uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

[Beerswimmer]

I just stripped gen 3 today. One more strip and I'll have enough for a spirit run. I get around 3 gallons of low wines per strip, so I should have 12 gallons plus some dunder to go into the keg for the slow spirit run. I just can't wait to taste the difference between these first 4 gens and the next 4!

[6 Row Joe]

Just wanted to follow up I raised the ph a little 4.2+- temps 82f and my SG 1.002 in 5 days ,! So I wanted to thank BP & SBB for your advice. This reminds me of my first gen, week to run week to clear.

I know that Jesse's recipe didn't call for any nutrients or adding additional yeast, but I can't help think that adding both to this 3rd Gen helped. I'm guessing I have enough of a yeast bed at this point so I don't think I'll be adding any more for gen 4. I read back through some of your recent post Salt B Bill and you managed to keep yours going for 50 gens, so I'm hoping I'm on the right track.

I kind of did the same thing. After gen 3 I haven't added yeast. With a 3 gallon batch, I skim off a Cool Whip container of pale corn, add fresh corn back along with the sugar water , give it a big stirr and the next day it is happily bubbling through the air lock. I am on gen 9 and loving the finished product. This time no backset, I was starting to get a over the top corn smell in the finished product that thankfully filtered out by filtering through carbon. The odor probably came from too much backset. I was adding a gallon to a 3 gallon batch. Sometimes I add a quart of tails and sometimes not. I also do a spirit run every time. About gen 7 I didn't use copper mesh and that really added to the flavor. A little sweet, a little corn, a little bite but no burn. Damn smooth. I have almost a gallon of 80 proof that I would like to save just for sipping. I sneak a quart of hearts every 3rd. run to put on oak.

[MM-Brew]

Good day to all.
I started my first gen of UJSSM this week. I took the backset from the stripping run of th 25l CF (cornflake). That had a SG 1.074. I ran it down to 30% before stopping. I then added 7lb sugar to a little more the 5l of backset. I fill my 25l fermenter to the 5l mark with cracked corn (from TS)(This is how I measure my SF. Its tasty). I added cool water till the 15l mark, next I added the backset with sugar. Topped if off with more cool water to get down to pitching temp. The ph was 3.5 I added a scoop Calcium hydroxide (not sure of the size as i put in the bag when I bought it) then it was close to 4.5 before I added the hyderated distiller yest started with a little yeast nuterant. I added about 1/3 of a cup of crushed oyster shells (from TS). I insulated with a couple heavy blankets and left it to do it thing. It took off in a couple hours. By the morning it smelled amazing. I added the air lock that evening and it started bubbling away before I could recover the bucket and get out of the room.
Question
If my next gen of mash PH is low, what options do I have? How many time can I add Calcium hydroxide before it will /could cause issues? What other opinions can I try to keep the ph in the sweet spot?
I'll admit that Ive not read 1/2 of this 140+ pages thread. If I missed something can you get me close to the page and I'll go looking for it.

[Saltbush Bill]

What other opinions can I try to keep the ph in the sweet spot?

Keep the backset to around 4-5L and just leave it alone to do its thing.
Many people never have to adjust PH in any way and still ferment UJSM very successfully.

[Distillernz]

My first few batches of UJSSM I used Dextrose and it was pretty good. My last few batches I have used raw sugar and the difference has blown me away the raw is far far superior. Thanks Uncle

[Saltbush Bill]

Everything Ive ever read seems to indicate that dextrose is a waste of money when it comes to distilled spirits. Very few use it for very long.

[Beerswimmer]

Just made cuts on a spirit run from the low wines of gen 1-5, kept 5 gallons of 142 proof hearts. No heads or tails. The newbie I was showing was pretty pumped! We'll have plenty of white dog to play with, he's wanting apple pie and white and I'm making a gallon into aquavit and aging the rest on wood. The next 5 gens will be full of flavor and kept on wood for the most part. Such a great way to introduce a new person to the hobby!

Gen 6 has been fermenting for a day already

[sltm1]

6 Row Joe, didn't adding that much backset stall your wash? If so did you add some calcium to help it out?

[6 Row Joe]

No stall and I haven't been checking the ph either.

[6 Row Joe]

6 Row Joe, didn't adding that much backset stall your wash? If so did you add some calcium to help it out?

I just mixed up batch #13. Basically still on the original yeast and a little of the corn. I added a half gallon of backset for a 3 gallon batch. The PH was 5.0 and the sg was 1.074. It will be bubbling away happily late tomorrow I am sure.

[Beerswimmer]

I just stripped gen 7 today, and now have enough low wines and feints to do another spirit run. There will be room for about 4 gallons of either new wash, or dunder to add for some more flavor. What should I use??

