my shine is blue!?

[MidnightBrew]

Okay so this is my first post and my first shine batch! I hooked everything up and as the distillate came out it started looking a bit discolored(like... yellow or brown? Just not clear) which I tossed(heads and all that jazz) and put my catch pan back, but the shine was blue!!!! I'm still cooking so it may go away but the kettle boiling the shine is aluminum and the tubing is fresh copper 1/8" x 10' bought from home depot.

Should I have cleaned it? It smells like bread not ammonia like some others have experienced and its a very clear blue not deep wjndex. Like... a drop of food coloring lol. What tests should I run? Is it safe to drink? Help!!


Edit: after throwing that away too my shine looks clear but its only th first run at 212+ degrees. I want to run it at 180 and again at 150 to make sure I get rid of all the methanol(right? Haha)

[jaycap1030]

for one the bread smell your getting is from your yeast you should try racking your wash then straining your wash before putting it in your still cheese cloth is best but a clean white -shirt would do fine to catch the bulk and for two aluminum is not the way to go at all stainless steel of copper aluminum has iron in it and can get you very sick it could also be where the blue color is coming from. and don't forget while your warming up collect the first 1/2 cup or so depending on how much your running to make sure you get all the bad stuff out you'll be able to tell by the change in smell. but first thing is first go get yourself a stainless steel or copper kettle do it right and be safe cutting corners is what will hurt you i hope some of this info helps u out and i hope u tested anything you made before drinking it good luck and happy drinking

[DuckofDeath]

Did you do your cleaning runs? I found that when I back flushed after my vinegar run the water came out blue. I cleaned with water again and it stopped. So then i did my sacrificial run and washed with water after that and once again a light blue After my 4th cleaning run it stopped.

[Dnderhead]

alkaline wash?,,,wash high in nitrates?

[Husker]

I also think this is likely due to lack of any cleaning runs. Your first run (possibly 2, or 3) should be sacrificial. They season the copper, and fully clean it. there will be micro copper particles (and salts), and other manufacturing stuff that is removed during these runs. Copper salts (corrosion), can be greenish, but also blueish tint.

Dunder also pointed out that an alkaline wash can also show up in this way. When the wash is alkaline, it will wash off the seasoning in the column/condenser, and you will again get the bluish tint.

Some rules of thumb.
a. always clean (vinegar/water run, or other methods) and do some sacrificial ethanol run(s) on a new still, or if you work on it, or if you ever FULLY clean it (i.e. remove the patina).
b. Watch the PH of your wash. Keep it acidic.
c. Never add calcium carbonate or bicarb (baking soda) to a wash before running. If you add this, ONLY do so on a 2nd run, when running the low wines.
d. Once the still is seasoned, only clean by rinsing with hot/boiling water. If you can, do NOT use acid, or mechanically scrub off the patina (inside of still, column, condenser.

The patina inside the still (boiler, column, condenser), is your friend. Harsh cleaning (scrubbing or acid) will remove this, causing the still to again be unseasoned, and it will want to re-season itself. During this re-season process (creating patina), there will be copper sluff off, and again possibly a blue or light green tint, and spirit that now contains trace copper compounds.

H.

[scooter-1]

What about that 1/8" copper tubing???? I'm new here also, and was recently informed that 3/8" in minimum...

[MidnightBrew]

I actually think I figured it out; I used caulk to plug the hole my copper tubing exited, and it didn't hold too well. Then around the same time since I lost water my tube got rather hot, so I think the caulk was liquefied from water than heated by the tube and got in my shine. I figured this out because a piece of caulk in the tube turned blue as well haha.

And I ran the mash through a white T-shirt, but the end result still smelled of bread. What is racking? And I'm going to try a recipe with tomato paste, and lemon in it. What's the significance of these items? Is it nutrients? And finally is normal bakers yeast okay to use? I bought the wrong type or turbo yeast(heat wave when I'm in NY and its winter :/) so I'm hoping my regular yeast will be okay.

Thanks for all the help!!

[rad14701]

Where to start...???

@ MidnightBrew

First... An aluminum pressure cooker is not a good choice for a boiler... This has been covered more than enough times so an ample amount of independent research here in the forums would have enlightened you to this fact... Both acidic and alkaline washes will cause premature deterioration of the aluminum...

