Yummy’s Steam generator

[Yummyrum]

Nothing much happening here at the moment , but just been running some numbers .
A couple of inches of water above my element will give me a height of 350mm
So if I use a 3” shell that had 350mm of water in it ( LOL here we go mixing units again ) , that gives me a volume of 1.76 litres in the boiler .

Running that through an online calculator using my 6kW element shows a darn fast time from switch on to boiling at 100% efficiency .
Even at 80% efficiency , it’s way better than I had hoped .

I'd go with the 3" slightly more stability to dampen against the incoming colder water. Yeah the difference in heatup between 2.5" and 3" will probably only be seconds. .25g heated at 6kw should be boiling in about a min.

Bolverk , you were pretty much bang on the money


I am trying to find a calculator that will show the rate of water loss but I’m coming up blank . Lots of brew calculators but can’t seem to find one that tells me what I want to know .

IE , at 6kW , what is the top up flow rate going to be ?

[NormandieStill]

As I understand it from the latent heat of evaporation you can calculate the loss. So given 2260kJ/s for the latent heat of evaporation and your 6kW element I get a loss to evaporation of around 2.65ml/s or 160ml/min.

Assuming that everything is already up to temperature and ignoring any pressure build up.

Disclaimer: I'm not a physicist and while I'm quietly confident of the maths you'll want to confirm those numbers experimentally. Which you could do by using your 6kW element in a keg boiler filled with water and recording the flow rate out of your condenser.

[Yummyrum]

As I understand it from the latent heat of evaporation you can calculate the loss. So given 2260kJ/s for the latent heat of evaporation and your 6kW element I get a loss to evaporation of around 2.65ml/s or 160ml/min.

Assuming that everything is already up to temperature and ignoring any pressure build up.

Disclaimer: I'm not a physicist and while I'm quietly confident of the maths you'll want to confirm those numbers experimentally. Which you could do by using your 6kW element in a keg boiler filled with water and recording the flow rate out of your condenser.

Thanks Normandie .
I never studied thermodynamics so I trust what you say . Your figure does seem quite reasonable though .
You’re right ,the easy way would indeed be to just boil some water with said element .
Alas I need to get my controller built first . I got a 220V element and as our supply voltage is upwards of 245V ATM , I can’t just plug it in and see . My old controller was only good for 3.6kW ish .Still waiting on the cheap freight option from Ali-express to front up .

Anyway , I was just hoping for a ball park figure so I can scale size of solenoid and needle valve . Thankyou .

[kennstminet]

Yummy
You can use this online calculator to play with the numbers.
It is good for pure water as well as for water/ethanol mixtures.
https://hobbybrennen.ch/Rechner/en/Watt ... ntity.html

[Yummyrum]

Yummy
You can use this online calculator to play with the numbers.
It is good for pure water as well as for water/ethanol mixtures.
https://hobbybrennen.ch/Rechner/en/Watt ... ntity.html

Thanks kennstminet
Very useful
And it gives same answer as Normandie

[Bolverk]

https://hobbybrennen.ch/Rechner/en/Watt ... ntity.html

Thanks for this

[NormandieStill]

Thanks kennstminet
Very useful
And it gives same answer as Normandie

Yeah that was quite reassuring actually.

[bluc]

I have a working continuous stripper, unfortunately my continuous steam generator does not. If of any use I have 3.6kw element in a 2" tube with a continuous flow to recycle but it does not have enough input power to run in this config. If I choke the input till a tiny occasional trickle overflow and let it run like this I distilled 1.5l in about 25mins. But am always within a sec of a blown element the boil is very aggressive and the amount of water inside a 2" tube is not huge, minus the space for the element left with very little water. But then after 25ish mins my boil chamber keeps blowing everything out the overflow. Then I need to flood element to avoid it blowing. It's not good at all.
Going back to a 50l keg as a dedicated steam boiler.
For now.

