enhancing your grain whiskey.

[aceswired]

I posted the same thought a few months ago. I decided that macerating the low wines is the way to go. A tablespoon of chocolate rye per liter seems to spice up the finished product nicely.

[aceswired]

Here's some earlier discussion

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 1#p7254651

[still_stirrin]

aceswired,

Any feedback, since you're experienced?
How much to use...
How long to soak...
Flavor improvements or degradation...
Protein haze...
Tips to watch out for...
Tips to try...

Fill us in with your knowledge gained.
ss

[Davel]

This is an interesting thread. I'm just getting going on a series of rye bread sugar wash thanks to Odin's thread and by the sound of it should have lots of flavour however I can imagine trying this using some flaked rye or a flaked rye crystal / malt combination.

It's good to know other experiences with the quantity and duration please keep the info coming.

[yakattack]

Aces- I'm glad I'm not the only crazy one to try this lol.

One thing discussed in the previous thread is the issues of the cloudy/ hazy issue due to the release of starches. I haven't personally had an issue with this but as I ha e stated, I keep mine at 50 to 55 % abv and don't cut it so it doesn't get a chance to go hazy. I have some bottled at home, I will cut a small amount back to 40 to see if it goes cloudy. If it does then we will know that the etho is pulling starches out and at what abv they go cloudy.

That being said. If the alcohol pulls starches out that easily, it begs the question about putting some high test in with the grain when cooking, or even using it to soak first. This may help to release more of the starches, and in turn have a quicker/ more efficient cook time for mashing. A use for heads if I ever heard one. And since its going to be in the mash your going to have to make sure that its heavily diluted at the end so as to not inhibit the yeast.

This is all just a rambling theory at the moment.

Yak

[aceswired]

I did a few finished jars with cracked corn and was displeased. It did get cloudy on me and the drop felt dirtied (for lack of a better word).

So started macerating my low wines. So far I've done corn and rye, with encouraging results (entirely subjective). I plan to try peated barley in the near future.

Also kicking around the idea of simmering some diluted low wines with grain for a few hours, trying to encourage more interaction between the ethanol and flavor molucules.

[still_stirrin]

....did get cloudy on me and the drop felt dirtied....

Starch.

...kicking around the idea of simmering some diluted low wines with grain for a few hours....

Uhhhh, won't that boil off your alcohol?

I'd suggest soaking the grains, possibly in the fridge to avoid evaporation. Time variable...test it.
ss

[aceswired]

Well below a boil. Maybe simmer is the wrong word. I'm talking about an hour or two at 150, 160. Might lose some, but not a ton. High enough to get the esters and ethanol dancing, but not a boil.

[rnw349]

Yak,
this is very interesting to me. I have some 9th gen ujssm, white, at 55%, I just put 56 cc cracked corn in a pint. The likker itself is about 2 weeks old. I'm going to let the corn set for the 4 hrs, as per your experiment. I will post results later.
Thanks for starting this thread.

[rnw349]

Question,
Has anyone tried this with oats, like the Quaker 3 minute kind??? I might try this in a pint of the same Ujssm.
Just thinking out loud.
Thanks

[still_stirrin]

rnw,
Quaker oats are rolled (gelatinized) and I'd really be afraid they'll haze your product. Unless you're going to rerun it, or planning to. You could try it with a little product to see.

I have only soaked with crystal malt barley. It was a high kiln temperature crystal and it has imparted a ton of color and a very big toffee flavor. Its even a little "roasty" like it was charred. But corn will give a completely different flavor.

My caution would be to start with a little for a short duration and experiment up from there. If you go too far, then you'll have to rerun it. I even think soaking the low wines might be more elegant (and easier to control).
ss

[rnw349]

Well I am trying both as prescribed in a pint jar. The corn is hazy right now, the oats are clear. Been down for about an hour. I will wait until 2 hours and test the flavor.
Keep you advised.

[rnw349]

Have you tried nuking it? I know some like it on wood. Just a thought.

[still_stirrin]

Great. Keep us posted.
ss

[rnw349]

Ok, after 3 hours the corn was quite good, although it was hazy from the residue. I filtered it through coffee filters and it was just kind of yellow then. But good flavor.
Next was the oats, they parted a sweetness to it that was pretty good I thought. So I am going to let it soak some more. Tomorrow I will pull it off.

Keep ya advised

[rnw349]

I tasted at 5 hrs. The oats were starting to turn astringent so I pulled it. It actually was clearer than the corn was, still had good flavor but the sweetness was almost gone. Should have pulled it at 3 hours instead.

For my tastes I will drink either one. But the oats were better earlier on rather than later. I don't mind the cloudiness as I know what it's from, but I probly won't be handing any of these 2 jars out. I could see doing this prior to a spirit run though. That would get rid of the cloudiness and still have great taste.

