Trying to salvage a 30 liter barrel

[PalCabral]

Yesterday I crossed Sweden to pick up an old 30 liter whiskey barrel. What I know is that it matured whisky between 2006 and 2011, but after that nothing is known. Most likely it’s been sitting in a storage somewhere, for up to 15 years.

Inside it looks dry, no sign of mold, but the cracks between the boards are visible. Today I plan to start hydrating it.

Any thoughts or suggestions how I should go about it? My plan is to fill with warm water then put the barrel in a bigger bucket/barrel and fill it with warm water, giving the barrel hydration from the outside.

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[Saltbush Bill]

Make sure the hoops are in the exact position that they were before it dried out.
The one in the photo looks wrong to begin with.

[Corn Cracker]

Nice find, It must have lived in a low humidity environment, seeing through the joints that wood has really dried out. Hopefully it swells back up nice and proper if not, you've got staves and dominoes for years. Light vs heavy toast, #1 vs #4 char, mixing toasted and charred. It's not a loss if it doesn't hold

[PalCabral]

Make sure the hoops are in the exact position that they were before it dried out.
The one in the photo looks wrong to begin with.

Thanks, Salty. Got them arranged now as they were mounted originally.

[PalCabral]

It drains like a sieve…

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[Saltbush Bill]

Very hot, but not boiling water from the outside, water inside only if absolutely necessary.

[Bolverk]

Id drive those hoops in to tighten up the staves then blast the inside with steam to swell the wood

[Saltbush Bill]

Id drive those hoops in to tighten up the staves then blast the inside with steam to swell the wood

Ive always found it best to try and leave the hoops in thier original position until after the barrel has re swollen.
You can then tap them down a little tighter if need be if you still have small leaks.
Tapping them down to tight before letting the wood swell first can result in cracked staves.
Im no Cooper, but learned that the hard way.

[PalCabral]

Very hot, but not boiling water from the outside, water inside only if absolutely necessary.

At this point, it's practically impossible to avoid having water inside the barrel. The cracks are too big. But I am rotating the barrel in the water so all sides are soaked. Will change the water with new hot water.

[Username]

That's a fine size of a barrel, seems appropriate for your production schedule, hope it seals up for you

[PalCabral]

Nice find, It must have lived in a low humidity environment, seeing through the joints that wood has really dried out. Hopefully it swells back up nice and proper if not, you've got staves and dominoes for years. Light vs heavy toast, #1 vs #4 char, mixing toasted and charred. It's not a loss if it doesn't hold

You are right, CC. I've been so focused on making this barrel water/whiskey proof that I haven't thought of what I'll do if it fails. I'll need to shave the staves quite a lot but then they should make good sticks. Glass half full!

That's a fine size of a barrel, seems appropriate for your production schedule, hope it seals up for you

My plan is to first put the whiskies in my new 20 liter barrel until I feel they are reaching too much oak flavor. Then I'll move the whiskey over to this barrel, top it up with some jar oaked whiskey from the same batch, and let it mature in it. My guess is that there will be very little active oaking and coloring from this barrel. Let's see if we get there. First day of soaking, the barrel's been more cracks that wood.

[Copperhead road]

Pal, I'm not sure if you have transferred your Whiskey into that barrel yet...?
If so did you get any wet weeping in spots between the staves...

[PalCabral]

Pal, I'm not sure if you have transferred your Whiskey into that barrel yet...?
If so did you get any wet weeping in spots between the staves...

No, Copper. I am yet only in the phase of hydrating the barrel to expand the dry wood, and hopefully make the barrel to start sealing up. There's no way I could put anything of value in this sieve box.

If it does seal, I will fill it with all odd bits and pieces distillates I have laying around, stuff I can afford losing or get ruined. But right now I am pretty far from that stage yet.

[Copperhead road]

Pal, I'm not sure if you have transferred your Whiskey into that barrel yet...?
If so did you get any wet weeping in spots between the staves...

No, Copper. I am yet only in the phase of hydrating the barrel to expand the dry wood, and hopefully make the barrel to start sealing up. There's no way I could put anything of value in this sieve box.

If it does seal, I will fill it with all odd bits and pieces distillates I have laying around, stuff I can afford losing or get ruined. But right now I am pretty far from that stage yet.

i have a couple of 70 Litre Barrels brand new oak, i am hoping they don't leak. i had certain circumstances that prevented me from having the time to make stock... you know when things in life that you can not control arise...
i hope they dont weep or leak

[PalCabral]

i have a couple of 70 Litre Barrels brand new oak, i am hoping they don't leak. i had certain circumstances that prevented me from having the time to make stock... you know when things in life that you can not control arise...
i hope they dont weep or leak

Thanks, Copper!

I bought this old barrel with the eyes open. When I inspected the inside pre-purchase the light gleared through the cracks between the staves, so I knew what I was getting myself into. It’s been in a bath overnight and I’m about to go down to the distillery now to replace the water. This is going to take days.

