Help for the rookie

[helipilot]

Hi every one. Thanks for taking the time to read and I cant wait for some input and advice.
Ill try and keep this short and sweet

We have tried distilling 4 times now with different recipes but the end product is not good enough for me to even think about drinking it. But Im having so much fun with this and I want to get it right, Im not giving up
ok ok, lets start

5 Gallon batches
full copper still
1/4 inch coil "worm"

1) Our temp has to go up to 96 celcius before we get any drops. all 4 times

2) The alcohol being distilled is cloudy.

3) Can I use champaign yeast ?

4) The first run we got 55% and clear. Is that good. How do you run it a second time to up the proof when all I got out of it was 4 little mason jars? Throw it in with the next bash?

5) I have a hydrometer for the wash but not sure how the whole abv% works. I made the wash and hydrometer says 1, 090 --when im done , should it say 1, 000 or 0,090. or am i talking about SG.

6)I put the alchool meter in the wash and said 3 % should It say 20 %?

I guess ill start with this haha

Anyone willing to share his/her knowledge, please write the number of the corresponding question to your answer to keep this thread clean and organized

[RonH3154]

Based on my reading/research on this site 1/4" worm is too small. The preferred minimum here is 1/2" though they say you can get by with 3/8".

[rad14701]

With as many questions as are being asked here, and wondering how many more there are to come, it's obvious that spending more time researching here in these forums as well as reading the parent site is in order... In cases like this we wonder what else there is that you don't know that could be a major safety concern that we have no way of knowing about so as to help you rectify the situation... For the sake of safety you owe it to yourself to learn the theories and fundamentals, at the very least, before proceeding...

[Jimbo]

Hi every one. Thanks for taking the time to read and I cant wait for some input and advice.
Ill try and keep this short and sweet

We have tried distilling 4 times now with different recipes but the end product is not good enough for me to even think about drinking it. But Im having so much fun with this and I want to get it right, Im not giving up
ok ok, lets start

5 Gallon batches
full copper still
1/4 inch coil "worm"

1) Our temp has to go up to 96 celcius before we get any drops. all 4 times forget about temp, ya it will get pretty hot, and it varies depending on the abv of your wash

2) The alcohol being distilled is cloudy. What are you distilling? how are you making it, what abv. You talk about the still but its the stuff you put in it that makes a good product. Sounds like you might have some foam up, puking, you could be overfilling the still

3) Can I use champaign yeast ? each type of wash has anideal yeast, what are you making

4) The first run we got 55% and clear. Is that good. sounds good, but again, depends on teh ABV of what you put in it How do you run it a second time to up the proof when all I got out of it was 4 little mason jars? Throw it in with the next bash? save it up and rerun, you can partially fill a still too, works fine. I once did 1.2 gallons in a 7,75g still. make sure to water it down to less than 40% so youre not boiling super volatile explosive stuff

5) I have a hydrometer for the wash but not sure how the whole abv% works. I made the wash and hydrometer says 1, 090 --when im done , should it say 1, 000 or 0,090. or am i talking about SG. 1.09 is high, what did it finish at, should finish close to 1. Maybe 1.01 highest

6)I put the alchool meter in the wash and said 3 % should It say 20 %? If you started with a 1.09 ferment, and only got 3% alc out of it, it probably wanst done, see 5 above.

I guess ill start with this haha

Anyone willing to share his/her knowledge, please write the number of the corresponding question to your answer to keep this thread clean and organized

[Jimbo]

And yes, as Rad says. Please read more. Lots more. Too many basic questions.

[DuckofDeath]

alcoholmeters are not for the mash/wash. They will not read correctly. saccharometer is for the wash.

DoD

[noobshine]

yea man nobodys trying to be hard on you but you really shouldn't distill anything else until you've read everything here http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=46 all the stickys from here http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=33 and here http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=15

after that pick a good recipe from here http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=14 aftet that your questions will be better and our answers will be better

[helipilot]

Wow! haha. Thanks for the quick responses

First of all, I do realize the risks. In fact Im pretty paranoid about them. This is just too fun. I DO NOT drink anything I distill.

If anyone would have any suggestions on a good read, please share. Id love to find a book or something.


1) Understood, Now if I was to re-distill a batch with higher abv%, the drops should come down at a lower temp right?

2) Im distilling different mashes. Even tried bananas and brown sugar. only came out at 30 % from the still.( what would that be by the way? fossil, tails or low wines) can I throw that back in? Ill get a bigger worm Can it be too long? mine is 7 ft lol

3) ok, since I make everything, I should probably get a chart. Can you throw too much yeast in?
I made
- malted barley and sugar
- corn sugar
- banana and brown sugar
- malted barley and molasses
- just brown sugar

4) understood

5)I just got the hydrometer so I have no Idea what the past ones were. The brown sugar wash thats fermenting right now read 1.075 and threw in 1 pack of champaign yeast. What SG should it finish at? That should be directly proportionate to abv% ? ... this is the part I dont understand

6) Can I get abv% by putting an alcoholometer in the wash?