So overall I give it a thumbs up. I learned something out of it, and wouldn't mind trying it again sometime.

Thanks.

[rager]

I did this a while back before reading this thread. I made a smoked bourbon using corn/malted wheat/ and cherry wood smoke grain (barley?) . either case I put a small hand full of the CWSG in a half pint jar and topped it off with the white. (don't remember the proof) within a couple hours the white dog had turned in a nice grainy color. definitely brought out the smokiness . I actually let it sit a few days and it got stronger and stronger. I then filtered it and drank it. I think it turned out great. I have yet to make this recipe again but I will probably give it a go again . its adds something nice to a young white dog.


cheers

[still_stirrin]

OK, this thread is aging, but I wanted to follow up with this experiment as the whiskey has aged a little.
This is a shot of the bottled whiskey; notice the color:

image.jpg

The grains used were special B, a caramelized bisquit malt, and the colors came quickly. At first, the flavors were astringent due to the tannin extraction from the husks (brewers, you'd expect this, right?). I wasn't too much a fan of the way the flavor changed when the grain was added. But after only a short soaking, I removed the grains. I then continued to age the whiskey in the cask (I use glass with an oak stick).

Now, 30 days later I wanted to bottle some (to drink), so I tempered back to 90 proof and filtered a couple of times through coffee filters. It took a couple of passes because the grain soaking liberated some fine particulate that always seemed to settle in the jar. Anyway, it looks better when clear.

The flavors of the special B impart a touch of sweetness (crystal malts, right?) and some toffee notes as well. The wood flavors are there, but the grains flavors are much more present. The guest tasters I had sample it all say they like the rich grain flavors in the whiskey. And they also say the whiskey flavors are still evident.

I have only experimented with this one grain to date. I would suppose that using corn would boost that flavor constituent as well for those who desire big corn flavor in their whiskeys.

All-in-all, it was a great learning experiment. I think (my) jury is still out as to whether or not I'll do it again. This time I had the ingredients at hand when the proposed experiment surfaced. No damage done...and the whiskey is very unique.

Thanks Yak, for the suggestion.
ss

[nerdybrewer]

I plan to try peated barley in the near future.

Has anyone done this yet? I'm very interested in the outcome.

[Jimbo]

I plan to try peated barley in the near future.

Has anyone done this yet? I'm very interested in the outcome.

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 0#p7295054

[nerdybrewer]

oops Jimbo, that's what happens when you only read the last page of a thread! Thanks for pointing it out.

[yakattack]

Ss- glad it worked out well for you. Love the pic, and even the packaging.

I must say I appreciate the effort put into it. It gives one a little sense of ; and you'll forgive my use of an expression (colloquialism?)! "Yippee" having someone completely independent replicate the results of an experiment with favorable results.

I have yet to get the crystal malts as that is one I want to try.

Also on my list is maccidania nuts.

Yak

[StillLearning1]

So I'm reading through this thread and I'm wondering if this could be done to flavor water for a thumper charge? Anyone ever tried that? Seems like a good idea in my brain at least....

[yakattack]

So I'm reading through this thread and I'm wondering if this could be done to flavor water for a thumper charge? Anyone ever tried that? Seems like a good idea in my brain at least....

Simmer grains in pot with water to extract flavour for thumper. Or just out some grains in a bag in the thumper.

Haven't tried it yet myself (no thumper now)

Yak

[Usge]

Years ago I did a similar experiment. I used a flower vase (very open at the top) put some whitedog in it and I put just small amount of 2 row malt (not crushed) in it. I sipped/tasted it a little while later (dont' remember how long) and it tasted very good!! So, I left it overnight. By the following day it was very astringent. So, yes...if you do this type of grain maceration....make sure you taste it often and pull it off early..ie., as soon as you can clearly detect the influence of the flavor/grain. I can't give you a time because I'm sure it would vary based upon far too many variables (type of grain, amount, etc). When it starts to turn dry/astringent...too long. Make note of the amount/time, etc...and then you'll have a better guide for next time.

I've often put corn into my thumper. Corn juice. Spent corn from UJSM. Canned corn. A corn cob or two. Just be careful you don't clog up your downtube.

[bitter]

Nice I really like this trick! Going to try it when I have some product.

B

[Davel]

Well, I had done a run of Odin's Rye bread rye and thought It would be a good contender to try flavouring with some crystal malt.

I put in about a tablespoon in 1500ml of 75%, left it for 2 - 1/2 hours and am happy with it. There is quite a lot of change in the body of the drink and a nice subtle malt / grain flavour.

Definitely something I'll do again....maybe try some of that Special B malt mentioned earlier in this thread

Dave