Second... If you are truly running a 1/8" x 10' worm you have another problem... 3/8" copper is the absolute minimum diameter for a worm and 1/2" is the recommended minimum... This has been covered more than enough times so an ample amount of independent research here in the forums would have enlightened you to this fact...

Third... Cleaning runs, complete with sacrificial alcohol laden run(s) are required in order to adequately clean a still before attempting a "keeper" run... This has been covered more than enough times so an ample amount of independent research here in the forums would have enlightened you to this fact...

Fourth... You haven't told us what your wash recipe was so we can determine whether the recipe is a contributing factor... We recommend starting out with a proven recipe from the Tried and True Recipe forum... This has been covered more than enough times so an ample amount of independent research here in the forums would have enlightened you to this fact...

Fifth... WTF were you doing using caulk on a still...??? This has been covered more than enough times so an ample amount of independent research here in the forums would have enlightened you to this fact...

I'm kinda seeing a pattern here, aren't you...??? Toss that crappy ghetto still on the scrap heap and get serious about this hobby, or get out...!!! See, that wasn't so hard, was it...???


@ jaycap1030

Not sure where you did your research but cheese cloth will not clean up a wash prior to distillation... Yeast are so miniscule that they will pass right through even somethings as fine as a coffee filter... Even flocculated yeast will reseparate and pass through and end up in the boiler... "Clearing and Racking" is the preferred method of insuring that all trub (yeast and other solids) have settled to the bottom prior to siphoning the cleared wash off the trub bed... Giving poor or inaccurate advice can be worse than no advice at all... You were close, but not providing steps in proper order... You would strain first (optional) and then rack the cleared wash off the trub (preferred)... Otherwise you might as well just dump everything into the boiler and cross your fingers...

[rad14701]

I was posting while others were, including the OP...

STOP...!!! JUST STOP...!!!

Now Turbo Yeast...

Go do some damned research before you keep fucking around...!!!

You already had a problem with a wash... You need to know something before you can have any success, unless you live your life relying on dumb luck... Don't add lemon juice to any wash unless it is being used to invert your sugar... If you don't know what invert sugar is then do some research... Lemon juice will make a wash acidic and should ONLY be used if your wash is on the base side...

I honestly can't be stern enough with my recommendation to stop and read... Perhaps an Admin should put you in read-only mode until you decide you want to listen...

[MidnightBrew]

I see I've made many mistakes and will research some before continuing.


Now the kettle is steel, and it is just a tea kettle that fits about a liter of fluid. I thought it was aluminum but it isn't I'm sorry for the miscommunication. I thought the caulk being as the exit where the liquid came out into my catcher would be okay just don't use it on anything that will get hot and admittedly if I let the caulk cure I wouldn't have sprung a leak and had this issue so for that I take blame. And I should run vinegar through any new items or run a couple of sacrifices. But that's kind of why I even came here; for knowledge not to get attacked. I mean I AM in the novice section am I not? Part of learning is research and asking experienced people in the field.

Why 3/8" tubing? My wash(because it was my first attempt) was only about a liter in volume. I mixed 2 cups of sugar in with about 4 tbsp of turbo yeast heat wave. Nothing else that was it, let it ferment with a stopper and co2 airlock in a dry spot for a week before attempting to distill. I'm assuming that's a bad recipe? I tried to fraction the ingredient recipe on the back of the turbo yeast package, guess I didn't do too god of a job haha.

[rad14701]

Again, stop and do ample research... The fact that you are proud of your creation doesn't win points here... Don't attempt practical application again until you know everything you have done wrong and understand why... Novice or not, what you do wrong can harm or kill and we take safety very seriously here... Trust me, we don't like having to be hard asses but if that's what it takes to get the point across, so be it...

[MidnightBrew]

Well I highly appreciate it, just could have been a bit more subtle

So is there a thread or post here on the forum you might suggest for a beginner still setup or a good recipe? I am serious about this and km not going to quit over a few mistakes. I wanna be popcorn Sutton one day haha.

And no one answered why tomato paste is, if at all, a good idea for a sugar wash haha.

[rad14701]

You're still asking questions instead of researching... You'll go read-only if you don't listen... We're that serious about safety...

Birdwatchers is in the Tried and True Recipe forum and it uses tomato paste...