[Bolverk]

I have a working continuous stripper, unfortunately my continuous steam generator does not. If of any use I have 3.6kw element in a 2" tube with a continuous flow to recycle but it does not have enough input power to run in this config. If I choke the input till a tiny occasional trickle overflow and let it run like this I distilled 1.5l in about 25mins. But am always within a sec of a blown element the boil is very aggressive and the amount of water inside a 2" tube is not huge, minus the space for the element left with very little water. But then after 25ish mins my boil chamber keeps blowing everything out the overflow. Then I need to flood element to avoid it blowing. It's not good at all.
Going back to a 50l keg as a dedicated steam boiler.
For now.

I've experienced this as well in my trials
here viewtopic.php?t=92012
and found i needed a larger diameter tube to promote more water for circulation around the element. I don't want to detract from Yummys thread. Start a new conversation and let's talk through this.

[Yummyrum]

Glad you piped up Bolverk

Bluc has had a topic running on Australian Home Distiller Forum ( former CCSC) https://australianhomedistiller.com.au/ ... 50#p109753

I linked to your topic here .

Happy to have blucs problems discussed here or bluc , start your own topic for sure . Looks like guys are here to help you .

[Bolverk]

Thanks for that Yummy

Bluc, So are you still having feed issues or is that now worked out?

AndyNZ feed idea is the simplest design I've seen. If/when I needed to do this again I'd absolutely go this route. My analog float is not quite as simple, but it's pretty dummy proof as long as you can maintain 10 psi in the feed line (easy to do with high break check valve).

You mentioned in that other thread going up to a 6" for the boiler, I can tell you running my setup at 4500w it's been perfectly fine in a 4". I know a pro running 4 12kw in a 12" tube so all things being equal a 4" should be fine up to around 12kw (possibly more). Although I cant think of any reason a home distiller would need that much power.

[zach]

But am always within a sec of a blown element the boil is very aggressive

There was a good thread on level control probes that can be used to cut power on low level .

viewtopic.php?t=93938

These relays / electrodes could also be used to control a water make up solenoid to your boiler.

I've seen these probes used in electrically heated steam jacketed kettles to prevent dry fire.

[bluc]

Thanks for the replies. Bolverk I just crammed your generator build last night awesome work.
I think I will eventually copy yours. I built a continuous still for mash and just starting to run it.
For now I'm going to batch generate steam in a 50l keg cheapest option at the moment.
I had the still run stable but only for approx 15mins then the boiler would refill, quench and collapse the steam column. Then would re heat cycle repeats.

[bluc]

Hey Zach was it you that had a keg steam boiler? Is it continuous?

[Bolverk]

Thanks for the replies. Bolverk I just crammed your generator build last night awesome work.
I think I will eventually copy yours. I built a continuous still for mash and just starting to run it.
For now I'm going to batch generate steam in a 50l keg cheapest option at the moment.
I had the still run stable but only for approx 15mins then the boiler would refill, quench and collapse the steam column. Then would re heat cycle repeats.

Thanks, you should see the whole setup now lol

Whatever is easiest, the trials of mine were a pain but it's good now that I sorted it out. At 3.6kw you're only using 96ml of steam per min, decide how long you want you run and add a healthy amout to keep the element covered so you don't need to wait for the full 50l to reach a boil. Youll only need about 17.5L to run 3 hours at 3.6kw (plus your safe level to keep the element covered) it could only take 20-30 mins to reach a boil vs waiting an hour+

I seems like youre having the similar pressure issue Mickiboi was having here
https://www.stilldragon.org/discussion/ ... er-idea/p1
The effluent should run more free to mitigate the pressure issues.
(I don't agreed with the valve on the output) and if you're running a separate steam gen it shouldn't be crashing the column... that or im missing something

Can you please post some pics of your setup? I can't see the pics from the other forum..

[zach]

Hey Zach was it you that had a keg steam boiler? Is it continuous?

I have a 15.5 gallon keg that I use for steam, not continuous, which is direct fired with LPG.

[bluc]

Sorry for hijack yummy will start my own thread.