When I Don't Know, I Ask

[cwood3]

Layed-off process/mechanical engineer here. Doing BBQ/hot dof catering for now. Anyhooo, I have always been one who likes to tinker and build things on my own, more for personal satisfaction than for real use. I am building a beer keg pot still. I'm a good fabricator and have all my own welding (TIG, Plasma, etc) equipment. I'm in no hurry and budget my time to mate up with my aailable "fun-money". Now here i the deal, I'm a beer-drinker mainly, however, I enjoy sipping some Crown, Jameson, or Scotch. I have never tasted real "corn whiskey" or any other kind of "moonshine". I'm not a power drinker and can hold a stiff shot down without much problem. Can somebody clue me in, with some description, of what I might expect making a corn-based product..???? I know this seems silly, but I don't know, so I thought I'd ask.

Thanks guys..........

[Hawke]

Corn based whiskey would be similar to Jim Beam or Jack Daniels Bourbon/Tennessee.
The whitedog(raw whiskey) can be rather rough. The magic is in the aging.

[Centimeter]

Georgia Moon is an example of some really bad corn whiskey.

[LWTCS]

Funny you should mention power drinking.

To date, it has been my experience that this product we make will not make you a power drinker capable of hammering down crude amounts of rough, hot booze.

Quite the contrary.

Conservative, proper cuts will give one a very good quality etho. Complexity or body may not replicate the big boyz product. But my point is that our product (based on economy of scale) is in many ways as good or better than a lot of commercially sold booze.

I really don't drink any more beer or wine. My likker is way cleaner and I feel 200% better in the morning on heavy drinking days.

Is my likker top shelf......No.
But I still rank my likker better than any middle of the road product on my old shopping list.

There are some good posts on making cuts and aging on this forum.

Sorry I could not offer anything to your direct question.

[blanikdog]

Is my likker top shelf......No. But I still rank my likker better than any middle of the road product on my old shopping list.

Yep, LW I agree. Careful cuts and aging are the secret.


blanik

[Maynard]

Well, my tasted my first corn SM yesterday after distressed aging on oak for a week. And it taste nothing like what I have ever had off the shelf. Had to keep it over 100proof or I lose all the warmth, it becomes TOO smooth. Tastes slightly of corn and aged oak and actually finishes with a bit vanilla.
In short Good, but different. I am prefering my stuff over the commercial.

[LWTCS]

Like to keep mine at 130 to 140 and bring down with my mixer.

[Hawke]

Maynard, add a pepper corn or two when aging. That will bring out the heat without having to drink high ABV.
I drink everything neat, between 80 and 100 proof. (Mixer is just there to cover mistakes, or dilute it to drinking strength, IMO)

[cwood3]

Thanks guys. These are the kind of comments and info. I was hoping for. I am interested in aging (the product, not me) and flavor is what I am aiming for. I just don't want to go through the motions to make something that will never top kerosene. You read a lot (especially ads/commercials) about pure mountain water, left spiraling aged oak from the Incas, and special peocess that was passed on from Einstein from the commercial producers. Sure, I understand there are ways to enhance, and I'm now looking forward to "finding my niche", or something that is neat and unique. I know the best source of information is right here on this forum. Again, thanks.

cwood3

[cwood3]

Looking through some info. on the parent page, I found this recipe/procedure:

INGREDIANTS

1. Corn (lbs.)/Barley Malt (lbs.)/Water (gal.)
2. 8/2/6
3. Corn – cracked corn
4. Barley Malt – 2-row, finely ground
5. Water – distilled, or tap that has sat for several days

STEP

6. Bring 6-gallons of water to a boil.
7. Add the cracked corn.
8. Simmer at 180F for 30-minutes.
9. Turn off heat and let cool to 145F.
10. Add finely ground barley malt.
11. Simmer at 143F for 2-hours.
12. Filter into fermenter, lightly rinsing the grain with 160F water to capture most of the sugars.
13. Discard the grain.
14. Ferment the mash for approximately 5-days, or until activity slows.
15. Rack into a secondary fermenter for clearing.
16. Distill in pot stil making appropriate cuts.

Does this look right ? Any additions/ommissions tha might add for a better product ? I would plan on aging this a bit, probably with some type of oak treatment.

Thanks again.

