How good is the product.

[Anyhowe]

I brew beer because I can make it as good or better than I can buy. I don’t make wine because I can’t accomplish that

Recently started distilling with several runs done, testing out mashes and techniques. Sitting back with a dram I got to wondering...

I have three go-to’s at the moment. And these change over time.

1) Kirkland’s Speyside 20
2) Ardbeg 10
3) Redbreast 12 cask strength

All of these, to my palette are quite enjoyable. Is it possible to make a comparably good product on the home front?

Thanks for your thoughts. .

[nerdybrewer]

I'll take a stab and responding to your question.

Yes...

If you are patient, have an insatiable drive to learn and can deal with the disappointment that inevitably comes from learning.
To learn we have to fail, failure is a result and it's an important one.
The critical thing is learning from failure so that success eventually happens.

Your list has some things that are aged a long time, by very skilled artists.
Become that.

[acfixer69]

There is no way you will replicate a brand. Way too many variables in involved ambient temperature for ageing, humidity, coopers choices. What do you think of the dram you are sippin? You make to your liking.

[HDNB]

There is no way you will replicate a brand. Way too many variables in involved ambient temperature for ageing, humidity, coopers choices. What do you think of the dram you are sippin? You make to your liking.

+1 replication is not a goal.

quality, no problem...flavour profile is subjective as hell. you can likely make something equallyor even more enjoyable but totally different.

[Anyhowe]

Not trying to replicate (but damn ... if we only could). Just asking if producing this level of quality is reasonably achievable. Fwiw I am fully prepared to drink my fill of ‘failures’. Lol. I guess that is why they invented soda and other mixers.

[Twisted Brick]

I'll take a stab and responding to your question.

Yes...

If you are patient, have an insatiable drive to learn and can deal with the disappointment that inevitably comes from learning.
To learn we have to fail, failure is a result and it's an important one.
The critical thing is learning from failure so that success eventually happens.

Your list has some things that are aged a long time, by very skilled artists.
Become that.

+1

Yeah, it takes time and attention to detail. But, after parlaying prior AG brewing experience into distilling, my first AG rye bourbon was very drinkable (and then some) and promised of good things to come.

And yes, replication is next to impossible, but the more you can sample commercial products, the more you can define what you like and can start heading that direction in your mash bills. The rest will come with practice.

[Anyhowe]

I'll take a stab and responding to your question.

Yes...

If you are patient, have an insatiable drive to learn and can deal with the disappointment that inevitably comes from learning.
To learn we have to fail, failure is a result and it's an important one.
The critical thing is learning from failure so that success eventually happens.

Your list has some things that are aged a long time, by very skilled artists.
Become that.

+1

Yeah, it takes time and attention to detail. But, after parlaying prior AG brewing experience into distilling, my first AG rye bourbon was very drinkable (and then some) and promised of good things to come.

And yes, replication is next to impossible, but the more you can sample commercial products, the more you can define what you like and can start heading that direction in your mash bills. The rest will come with practice.

So far that describes my tact. Lots more sampling is happening. Fortunately I have 30 years of all grain mashing and fermenting under my belt. I am trying to create mash profiles that translate to a distilled spirit I like. Then comes the maturing part of the passion. Truely fun. I am glad the consensus is that a quality product is within reach.

[still_stirrin]

...I brew beer because I can make it as good or better than I can buy...

Can you make a beer that tastes and smells exactly like a high value commercial beer....say, Paulaner Oktoberfest?

Without doubt you can make a very good Oktoberfest...but it will always have your “personality” in it. So, while an excellent product in the style of the paradigm, there will be a difference. Texture, carbonation, malt signature, color, etc., all add to give the beers their signature.

Similarly, your scotch-style product can be produced very elegantly with the single malt character, aged in the styles of the paradigms. But, there will always be your “signature” to it. But fret not....that doesn’t make it less...it makes it “special”, because you made it. It will be just as enjoyable (maybe more so) as any of the high valued examples you mentioned.

Soon, you’ll make the same claim about your whiskey as you have about your beers. It does take time to gain the experience, but the journey to the “land’s end” is just as enjoyable as the snifter-full.
ss

[SaltyStaves]

Beer is (generally) the result of a single brew session, but those single malts you listed are a blend of different casks. Sometimes wildly different from each other, with ages that are many years apart, from different parts of the warehouse, or different warehouses... you get the picture....

Brew often and vary the maturation as much as possible and learn the art of blending and you'll be on your way to happiness.
I'm not saying that single cask single malts can't be wonderful, but I find they are often a singular and more monochromatic experience and don't have the character of a well blended vatting.

[Bushman]

I agree with the comments about duplication but having said that I cannot tell the difference between my Grand Mariner and what you buy over the counter.

[Anyhowe]

Thanks so far everyone. Again, I am NOT looking at replication so no need to keep weighing in on that. Great to hear that excellent quality can be had. That is simply not the case on the wine side, but is quite doable on the beer side. I assume it is related to wine/grape being such a ‘living’ and variable entity throughout its life. The complexities from ground to popping the cork can not be created by the regular home producer. Heck many wine producers can’t make great wine. Lol Again glad to hear it appears to be doable on the stilled side of things with time, humbleness and patience.

[NZChris]

Time and patience yes, humbleness not so much

Research definitely.

[fizzix]

All I have to show in my short time doing this is a 1-year-old char barreled Odin's Cornflake Whiskey.
How do I know it's good? Whoever tries it wants some to take home.

My (Missouri) grain shop encourages distillers to bring their anonymous wares for free customer sampling.
(While a cornflake concoction doesn't push the proprietor's grain so much, it sparks interest in his stills.)
I'm told Odin's Cornflake wows the clientele so much he's had to limit samples and he gets repeated
requests for whole jars.

THAT'S a testimonial.

[nerdybrewer]

I've bought and consumed many bottles of 21+ year old single malt scotch.
One of my early attempts was to make my own.
It came out really well and some here tasted it and found it pleasing.
Since then I've been working on rum, getting it right, takes a lot of practice.
Seems in comparison my single malt was pretty easy.
I have high standards, my rum hasn't yet gotten to the place where I have said "that's it, I've done it"
So I keep trying.
Meanwhile I have to do something with all the rum I'm making!!

[Anyhowe]

@nerdybrewer Ya know I have never been much of a rum drinker. Well except for some mixed drinks while in vacation in sunny warm places. I may have to sample a few quality rums to maybe see what I have been missing. Thanks

[Blackdirt Cowboy]

I, too, came into this hobby from all grain brewing. Why? Because I have champagne taste on a beer budget. I’m sipping on a dram of my first product, a wheated bourbon. Is it the best in the world? Most certainly not. But it is on par with some of the top shelf whiskeys I’ve had and definitely better than the common stuff. I don’t expect every batch I make to turn out like this. There are things that I already know I can improve upon. That being said, if you are meticulous and pay attention to details, you can absolutely make a very high quality product. Same as all grain beer brewing. You just can’t take shortcuts and overlook the details.

[Raize]

As good as your cuts are I suppose.

I let some people try part of the hearts cut from an AG whisky I just made (maybe more heads than hearts, it was the second 300ml jar off the still, around 60% ABV, from a 17.5% 11.5L wash) and got comments like "it's like the best whisky I've ever had".

Then I dumped too many tails into my blend jar (I think the lowest were 35% or so, but they still tasted OK to me, just a bit peaty but that's what I was going for in my style) and now apparently it's disgusting. Oh well. Hopefully oak and time will fix it.

[Anyhowe]

I draw distinction between ‘not good’ and ‘don’t like’.