Bad Molasses?

[lostabroad]

Hey guys,

I've been on the site for a while but never posted cause I was able to find answers to my questions through searching, until now.

I made my first molasses wash and am running it right now, but there is a funky taste to the wash that is carrying over. The wash has a chemical/plastic taste to it that I thought would
go away as I ran the still but no luck. I used molasses from the feed and mixed 4 parts water to 1 part molasses and used bakers yeast. Also the molasses and wash was extremely oily.

Any ideas on what is going on and should I just throw everything out and look for another place to buy molasses?

[Zxlork]

From what I have read....always..clarify your molasses. you can do this by using 1 part molasses and 2 part water boil it to 180/190 let it cool and sit over night then rack it and leave the sludge behind. Sounds like it would of saved you some troubles.

As for what to do now...what are you trying to make?

[HookLine]

The quality of molasses can vary quite a bit. Might just have a low quality batch.

[Barney Fife]

Feed molasses is a crap shoot. I finally bought some since everyone else here seems so high on it. Well..., I have about 3 gallons left of a 5 gallon pail that I'd gladly trade for a pint of fancy molasses..... This one's oily, also, with big oil slicks on top of the wash when it's done fermenting. It works, but it's not the rum I'm used to, and I won't make this mistake again. With the amount of sugar and DAP I have to add to it to make it "work", it's costing more than the fancy molasses I was buying for $10/gallon and always gave me fantastic rum, and it's more work. And in the end, mediocre rum, at best.

What's that old saying? Crap in; crap out.

[rad14701]

I distinctly remember getting at least two wretched barrels years ago... We added it to silage as it was sent into the silo for additional nutrients and would sometimes poke a finger into the stream for a free treat... Once you take a taste of wretched molasses you think twice about going back for another taste... These barrels were oily and rank smelling... I shy away from raw molasses to this day...

[Zxlork]

@Barney Fife....did you clarify your molasses before you added it to the mix or just throw it in?

@rad...I thought all molasses was raw....feed and "fancy" molasses....if not what stuff do you use or recommend for better flavor?

[rad14701]

Zxlork, as mentioned earlier, there are different grades of molasses depending on use... The more "food grade" the molasses, the better filtered and refined it will be...

The farm grade molasses I was referring to is intended to be mixed with livestock grain so it is far less refined than what you buy off the store shelves... It could come from the bottom of the holding tank and may contain far more oils, contaminants, solids, and sulfurs, than we humans care to contend with... A cow, on the other hand, will just munch it down along with the silage, grains, and hay that is presented in front of them... They're going to wash it down with gallons of cold fresh water anyway and they don't have the greatest sense of taste...

What you buy at the grocery store in small bottles is far more refined so it can be called "food grade" which is why it costs so much more by volume...

[ct1870]

I have a friend who sales for a local food distribution company. He gets me Groeb farm fancy molasses, a case (4 gal) for $38.00. It has worked out great. It comes from and I haven't tried to order it from http://www.groebfarms.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow but if you know someone in the food business or someone who works for a food distribution company you may have some luck. I have tried to find it in large quantities through Sams and Cosco with no luck. I have 3 feed stores within 3 miles of me, but they have a preservative in them, so I leave them alone. Hope this helps. I am fortunate to be from where I'm from.

[lostabroad]

Well I tried to a second distillation with no luck so I ended up just pitching everything I'll have to try clarifying next time but I don't think I'll buy the molasses from the same place again; one of the dogs was licking up some of the over flow from the kitchen floor and ended up with the shits. I think the molasses may have just been bad. I have a US Food distributor not 3 miles from me so I'll to see if I can get molasses through them, though for the time being I think I'll stick with all grain mashes until I get over the failure of trying to make rum.

On a side note don't wash your clothes with a load of towels used to clean up molasses unless you like having your laundry smell like a spring fresh day next to a pile of
burning molasses

[HookLine]

I use feed grade molasses and it works fine. Might just be lucky with my supplier. They supply the weekend farmers and hobby riders, who are pretty fussy about their steeds, so probably insist on the better quality stuff.

[pyratesurgeon]

Hmmm, as a feed-grade molasses, it might also contain propionic acid, which is listed on a couple other sources for that type. As I've only been working on 5 gallon batches, I've been getting by with the 1st Street brand, put out by the local warehouse grocer.

Just my humble 2 pence worth.

[Barney Fife]

I think the problem with feed molasses will be regional; some will have decent stuff consistently, others will have the bottom of the barrel, maybe sugar beet, maybe chemical-separated, "stuff". Mine smells "grassy", like hash oil(if y'all know what I'm talkin' about). Distilled carefully, it is quite clean, though it doesn't have the taste or smell of high quality rum, but damn, I'm having to dance by the full moon and fuck strange creatures to get it to start, then finish, fermenting. It gets there, but an impatient man would surely give up.

I'm sure the deer will love it.... as I will the venison.

Back to fancy molasses. Lostabroad, seek out my recipes; rum is simple, dead simple, with the right molasses. Don't give up!

[Dnderhead]

the trouble with feed molasses that it is not refined an it can come from a verity of sources like sugar cane, sugar beets, byproduct of food industry
and byproduct of wood industry,,read over the ingredients before buying or you mite be wondering what you did wrong and it mite
not be you at all.

[SuperDavid]

I use feed grade molases, I assume its not all that great a quality because I never seems to ferment below 1.025. My friends that drink rum love the rum I make with it so I'm not too worried about the "quality".
And the wash its self NEVER tastes good to me and same with the spirit after the spirit run...its all nasty stuff to me until its had a few months on oak!