7) Is the idea of the whole distilling procedure to bring to high proof and water down? What proof am I looking for ?

Yes , they are amateur questions but thats why Im asking

thanks guys

[rad14701]

Too many questions... Seek and Ye shall find... We don't spoonfeed here... We consider independent research mandatory... Every question you have asked has been answered way too many times already...

Edited to add: This site is your book...

[DuckofDeath]

5) Before you pitch yeast take an initial hydro reading you'll get like 1.070 you can look this up to get your potential alcohol. When you think its done the reading should be 1.000 or less. If it is then you have converted all the sugar and your potential alcohol is what you actually should have in the wash now.

6) Nope you cant. You use the saccharometer at the start of the mash to read he potential alcohol. When you read 1.000 SG then you have that amount in your wash.

[noobshine]

dude look at the post I wrote directly above yours. everything you need to get started is in that reading. you need to learn how to use that malted barley you mentioned. that stuffs expensive and if you don't mash it right you wont get the sugar out of it. alcometer cannot be used in your mash wash only in distilled spirits. hydrometer is used in your mash. one thing you did do right is sg of 1.075 on your wash. that's perfect. now what you want to do is take another hydrometer reading after youre done fermenting. subtract your original final sg from your original sg and multiply that number by 131. so if you start with sg 1.07 and end up with 1.0 then the abv of your wash is 9.17 if your final sg isn't close to 1.00 then somethings wrong with the way youre fermenting and youre not making much alcohol. hence you wont get much out of your still. 5 gal of 9% wash ought to get you a lot more likker than you mentioned earlier. do the reading. don't mash/still anything else yet. now go do your homework son!

[Dnderhead]

what you put in determines what you git out,if you use a 5% wash you mite git 30% out
if you have 7% wash it mite be 40% if its 10% then it mite be 50% .as you progress with the run it will drop off.
use a proven recipe before making something "off the wall"
if its cloudy either the still is to full or running to hard.
yes it can be rerun

[bellybuster]

5 stars for enthusiasm

[Jimbo]

5 stars for enthusiasm

haha.

[helipilot]

thanks everyone

lol, sorry noobshine. I must of replied right after your post.

Ok, I read all night . Some very good info on here. Ive been looking online for this kind of stuff for weeks.

I answered most of my questions but Im still not sure of one...

Why was my product cloudy? even a brownish color on some of the samples.
The wash was a barley and molasses.
not sure what abv% was
distilled at 40 %

It cant be traces of molasses cant it?

[Jimbo]

chances are it foamed up and over into your condensor. We call that puking.

How many gallons is your still, and how many gallons did you put in it?

[noobshine]

yea you may have filled it too high. also you don't mention cleaning runs. we recommend 1 vinegar run and 1 sacrificial run (box wine, sugar wash... or something you don't care to keep) and personally I recommend a water run in between those two. the vinegar run and the water run, do those with no cooling water going to your condenser so that hot vinegar/water vapor is hitting all surface area of your condenser. any sacrificial alcohol runs use coolant water to your condenser cuz you don't want hot alcohol vapor shooting out close to a flame.

[mash rookie]

Cloudy shine is like reading all night and think you have it figured out. But.... there is just one more...?? Keep reading and one day you will wake up and
"get it". It will be perfectly clear.

That being said, nobody likes to hear it. Please understand that there are a hundred guys a month that want to ask the same damn questions that are easliy answered in the parent site or here in the threads.

Welcome aboard. Stay safe.

[helipilot]

Ok, I completely get the new guy thing. Im sure all these question have been answered more then once. I help out on mechanic forums and I always answer the same damn questions haha. But, what you guys are doing is keeping me highly interested. I couldnt wait to come back from work to read some more.

Jimdo 64 asked how big my still is and how much I put in.

I make 5 gallon batches.
the still is just under ten gallons.
My still is tall so it would have to foam up an extra foot or so. It cant foam up that much can it ?

I was actually scared I wasnt putting enough wash in.

Umm, yeah, cleaning runs...haha
heres how it goes real quick.
- rinse still with water and brush
-rinse still with water and vinegar
- rinse again with that powdered stuff used to sanitize
:S Apart from the very first time after making the still, I never cleaned the worm thinking it was only alcohol coming down it. ( go ahead and say it, haha)

Do you really do a vinegar run, a water run and a sacrificial run every time before you distill ? We have a routine going on that we try a new batch every friday... Thats a lot of cleaning.

anyways, Back to reading

thanks everyone

[Truckinbutch]

Back to reading is a wise choice .

[Jimbo]

Jimdo 64 asked how big my still is and how much I put in.

I make 5 gallon batches.
the still is just under ten gallons.
My still is tall so it would have to foam up an extra foot or so. It cant foam up that much can it ?

I was actually scared I wasnt putting enough wash in.

That sounds fine, unless you were running screaming fast and hot?

Ive learned you cant really run too little, if youre using fire externally (Internal elements need to stay immersed) I once ran 1.2 gallon in my 7.75 spirit still. It worked perfect, if anything the extra headspace gave me a little bit of reflux.