[jackpinesavage]

I am on my second fermentation and will have time to strip run this one when it's ready. I have to leave town for about ten days and would like to hold it over until I return. What is the best way to do this if it's possible
JPS

[nuncaquite]

I am on my second fermentation and will have time to strip run this one when it's ready. I have to leave town for about ten days and would like to hold it over until I return. What is the best way to do this if it's possible
JPS

Ok, Ill bite. What would you like to hold over until your return? The strip run will hold for maybe infinity give or take a few millennium. If you do the strip run and you are worried about your ''UJ sour corn stock" Then just add 7-8lbs of sugar to it and fill the rest of the bucket with water and some backset. It will be waiting on your return.

[jackpinesavage]

Yes, I was worried about the stock. Thanks for the advice !

[BillyPrefect]

I don't see a place to just chat about stuff, so I'm posting here.
I've got generation 11 fermenting in a pair of buckets and am sipping on what I've labelled on the jars as "Gen 'X'" - and I really actually like the stuff.
As I sip on this I keep reading on how to transition to an AG ferment. I'm betting it's fantastic, but I just don't know if the whole boiling, cooking, mashing is in my wheel house.

[tjans]

I don't see a place to just chat about stuff, so I'm posting here.
I've got generation 11 fermenting in a pair of buckets and am sipping on what I've labelled on the jars as "Gen 'X'" - and I really actually like the stuff.
As I sip on this I keep reading on how to transition to an AG ferment. I'm betting it's fantastic, but I just don't know if the whole boiling, cooking, mashing is in my wheel house.

Billy, I'm a homebrewer (completely new to distilling) but I thought I'd offer my advice not to be scared of all grain mashing. It's really not as difficult as you think, and honestly there are methods that allow you to produce really high quality wort without having to buy a ton of equipment. I've brewed some award winning beers using the brew in a bag method before building my mash tun and upgrading to a 10 gallon brew system and it is dead simple. Give it a go!

making the UJSSM

I have a few questions regarding this process. One, it seems like with each generation you make, you're essentially doing a stripping run and collecting low wines which presumably you dump together in a larger container. Then, after you've gotten your desired number of generations, you do a single spirit run with all of the combined low wines from each generation. Have I got it right?

Also, the original instructions say to collect from 80% down to 70%. That's a low amount of distilliate, guessing you cut the foreshots as mentioned, keep the 80-70 cut of hearts, and the rest goes into the next stripping run? In the end, you'll have a few different containers active:

• A mash tun (plastic bucket or something)
• Your container of low wines from whatever generations you've stripped
• A container with the feints (70% - 20%~ of your stripping runs)

Do I have the idea nailed down?

[BillyPrefect]

Close.
I run a pair of buckets. Strip each bucket and throw that together to spirit run it. 2 buckets stripped runs gets me a little over 2 gallons, together gets me 4 to 4.5 gallons I guess. I add a bit of water to ensure I don't run my element dry. So the spirit run to me is: toss out 400mL for fores, run a bit down to clear the heads (smell really).
I jar up small amounts after a decent amount of heads in case anything around 80 is good to keep. Then I will typically get 2 or so litres of hearts. As soon as I smell tails it all goes into a bucket for next run, down to 30 or until I panic about running dry.
The following run is 2 buckets of course, first bucket gets half of the feints (heads/tails), second bucket the other half of the feints. Combine and repeat. Also I use about 1.5 gallons of backset to melt the sugar to build up the next run. It becomes a routine once you get the hang of it. Keeping 80 down to 70 is fine as I get around 2 gallons per week this way. Even pulling lots to try to make things like apple pie, lemon drop, cherry surprise, I still end up with jars of stuff from weeks ago while filling jars from yesterday. That's just how I do it. I could be doing it wrong, but it's work so far.

[tjans]

Awesome. I'm gonna try to go by book for first few runs, then maybe try your method. Very excited for this.

[NZChris]

I do a generation or three then, when I'm happy with how it's going, quadruple/triple the next generation so that each subsequent generation provides enough low wines for a spirit run. This method is a lot quicker if you want to fill a barrel, each weekend of hard out stilling producing a substantial quantity of likker ready for aging.

[Budapest8485]

Getting ready to start this and had a few thoughts:

1. The advice of adding all the product (feints) from the first batch/run to the second run makes sense...but if full flavor is waiting for the 3-4 generation, why not hold it until then and end with more product? Maybe split it between generations 3 and 4? Maybe it waters down the flavor?

2. When the backsets are hot, it'll kill the yeast in the sour mash. If I do this and just add more yeast after it cools...problem? I can do less stirring this way to dissolve the sugar and cook the mash some which I understand is a good thing. Other than perhaps the live culture/starter will take off faster than a new starter?

3. If I used my reflux bokabob with no packing and the valve wide open, am I going to miss out on much? I haven't built a pot head for my boiler yet... I'll have to wait to get this started if I need a pot head.