New Distillers Reading Lounge...

Read the entire parent site at least three times... Things won't gel until you've read it at least that many times so things connect and gel in the gray matter... You'll have "Ah Hah!!!" moments...

Read through all of the Tried and True Recipes and you'll start to understand proportions and nutrients... And you won't find Turbo Yeast recommended there, or anywhere else for that matter...

Then read everything else here in the forums... Until just recently I have read every single post in these forums since it was created... And I will get caught up on what I've been forced to skip recently... It wasn't doing me any good to try to help someone not harm themselves three weeks after the fact... So now I'm back to cracking the whip at you novices before you get a chance to make what could potentially be a life threatening mistake... And that's why I'm not as subtle as folks might like at times...

[Dnderhead]

turbos is known for that,they have a bunch of nitrogen ,then if its not used by the end of ferment,,,you know the rest.
if using turbos you need to use the whole pack,it tends to separate then one batch you mite git more yeast or more nutrients.

[MidnightBrew]

I'm reading the parent site now. Currently on how the yeast actually does what it does and how it needs nutrients because the sugar can kill it just as alcohol can, fherefor needing nutrients to live and produce the best abv. Am I on the right track?

[rad14701]

I'm reading the parent site now. Currently on how the yeast actually does what it does and how it needs nutrients because the sugar can kill it just as alcohol can, fherefor needing nutrients to live and produce the best abv. Am I on the right track?

Yes, you are on track... You have weeks if not months to go... Turbo Yeast is loaded with excessive chemical nutrients which is a bad thing for potable spirits... Leave the turbos for the fuelies who falsely believe they can save money by producing their own ethanol...

[MidnightBrew]

Haha okay. I'm up to still designs and have decided that a reflux still is most suited for my needs. At least I have my 1/8" tubing for the condenser coil I think I'm going to research yeast nutrients next.

[Ghost]

I think you have the point that was being made. This isnt like most hobbies that you can screw up and at the most have some lost money in it because of the screw up. This is real time and dangerous if you dont know what you are doing - the fact Rad is trying to point you in the right direction to be safe says a lot. Many things can go wrong if you dont know what you are doing - hell many things can go wrong with this process if you do know what you are doing! Rad is only trying to mitigate these things happening to you as most of us here are trying to do. Safety is paramount no matter if its running the still or making a recipe up. Good luck and I know you will have more questions even after you read up, hell you might even have more! But reading and researching are a vaulable tool and you are at the right place to learn! Good luck.

[buckwild1]

I see your pain Rad, been reading almost every new post for weeks.

[lovePitbulls]

I feel like you arent even using enough to even produce anything drinkable? 1L of wash. That seems almost like a waste to me. Im a super noob though so I may be wrong. I feel like the easiest thing to do is to just grab some corn or any grain, sugar, and yeast and go from there. I checked out a ton of recipes on here and most of them are way out of my league still. Id redo your setup, go buy like a 5gallon stainless steel pot, 20ft of 1/2 copper and really re structure your setup. My first run I used 3/8 copper, had a ton of leaks with my setup, and obviously i dumped it all. It was more of a "Can I actually get liquid to come out" type run. I rebuilt everything, and am doing my 2nd one tommorow. I would def make sure you search everything before you ask though, lol. Ive been on different type forums for years now and see people get ripped apart for asking questions that they could have searched for. Anyways, good luck..

[BoomTown]

I agree, 1 gal of mash is all about watching and learning, but not likely to yield a lot of drinking.

But, let that not quell your curiosity, keep asking the questions...some folks do have a short fuse, but what the hey, you don't have to take it personally, just learn what you can from those that offer to teach, and keep on keeping on...

Boom

[BoomTown]

about the 1/8" vrs 3/8" or 1/2" issue...

the smaller the channel you push the vaper through, the faster it travels and/or it creates a back pressure depending on how fast the vapers are forming in the pot.

That create a two-fold problem...one is back pressure blowing out what ever you use as a seal, and second is that you'll be moving the gas through the 1/8" channel so fast it may not totally re-convert to a fluid, and if and when it does create to a fluid, you will have created the potential to 'plug' the exit path, and the end result can be a very dangerous pressure discharge and the worst possible moment.

In other words, it's dangerous.

At least, that's what I think.
Boom