[noobshine]

"Do you really do a vinegar run, a water run and a sacrificial run every time before you distill ? We have a routine going on that we try a new batch every friday... Thats a lot of cleaning." no goodness no i'd quit this hobby before I did that. I just mean do that initially when u 1st get your still before you run a keeper. after that you still do a vinegar and water run every so often cuz corrosion will collect inside your worm. i'd still do a good hot water steam run everytime you get a nasty clowdy product. means some gunk is probably in your worm for whatever reason. steam run it until the drops that come out are clear and taste ok.

[rad14701]

Do you really do a vinegar run, a water run and a sacrificial run every time before you distill ? We have a routine going on that we try a new batch every friday... Thats a lot of cleaning.

Only after any modifications requiring soldering or welding... A cleaning run cycle complete with sacrificial run should be done... Most here only rinse after each run and let it go at that...

[Jimbo]

Most here only rinse after each run and let it go at that...

A rinse, and then a high proof cleaning with the next batches fores

[shadylane]

anyways, Back to reading

thanks everyone

Your next questions will be easier to answer. Welcome aboard.

[helipilot]

Ok,
There is so much info out there, some of it contradicting. Im trying to weed threw what advice I should take. I promise
Im doing all I can, reading all I can but some of the material is hidden pretty deep in here. And just remember my first run was only
a month ago... Its a lot to take in.

Heres another few for you guys.

- What kind of water should I use for the mash? Does it matter?
I use distilled 5 gallons from wallmart. ( Im just bringing this up cause I read somewhere not to use distill and somewhere else to use it.)

The Worm
- I use a 3/8 worm. Would a 1/2 be better?

- The worm is cooled in a homedepot pale full of ice. Am I better off with cold water? can the worm actually be too cold ?

I guess thats it for now
Ill be lighting her up this friday and I cant wait to apply all this knowledge. I almost want to get a lab coat, haha.

This is my plan.... in short

First strip run , Ill run it fast just to get some low wines. Then throw it back in the still ( hopefully have around 30 %abv)

Then ill do the spirit run , Ill add (I have about 12 little mason jars ranging from low wines to 55% runs, all different mix and matches.)

With this ill make my cuts.

Does this make any sense ? Am I on the right track?

[MitchyBourbon]

Cooling with ice is not good. We call it shock cooling, and it can cause reverse presure. If you are using a worm and a bucket/flake stand you want the cooling water to gradually go from warm on the top to cool on the bottom of your bucket/flake stand. If you use ice that temp gradiation will be turned upside-down.

helipilot, if I had any money I'd put it on you, but there is a lot of learnin to do.

[noobshine]

i wouldnt use distilled water for your mash/wash. i know i got mixed advice on this too when i started. yeast need minerals just like people. distilled water is good for diluting your final product. just dont use that value brand from walmart. folks say it clowds up their drink. you can use well water if its not loaded up with iron. if you live in a city with decent water you can use tap water. the mashing proscess usually gives the chlorine enough time to evaporate out before pitching your yeast. if you just gotta have store bought water make it spring water for fermenting, and distilled water for diluting final product.

3/8 inch worm is pushing it for your size still. most people here recommend 1/2 inch or greater. i use a 3/8 inch for my 4 gal still and am thinking about upgrading soon. if you're gonna stick with 3/8 make sure its all going down hill, dont let the coils turn up at any point. one good way to do this is get a 6 inch pvc pipe wrap your worm around it with 1.5-2 inches between coils then fix them in place by drilling holes in your pvc and tying it through with twisty ties. also i read in one of your previous paragraphs that your worm is 7 ft. thats not nearly long enough for your size still

[cornsqueezer]

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=46

You need to stop!!!!!! This is not a race!!!!! Please read the above at least three and yes three times then proceed, you are asking too many questions

that have been already answered a zillion times it's a safety thing I wouldn't want you or your buddy to get hurt!!!!

and after you've read it three times go back and reread your post and you will see why everyone is telling you to slow down and read, read, read!!!!

not trying to be an ass just want you to do it safe.

[helipilot]

I learned a very valuable lesson today. " When you start thinking you get it... You realize just how much you have no Idea what you're doing "
Haha, ughh. Its a good thing Im a pretty persistent guy.

My Sugar wash is going nuts. You can see the stuff swirling and the airlock going strong. I thought id take a quick peak at the SG and to my surprise it hasnt budged a bit. Still sits exactly at 75, where it started. Its been a week now. The wash is in my closet in the dark at 20 celcius.

question!
Does the mash's SG slowly and continuously go down or does it drop faster in the last few days of fermentation?

Funny story.
Made some mash tonight and..
I dont know why i thought I could just throw crushed malted corn in a pot with 5 gallons of water and cook it for an hour at 173 but it left me scrounging threw
cupboards for anything sugary I could find. molasses, brown sugar, white sugar, corn sirup even Icing haha. The SG with just the corn was a big fat zero

Love it