[tjans]

Getting ready to start this and had a few thoughts:
2. When the backsets are hot, it'll kill the yeast in the sour mash. If I do this and just add more yeast after it cools...problem? I can do less stirring this way to dissolve the sugar and cook the mash some which I understand is a good thing. Other than perhaps the live culture/starter will take off faster than a new starter?

From what I've read, you add the sugar to the backset first and then cool it down before adding back to the sour mash. Check out Jesse's (not uncle jesse) videos (YouTube channel: Still It) where he goes through a generation or two of UJSSM. The guy is fantastic.

[Budapest8485]

Getting ready to start this and had a few thoughts:
2. When the backsets are hot, it'll kill the yeast in the sour mash. If I do this and just add more yeast after it cools...problem? I can do less stirring this way to dissolve the sugar and cook the mash some which I understand is a good thing. Other than perhaps the live culture/starter will take off faster than a new starter?

From what I've read, you add the sugar to the backset first and then cool it down before adding back to the sour mash. Check out Jesse's (not uncle jesse) videos (YouTube channel: Still It) where he goes through a generation or two of UJSSM. The guy is fantastic.

Yeah, I watched. I'll admit the laugh bugs me some... I just wonder if cooking the corn some with the backset has it's advantage. Maybe I'll do a double batch and see how it turns out...one with hot backset cooking the mash and the other with the old yeast not cooking it. The yeast will eventually mutate if given a chance and some other little bugs my take root...maybe that's what this is about and I'll kill the character cooking the mash each generation.

I prefer ec118 yeast which is a killer strain due to it's aggressive and cooler temp ferment. It's supposed annihilate other "foreign" yeast that move in. I'm not sure if bakers yeast does that same thing.

[Woodybob]

I have a question for any that can answer. I am working my second gen of ujssm, it is done fermenting but I work out of town. I live in Alaska and a large earthquake just hit knocking out my heater in the shop. It December so it's pretty cold. I will not be back to run it for another 2 weeks... will it be ruined?

[BoisBlancBoy]

I have a question for any that can answer. I am working my second gen of ujssm, it is done fermenting but I work out of town. I live in Alaska and a large earthquake just hit knocking out my heater in the shop. It December so it's pretty cold. I will not be back to run it for another 2 weeks... will it be ruined?

Being it’s cold in your shop it will be fine. If you have an airlock on it it could last months.

[Woodybob]

Thank you! Was worried I'd have to start all over

[Budapest8485]

First generation is fermenting away. Wow, no nutrient. Sugar, corn, and yeast. It's a strong ferment.

I need to get my pot still head finished ASAP! Waiting on stuff to arrive, but I feel like I need to have my cleaning runs and everything complete by Sunday at the rate this ferment is going.

Excited to get it rolling!

[Saltbush Bill]

The nutrient requirements are supplied by the grain.

[BlackStrap]

Hey Budapest8485 I understand your excitment, but don't rush things... Take your time make sure you do the vinegar and sacrificial runs and make sure there's no leaks or anything that may creep in there.

Basically speaking that UJSSM will wait on you, so to speak...it's doesn't hurt things any to give it another week or two after fermentation is finished, actually my experience has been that I have a better product letting it set a week, seems to allow things to settle out for a cleaner wash.

Good Luck on setting things up and getting a run it...
BlackStrap

[Budapest8485]

Hey Budapest8485 I understand your excitment, but don't rush things... Take your time make sure you do the vinegar and sacrificial runs and make sure there's no leaks or anything that may creep in there.

Basically speaking that UJSSM will wait on you, so to speak...it's doesn't hurt things any to give it another week or two after fermentation is finished, actually my experience has been that I have a better product letting it set a week, seems to allow things to settle out for a cleaner wash.

Good Luck on setting things up and getting a run it...
BlackStrap

Yep, I know about cleaning it first. I bought a gallon of vinegar tonight and I have about a gallon of 85% ethanol to blend with water for my cleaning run. I can soak it Saturday night, do the sacrificial ethanol run Sunday, and still out the UJSSM the same day if it's ready.

I'll give it a couple days after the bubbling stops to settle out. It's a strong ferment, but I think it'll be mid week before it's finish.

I soldered most of the parts of the pot still tonight. I have a leak in the ferrule that hooks onto my boiler. I was getting tired, so I will wait till tomorrow before trying to correct it. I'm almost done!

[Budapest8485]

Curious... How much corn is enough to do 7 gallons of sugar wash at 9%? Trying to make a neutral spirit to run through a reflux still. The yeast is soooo happy about the nutrient in the corn! I've been making wine for 15 years and only once have I seen air passing through an airlock faster than this. There's a party going on it my fermenter!