Interesting paper on Unmalted barley and enzymes.

[Fart Vader]

Very technical paper, but overall I think an interesting read while waiting for the boiler to come up to temperature.

From what I understood, 100% unmalted barley can be done successfully using enzymes.
It also appears that a ratio of 60% unmalted to 40% malted is the optimum ratio without enzymes.

I picked up a 55lb sack of unmalted barley this weekend for $11.
I'll be giving it a try with the enzymes soon.

[MichiganCornhusker]

Interesting paper.
I haven't read through it all, but looking at one of the graphs, it seems to show a great increase in filterability with the addition of as little as 15% malted barley to raw barley.
I've done a straight unmalted barley mash before, and it was one slimey mess for sure. Maybe by just adding a small amount of malt that could be avoided.
Thanks for posting, looking forward to taking a little more time to read through it more closely.

[moosemilk]

Tried a bunch of grains unmalted. Sure you can do them, but the only one that comes out of the still worth drinking (so far) is corn. Anything else seems to need a bit of malt for the flavor. The 100% unmalted barley I did I ended up tossing the low wines back in with a run from a corn and heavy rye malt. Unmalted seems to be lacking something.

[Fart Vader]

Tried a bunch of grains unmalted. Sure you can do them, but the only one that comes out of the still worth drinking (so far) is corn. Anything else seems to need a bit of malt for the flavor. The 100% unmalted barley I did I ended up tossing the low wines back in with a run from a corn and heavy rye malt. Unmalted seems to be lacking something.

That's the part that I've been wondering about, flavor.
Did you use enzymes?

[moosemilk]

Tried a bunch of grains unmalted. Sure you can do them, but the only one that comes out of the still worth drinking (so far) is corn. Anything else seems to need a bit of malt for the flavor. The 100% unmalted barley I did I ended up tossing the low wines back in with a run from a corn and heavy rye malt. Unmalted seems to be lacking something.

That's the part that I've been wondering about, flavor.
Did you use enzymes?

Yes, with enzymes. I started a thread using enzymes to reduce the amount of malt needed. Haven't had much time for experiments, but thinking of reviving.

http://ww.homedistiller.org/forum/viewt ... 11&t=53796" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[bentstick]

I use enzymes for conversion and malted grains for taste and added Xtra conversion or vice versa,in short use both now!

[moosemilk]

I use enzymes for conversion and malted grains for taste and added Xtra conversion or vice versa,in short use both now!

+1 likewise. Still get flavor from malts, but don't have to use as much

[Fart Vader]

Cool, you guys are saving me some experimentation time. What ratios have worked for you?
Something like 10% malt for flavor plus 90% unmalted?

Inquiring minds want to know.

P.S. just been reading up on your thread moose, I read it a few months back but got lost in in all the reading I've been doing. Typical newbie. Oh look something shiny, let's go there. Oh a butterfly, let's follow the butterfly... I think you you know where I'm going with this.

[thecroweater]

If you only use enzymes it will be insiped as, great for neutral but dissapointing as a whiskey, how much to use depends on how much malt flavour ya want. I would say not less than 10% for a very light whiskey and 20% or more for normal average whiskey profile

[moosemilk]

I usually do the booner's recipe for corn, but sometimes like to add a little malt to change the flavor. Malts for me are very expensive (I have had some success with malting barley from the feed store though). So I resort to enzymes. I'm using anywhere from 5-10% of my grain bill as malts, substituting for corn in the booners. I like the flavor. The corn tends to lose some flavor but leave behind a sweetness, and using rye or barley malt, even in just small amounts, keeps a little flavor in there. It's about preference and what you like. Also the use of enzymes allows me to cook the malts with my corn, and I haven't had an infection yet (A mild lacto once, but i think that was from checking on the gravity with a thief i hadn't sanitized).

[HDNB]

i took moose's experiment and ran with it, using cob unmalted and 2 row malt barley in the following proportion of total grain bill.
imho:
0% thin, lacking.
5% makes a noticable taste difference over no malt.
10% is nice light whiskey
15% hits a real sweet spot for me
20% is full bodied
25% is no noticable difference over using malt for full conversion (say 40% without doing math) so...saving 15% malt on the overall grain bill.
i used the same heat protocol and same doses of seb ht and seb gl for all batches regardless of malt%

[moosemilk]

HDNB makes a damn good COB i'd like to add.

Still have a few ounces left, and it just gets better every day! BTW HDNB, it has developed a very nice caramel nose to it now and holds it in flavor as well, along with fantastic grainy notes. That one is a winner for sure!

[Fart Vader]

Great feedbck. I'm going to fire up my new steam wand this weekend and try out the Booner's with 10% barley and 10% rye. I'm also going to try two batches as a yeast experiment. 1 batch with red star bakers and one batch with us-05.