[Zxlork]

Since were talking about Feed Molasses...I know this is a pretty common one here in the states and didn't know if any of you have had any luck or tried using it.
http://www.ruralking.com/2-5-gal-molasses" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow.

If you guys don't mind throw out what brands you have used with success so far:
1)...1st Street Brand
2)...http://www.groebfarms.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
..........Called them at 517-467-2065 They said it is cheaper to buy by the case (4 1 gallon containers) $28.11 for a case of black strap molasses and ..........you will have to call for shipping cost...for me it would be $23. Which really is not that much more expensive then the feed grade for me at ..........$16 per 2.5 gallon.

[lostabroad]

Barney don't worry I'm not giving up just putting it to the side to focus on my all grain mashes. I'm actually trying to go legit and start a distillery. I keep getting told I have the talent and everybody who's tried what I've made has been pushing me to start a distillery, so I figure what the hell nothing ventured nothing gained and I'd be doing something I loved. It's a hard road to get there but that just makes getting there all the better. Though I wish I had access to Bill Owens spread sheets from the ADI forums.

[blanikdog]

From what I have read....always..clarify your molasses. you can do this by using 1 part molasses and 2 part water boil it to 180/190 let it cool and sit over night then rack it and leave the sludge behind. Sounds like it would of saved you some troubles. ...

First time I've heard of this. I just toss it in straight from the feed store into the BOP and boil it up. remove scum and add yeast starter when cool. I'll have to try this.

Checking the term "clarified molasses' on the net seems to talk about using sulphuric acid and superphosphate. I'll forget all about that part.

blanik

[myles]

I use catering grade treacle, currently using 1 gal (7.25kg) with 20kg raw cane sugar made up to 25 gallons. So far I have not bothered with inverting it, I just disolve it and pitch the yeast when cooled. The treacle is there to boost the flavour of the raw sugar and I have had no trouble so far.

I did compare it to feed grade molasses but came to the conclusion it was better to go for the slightly higher grade catering quality product. Even more surprising was that it was actually cheaper to buy 1lb tins from the supermarket as opposed to the 1 gallon plastic containers from the commercial catering outlet. Just love those 2 for the price of 1 offers

[HookLine]

Clarifying molasses is standard in commercial stilleries. I haven't tried it yet.

[Zxlork]

I have yet to do a Rum batch either...all I know is that PUGIDOGS who seems to know his rum in and out says that the difference between good rum and great rum is clarifying your Molasses.

@blanik Clarifying your Molasses means use Mix 1 Part Molasses with 2 Parts water bring up to 180/190 degrees...let set over night and rack off the good stuff leaving the sludge behind. The way we use it has nothing to do with sulphuric acid or anything complicated.

[pyratesurgeon]

@blanik Clarifying your Molasses means use Mix 1 Part Molasses with 2 Parts water bring up to 180/190 degrees...let set over night and rack off the good stuff leaving the sludge behind.

(Scribbling in a notebook) Thanks for the pointers Zxlork! Will give that run on the next batch.

[Zxlork]

PUGIDOGS is the only one who I have hear mention it...I have asked if others have with no response...maybe they don't see the time worth if they are already making good rum... not sure but please let me know...I'm very curious to hear from a few people who might do this if they think it actually makes a big difference. But for problems of oil or weird things that that it would totally make sense because if you clarified it first you would leave all that behind because it would be sitting on the top when you racked it out.

[Barney Fife]

First I hear about clarifying, myself, but I'll give it a try with this molasses I have here. Nothing to lose, and it may just be the ticket! Until now, I just mix my molasses and sugar in hot tap water(130F) and pitch yeast when cool enough.

[HookLine]

Yeah, I will be trying it for the next round of rum ferments.

[blanikdog]

There you go, Zxlork. You've got us all trying it now. That's the wonderful thing about this forum, the sharing of knowledge without any egomania. Thanks Zx.

blanik

[SuperDavid]

what might the advantages be of using this method?

[UnclePaul]

My last attempt at molasses didn't come out too good, and I didn't clarify it. I'll definitely try that next. I tried some with no sugar, just the raw molasses and water.
I do know that the molasses taste comes thru very strong. I took a couple quarts that I wasn't happy with the taste and mixed it with the last couple gallons of UJSSM mash and some Gerber mash and ran all it together.
I can still detect a taste of that molasses in what I collected.

[blanikdog]

what might the advantages be of using this method?

I have no idea yet. The proof - as they say - is in the drinking, so for me, that's enough to give it a try. Cant possibly do any harm. I'll let you know in a year.

blanik

[Zxlork]

what might the advantages be of using this method?

The advantage is that you leave all the crap behind the yeast won't use. These could do anything from slow fermentation by increasing the osmotic pressure on the yeast to causing off flavors. In our applications we most likely will not notice the slower yeast growth. But in our yield you should notice a much smoother flavor.

[dimasram]

Here where I am(Panama, Central America), 1gallon is about 0.70 USD. I bought 70 gallons. I add water in this ratio 1 mollasses plus 3 water(about 22 brix). I first boil de raw mollasse to pasteurize it, then I add water, wait to cool down and then add baker yeast(no turbo). It always left 4 brix with no convertion, maybe is cristalized sugar.

On first run I have a mollasses odor and taste. Alcohol at 96%. I tried with GAC and ozone, but no change in odor and taste.

I want to produce vehicular ethanol and chemical alcohol. I will try also, to use ozone with some alcohol to burn fussel oil. Maybe to take off any next day hang over! Test, test, test!

What is the best way to make neutral alcohol with mollasses?

Sorry by my english.
My still specs.

1.Destilation column 12" 5,40 meter tall
2-Rectification column 6 meters tall
3-Biomas boiler. Steam regulator

70-100 liters per hour.