[cwood3]

BTW, I saw that under "Preparing Wash"/"Grain"/"Basic Whiskey"................it was this:


"for corn mash, I just use the cracked corn as is. I do grind up the malted barley but just cracking it is fine. I use about 2 lbs barley and 8 lbs corn. Get the water to boiling, about 6 gallons depending on the size of your pot. Add the craked corn and let it simmer at around 180 degrees (82 °C) or so for about 1\2 hour.. This softens it nicely. Temperature for this is not critical. Turn heat off and let temp drop to about 145 F (63 °C) and add the malted barley. Keep temp at 143 or so for about 2 hrs.. This results in dextrous for a high alcohol mash. Then what I do is take my primary fermenter and cover it with some filter cloth and hold the cloth in place with a bungie cord. The cloth I use is the kind with holes that is used to make soccer jersies. I dump the mixture about 2 quarts at a time and sprinkle hot water(160 F (71 °C) or so) over it. This washes the sugars out of the grain. Once each 2 quarts is finished, I scoop out the spent grain and repeat the process. The resulting wash is fermented for 5 days or until it slows. Then I siphon it into a secondary fermenter and let it finish working and so it will clear."

Where/what about YEAST ????

[Maynard]

My opinion is to start with something a bit easier than a real mash (thats whats usually recommended). Maybe UJSM (found in the tried and true recipe section) with a bit of barley or rye added if you are looking for that flavor.
It just takes a while to learn the different flavors, how the still is going to behave, making cuts, etc in order to get a decent product. As I am learning patience is key.

[cwood3]

......................or, because the malted barley provides the enzymes to convert the corn starch to sugar, it doesn't need yeast. Just ferment away......?

I have some 2-row, ground, barley malt on the way. I have the corn. What he heck, I'll experiment and see what happens.

[Tater]

In right area and time of year wild yeast will take over . Other wise ya will need to add some yeast

[noobsauce]

......................or, because the malted barley provides the enzymes to convert the corn starch to sugar, it doesn't need yeast. Just ferment away......?

I have some 2-row, ground, barley malt on the way. I have the corn. What he heck, I'll experiment and see what happens.

If you try this...what you will end up with is a big stinky rotten mess.

Yes it will convert but that doesnt make or cause fermentation...

You need more reading with a question like that...but you are heading in the right direction for sure. Honestly work on a simple sugar wash and make a "vodka" first so you can get the feel of what you are doing. Give it away if you dont like vodka but you will definatly learn alot from doing it.

[cwood3]

..........well, why hasn't this been removed from the "Parent Page" if it's a recipe for rot? Verbatim it states:

[i]"Rob advises ..
for corn mash, I just use the cracked corn as is. I do grind up the malted barley but just cracking it is fine. I use about 2 lbs barley and 8 lbs corn. Get the water to boiling, about 6 gallons depending on the size of your pot. Add the craked corn and let it simmer at around 180 degrees (82 °C) or so for about 1\2 hour.. This softens it nicely. Temperature for this is not critical. Turn heat off and let temp drop to about 145 F (63 °C) and add the malted barley. Keep temp at 143 or so for about 2 hrs.. This results in dextrous for a high alcohol mash. Then what I do is take my primary fermenter and cover it with some filter cloth and hold the cloth in place with a bungie cord. The cloth I use is the kind with holes that is used to make soccer jersies. I dump the mixture about 2 quarts at a time and sprinkle hot water(160 F (71 °C) or so) over it. This washes the sugars out of the grain. Once each 2 quarts is finished, I scoop out the spent grain and repeat the process. The resulting wash is fermented for 5 days or until it slows. Then I siphon it into a secondary fermenter and let it finish working and so it will clear.
CornFed writes ...[/i]

I guess I'm more interested now in what part is incorrect. If it's just a matter of letting the temp. come down from the 143F in the fermenter to about 78-80F and pitching 2-4 grams of yeast per gallon of mash (Nottingham Ale or Red Star) and monitoring the activity, temperature, SG, etc, then I don't see this as pure rocket science. If the correct instructions are followed, right ingrediants used, and proper apparatus employed, I believe I can get through the process at a level of sucess that will tell me if it's kerosene or product. Please don't get me wrong, I fully understand, respect, and appreciate the art form that goes into tweaking a recipe and making it one's signature concoction. I don't expect a first run to be that at all. This particular recipe caught my eye after considerable reading because it appears to be very straight forward.

The reason I am asking is because I wanted to make sure I had the proper steps/sequence/ingrediants/etc.

I am here at you more experienced's mercy to be set correct.

Thanks again.

[rad14701]

Tony Acklands copyright denies our right to modify the parent site at will... We would need explicit permission to make any modifications...

Enzymes convert starches to sugars... Yeast converts sugars to alcohol and CO2... In each case you need the right tool and process for the job...

[noobsauce]

I was refering to if you try it without using yeast. It would rot before it fermented. The recipe that you quoted uses starch conversion and yeast...your other post seemed to say you planned on not using yeast. The parent site used with this forum is the best way to learn stuff. That recipe will work if thats what you were wondering. As i said, you are on your way.