x All-Bran and now my first BW.
I need either a bigger fermenter or more fermenters I love this new hobby!! My GF isn't too keen because I leave the Fermenters in our bedroom bubbling away I didn't use any epsom salts hope this won't affect it apart from time. I'm trying to find a cheap/good quality recipe. I've only got a 4L Pot Still so takes a few runs but that's fine by me.

[birdwatcher]

Guten tag,

Get yourself a hygrometer to check SG at start, during and at the end. This is important. A pinch of epsom salts just helps the process.

Good luck.

G

[8-ball]

hey birdwatcher do i have to strip with a pot still or will it work out ok with just a reflux still, i went the fools way and purchased a turbo500 still ??
this will be my first non turbo wash and am looking forward to it

['SideWinder']

Guten tag,

Get yourself a hygrometer to check SG at start, during and at the end. This is important. A pinch of epsom salts just helps the process.

Good luck.

G

Hallo

I have a hydrometer, I wasn't too sure if It was accurate. I had a SG reading of 1.060 from memory which should give a potential 10% abv. The reason I'm not sure if it's accurate is because on the meter it says calibrated to 20C, when I checked the SG it was sitting on 40+C, I sprinkled the yeast once it dropped to ~30C. I haven't checked during because it was bubbling nicely. It looks like it's about stopped so I will check the reading when I get home from work.

Do you mean epsom salts speed up the process? I've never used epsom salts before.

Regards

Ron

[birdwatcher]

Hi D,

E. salts seems to assist a quick start at the beginning.
Otherwise you are on the right track'

Enjoy,

G

[still crazy]

Just add water

[birdwatcher]

You forgot the Epsom Salts.

Cheers

G

[still crazy]

I have never used them bird
Whats the advantage?

My wash looks like this 4 hours after pitching yeast

[birdwatcher]

Looks perfect. Epsom salts; I read it on this forum. Maybe just my imagination, but it seemed to stimulate activity at the beginning. We're talking 1/4 tsp. in an 80 liter wash in my case.

Have a good day.

G

[gwgw45]

hey birdwatcher do i have to strip with a pot still or will it work out ok with just a reflux still, i went the fools way and purchased a turbo500 still ??
this will be my first non turbo wash and am looking forward to it

Hi all, I am new around here, but wanted to say thanks for all the contributions that make this site such a good reference. Birdwatcher, your recipe and its obvious efficiency has inspired me. Thank you for sharing it and offering the ongoing support and the time doing so. I am so keen to sample a "real" wash but can't.

I am in the same situation as 8 ball and would dearly like to know the answer before I kick off my first Birdwatcher brew. My concern is that putting the wash straight into the Turbo 500 would cause problems because it had not been cleaned up by being run through a pot still first. If my concerns are valid, would using a clearing agent (finnings, carbon, Turbo Clear,etc) solve the problem?

Sorry to ask such a basic question but I have scoured this thread and many of the others and cannot find the answer

Thanks
Gareth

Edit: Of course, if anyone else feels able to answer the question I would be very appreciative

[birdwatcher]

Buy this book, it explains all. http://www.gin-vodka.com/making-gin.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

Build or have someone that you can trust build your stills. You're missing out on the one of the pleasures of this wonderful hobby.

I have no idea of the workings of your still, but I presume it is a reflux still. I presume you have to convert it to a pot still by removing the copper/stainless steel scrubbers from the column. Run your wash through, then replace scrubbers and follow the instructions that came with the still.

Someone on this site that owns a Turbo500 will assist you with this.

Good luck and keep us posted.

G