[PalCabral]

First 24 hoursI cant say I notice any difference. Still leaking.

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[tommysb]

Be patient Pal, I reckon you'll get it. That doesn't look too bad in my opinion. What you're doing, swelling in that bucket looks about right. You could also pour some hot water onto the upward facing head. Flip it over ever 24 hours. If it's going to be sitting in the water a while, put in some citric acid and maybe campden/sodium metabisulphate.

After it's had a good few days in the water, drive the hoops down with a bolster and a mallet.

You will probably reach a point where it mostly holds water, except some still leaks out. Just keep filling it with water and let it keep swelling. Keep going!

[Copperhead road]

As Tommy has pointed out just stick with it and hopefully it swells so the staves seal, flipping it end to end. i think your method is good by not filling the inside with water.

[Saltbush Bill]

Its been drying out for possibly 15 years, it's not going to rehydrate and swell back to normal in 15 hours.

[PalCabral]

Thanks for the encouragement. In fact, I am seeing some improvements. The side that sat with the bottom down over night seems to have sealed fairly well and it’s now floating when I turned it - I had to weigh it down a bit, see last picture.

But the other side, the stave in which the bung hole sits is still with a huge crack, where the first picture is taken. As you can see, the whole stave is pressed in and not aligned with its’ neighbor stave. Second picture.

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[Archee72]

Is there any/or much water leaking into the barrel? If not you are probably onto a winner, slowly?

[PalCabral]

Is there any/or much water leaking into the barrel? If not you are probably onto a winner, slowly?

It fills up inside but a lot slower now than yesterday, so we’re movibg in the right direction. Each barrel head have a few leaks in the rim which could be fixed with wax, but there’s a big crack on the bung hole stave that leans like a mother. This one is a worry.

[Yummyrum]

It’s a bit hard to see due to the dark pic , but is the actual staff cracked either side of the bung hole , or do you mean the staff has gaps either side if it where it touches the staves either side ?

Maybe pull the bung out and put something inside the hole to help pull it back into alignment .

If the staff is cracked either side of the bung hole , maybe get yourself a silicone rubber bung instead of bashing that wooden one in and causing more damage .

BTW , I’ve used a silicone bung on my keg since I got it .

[Copperhead road]

BTW , I’ve used a silicone bung on my keg since I got it .

+1
Its so much easier

[Saltbush Bill]

Shitty dark photos dont help people give good advice.
Give the thing more time to swell and rehydrate before making decisions on what needs adjusting or shifting.
And as before leave those hoops exactly in thier original positions.
They worked in those positions when the barrels was leak free and in use.
If you need to sift them that can be done at a later date if you still have leaks or weeps.

[PalCabral]

Update after 48 hours of rehydration.

Initially when I placed the barrel in a bath of water, the barrel filled immediately through all the cracks between the staves. Now, this is happening at a much slower rate. When the water has been drained and I fill up with new hot water, the barrel floats for a while until enough water has sifted through the cracks that havent stopped leaking yet. So it is clearly going in the right diection with the hydration.

I will follow Salty’s and Tom’s advise and just keep at it for a couple of more days before I do anything else. I will try to take better pictures then.

The water gets pretty black after holding the barrel for hours. I expect it’s the black color of the outside that is being extracted. I also see a bit of small oily slicks on the surface, which I believe might come from whatever substance (varnish?) has been used to impregnate (is that the word?) the outside. Considering how much of the water that gets inside the barrel during this hydration activity, I dont like the thought of this and the color pigments getting inside the barrel. Not much I can do about now though.

[Corn Cracker]

Is it possibly the inside char and the oils from the liquor that the char cleaned out of its previous life are causing this?

[PalCabral]

After 72 hours of rehydration I am clearly seeing improvements. Bottom side, and left and right sides, seem to have sealed up. Where I suspect I still have leaks are in both barrel heads and on the top, specifically the bung hole stave.

This night I let the top side face down in the water bath and the time it took for water to enter into the barrel was much longer now than initially, but it leaks non the less.

I will put the barrel through another cycle of warm baths today but tonight I will let the barrel dry out over night. Tomorrow I will fill the barrel inside only to be able to better record where there are still leaks and how bad they are. Progress.

[Yummyrum]

Sounding more and more like a keeper Pal . Well done

[higgins]

...
But the other side, the stave in which the bung hole sits is still with a huge crack, where the first picture is taken. As you can see, the whole stave is pressed in and not aligned with its’ neighbor stave. Second picture.


...

Pal, when I refurbished my 5 gal / 19L barrel I used a rubber mallet to hammer on the staves to help align the surface between them. By hitting on the stave that is higher it seems to pull the adjacent stave up so the seam is more even. That seems to have worked well for me. You could use a hammer - if so, use a bit of restraint so you don't smash wood fibers.